Every month some one makes a thread like this and we take sides and explain why. The only reason I bothered to post in this one was because U.S. presidents were mentioned lol. The Enclave like their technology so much they elected a computer to be their president, well that's devotion for ya.

Haha, that's a funny way to describe slaughtering hundreds of innocent civilians, because they didn't have the luck to get into a vault. Which is technically the Enclave's fault anyway, considering the Enclave made the vault's, so it was there decision whether or not to make room for more people. So their murdering people, because they were too lazy to either, create more vaults, or allow extra population into some of the vaults.

Basically; Murder + Innocent Civilian = Naughty Naughty.

By the way some of you Pro-Enclavists are preaching, it sounds like you'd think it's all right and good, if someone walked outside, shot a man in the face, and when he was arrested, said to the officer, "He had radiation in his system, so it's not like it's illegal, or unethical or anything".

To the OP, the Enclave are not completely evil, their goal is very just, and is what all of the wasteland would want, but there means of achieving these goals are horrific.

No no, its fine, because at the end, we'll all be living under totalitarian government.

I thought about it and I wouldnt want radioactive people near me either if I was clean. At the very least all people with radiation should be rounded up and shipped to Australia.

Lol.

No, all wastelanders are "impure" by the Enclave's standards.

Oi!

No one has challenged my post yet. Here it is again:

Since the whole idea of the world existing exactly like it does in the Fallout series is ludicrous, then the Enclave wouldn't exist if this was real life. You can't bring the Enclave into real life, as they are just part of the imaginations of Black Isle Studios, and now, Bethesda. They didn't win in the game, so they couldn't win in real life if they existed. The Chosen One would still have destroyed them. You mean they would have won if The Chosen One didn't exist in the same world as the Enclave, but he/she did, and he/she did destroy the Enclave. Now, the Lone Wanderer destroyed the Enclave. They lost and haven't achieved anything other than the state the world is in in the Fallout universe and the killing of their fellow humans. They have lost, and there is no chance that they would have won because they were meant to be the evil antagonists who would lose from the very beginning. To try to change lore is ridiculous and to insist that they would win in real life is ridiculous as well. They couldn't even exist in real life, and if they did like they do in Fallout, the Chosen One and the Lone Wanderer would still have finished them off. The only thing that didn't make sense was the Enclave coming back from the dead in the first place. The Enclave lost and achieved nothing beneficial. Mods and the imaginations of Enclave supporters will never change that.

The significance of the United States Constitution is it was the first WRITTEN document that balanced the power of the government and the freedoms of the people. Aside from the Magna Carta, but it wasn't nearly as detailed.

Just to... you know.. clear up a day old question.

Perhaps Seti, noone challenged your post because they ignored it. You say the same things every week in every Enclave/BoS thread that is made. No more evidence can be brought forth on either side until another game is made and they give us more to work with. It's pointless to argue any further. We just end up going around in circles. You think they are evil. Fine, we get that. Bethesda could release a statement tomorrow that the Enclave are the good guys and you'd switch sides in a flash.

No, then I would think Bethesda messed up lore. I posted that post to combat the "Enclave is more capable and therefore can do what they want" defense.

So now they're not allowed to change their own lore? Is it not their game? They can change lore as they wish. I can't change it, you can't change it. Bethesda can do whatever the heck they want with it. They can make it all a dream, they can have Godzilla eat the BoS. They can flush the series down the toilet and never make another game. It's up to them.

It's up to them, and I would accept it, but to change the view of the Enclave around completely doesn't make much sense and it would leave me confused. Currently in lore, the Enclave are evil, but many fans don't accept that. I accept whatever Bethesda makes canon, but I would still be confused about such a drastic change. If only Enclave supporters could accept the current truth about the Enclave, but they don't, while I accept what Bethesda says is canon.

If beth stated enclave are good guys tomorrow they would have to support it, good luck with that. There might be some good enclave members that could one day take over leadership and change the enclave as a whole from then on, like lyons did with bos. Untill then im going to take what the game and lore says about them and base my opinion.

I suppose it's futile to ask if we can all just respectfully agree to disagree, and go our separate ways without dredging up the inevitable Nazi anologies and/or anolyzing everything to hell and gone- again.


....

Hug? .3.

WHat are you affaid of the truth? Nazis and enclave in same sentance oooh no to the gutter we go. Like you said its inevitable. Enclave lovers seem to be bothered by comparing the two.

I'll drink to that. Hell, I drink to anything nowa days...
*Slams down Chocolate Milk*

No, I'm just very... very... VERY tired of it. Godwin's law, and all that, and also the memory of threads that went on for pages and pages, starting out as intelligent debate but winding up as nothing more than glorified mud-slinging bouts, with both sides ready to snap each others' heads off.
I am of the radical and horrifying opinion that people can have an opinion without being a.) deluded morons or b.) holier-than-thou preachers.
I am also possessed of the even more radical opinion that the above can disagree and still be friends. Or if not friends, than at least civil.

...Or are you just afraid of hugging Enclave scum?
I even went and took a shower, and everything. :0



....Mmmmm. Chocolate milk.
NO.
FOCUS.

I voted kinda due to their extreme view and reaction of genetic mutations. Other then that i think they could be a great focused force for good if things were handled differently. They have the resources the know how and the strategic thinking to make a difference. Those capable of the greatest good are also capable of the greatest evil.

Godwin law, It states: "As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches 1.

Buckwheats law, It states: That people defending the evil for a greater good are still evil.

People writing up pages in philosophical ethical what ever trying to give excuses and reasons to do evil. The more I read it, it boggles the mind when people actually think they have a foot to stand on when they try to defend the enclave. It's a freaking game THEY ARE BAD, why do we keep discussing it?

This is like asking if the Sith are evil. No matter what you personally think about the Enclave they are written to be an antagonistic group. You can try to apply some philosophy to their goals and methods, but Fallout isn't meant to be taken that seriously.

They make bad choices but at the same time they can be good. They should've been a joinable, neutral faction in the game. Do I care that they're evil? Hell no, I'm always evil.

Then by your own question Why are you here? To orate your argument on why the Enclave are evil, obviously.

Do you have evidence that the soldiers don't know who President Eden really is? He said himself they follow his orders, yet like all humans have free will. It sounded to me like they know. And what are you talking about? The colonel DOES oppose Eden's plan. Have you spoken to Eden?

Oh, I don't know. I guess it's just how the Enclave soldiers take radiated and mutated Wastelanders, kill them, throw them in huge piles, and set them on fire.