Yes, I don't see *why* the words fun and realism have to be mutually exclusive.

You can't just throw the logic outta the window, some consistency is needed(and no, west, consitency does not mean rigid realism, look it up).

Enclave FTFW.

The most I will tolerate is maybe a village/settelment where the enclave refugees fled and started it, the old one's had kids and there is now a new generation. But these guys don't care if someone is pure or not they just want to survive. Ofcourse they have power armor, weapons, doctors and maybe even ONE vetibird but they dare not venture out of there lands sense they are afraid to make the NCR aware of there presence not unlike mojave brotherhood.

In other word's: The enclave as a superpower is dead, now only a few hundred is alive if even that.

At level 3, I can kill a NCR soldier with a cleaver. I can't see myself pulling off this on an Enclave soldier.

So what if the chosen one kick the Enclave butt? I bet if the chosen one joined the Enclave, he would of done the same thing.

I'm talking about the Enclaves vs the FONV factions without the player interfering with the battles. I mean at level 30, we can wipe out a whole country.

This is Fallout. Fallout has canon. If you just want to shoot american government forces, you should check out COD multiplayer.

Ok i must be a god because i play on very hard with ol painless and can kill hellfire troops fairly easy.

Yes there is. If you pay attention to Fallout 2. Fallout 2 tells us there is only the Rig and Navarro. The entire Enclave command was on the rig. The Rig went Boom!.

Fallout 3 tells us that Enclave from Navarro came to DC. There were no Enclave in the East till Fallout 3.

New Vegas tells us that, Navarro fell to NCR. Some stayed to fight. Others gave up and tried to start a new in NCR only to be hunted by them and the Brotherhood. So that means only some went to DC.

Enclave were to powerful in Fallout 3 due to the http://www.break.com/usercontent/2009/7/michael-bay-explosions-821047 The Enclave in Fallout 3 cause very big plot holes.

Canon wise the Enclave are gone in the West and were destroyed twice in Fallout 3. The only enclave place left is outside Chicago. An outpost/relay station. They are remnants now. There arn't a 100,000 just over the next hill.

Enclave are gone: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vHGRcdq0x9A, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TIh0jizPP6c http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=khv6Pa7Ph00.

Enclave Soliders were super easy to kill. Imagine if FO3 had New Vegas's DT system. Then they might've been a challenge.

Yep Fallout 3 needed Damage Thresold. If they had Advance PA and Advanced PA MKII as well they would have been great.

Enclave in Fallout 2 are not people you would want to go up against with a baseball bat or a pistol :fallout:

ok that is not a regular 25 max damage fo3 hunting rifle im not talking about 1 im talking about the check points. im not saying i die all the time from them but i at least got hurt. fonv legion cant even hurt u enless u want them too besides the few situations i mentioned in above posts. if the player was not in fo3 enclave would have won they beat bos and outcasts almost anytime they saw each other. in fonv ranger vets would destroy legion vets and out in the wastes ncr patrols beat legion patrols more often than not. I swear this is my last post on this matter. fo3 Enclave check points hurt me killed me or killed my followers fonv legion patrols or even nelson dont even hurt me. i barley get wounded at the fort untill i go in ceasers tent. last time i did the fort boone even lived. they r b

Bull. The Enclave is laughable in Fallout 3. I could kill them all with a 10mm pistol, which only does around 12 damage.

Indeed, there is Broken Steel related glitch where they sometimes spawn at future Enclave checkpoints before the Waters of Life, they can be killed at [censored] level 2!

John Henry Eden would be ashamed of your run-on sentences.

I can't see the screen from a giant palm in my face.You can't just say ohh we should fight the enclave again.Why?.Ohh coz it's fun why don't we all just have light sabers while fighting Jesus in a black hole made of chuck norris.It needs to abide by what previous games have done like say having the enclave sent to there grave twice.

Not really, Enclave are gone.

My thoughts exactly, I assume people like them soley because of the awesome weapons.

Yes, but alot of people are in denial about the Enclave being dead.

This confuses me, alot of people keep mentioning how the Enclave are more like Nazi's etc but so are the NCR. In fact more so the NCR because they've managed to [censored] a whole load of people into believing in them. Disagree with their ways, get in their way or own anything that they want and they will find a reason to declare war on you.

Personally I loved the Enclave. I wouldn't join them, I just like fighting them. A better enemy, better story, better look, weapons, training, bases. I don't think they should have killed them off. They were formidable, more so than the NCR or Ceasor's legion. They come and take what they want then disappear whereas the NCR just capture what they can to enslave people and make money from doing a whole load of nothing. Just bullies with badges really. I despised the NCR and got sick of them in the game to be honest.

Why would I want to shoot American Government Forces....That game is terrible anyways. Plus, guys, I was just stating my opinion do not have to get so defensive....

Ummm....that would be awesome to fight jesus with a light saber in a black hole made of Chuck Norris....who would not want to do that? And my comment is called an OPINION!!!

:facepalm: Of course, there is nothing salvagable, at all, about anything the Enclave believe in; they are a essentially a fascist Nazi party who want to kill everyone because they have an OCD about all gene structures being similar (and for no other, equally practical reasons of course) and then establish a totalitarian dictatorship because that's what evil organisations do right?

It's the weapons people like, of course, nothing makes me want to sign my soul over to such undenyable evil entitiy than if they look L33T enough.

I don't feel that my post was defensive. I was merely explaining why we're serious about enclave presence, and why "i wanna have fun" is not reason enough to bring them back.

This.

Not sticking up for fo3 here, not sure if it was the op, but he said before lone wanderer courier intervention, in some word or another, n then everyone says well liberty prime is dead and gone, DC loses, because of House' robots.... But wthout lone wanderer and courier, Prime wouldn't get destroyed, and House wouldn't unlock his bunker, incase you haven't noticed, he'd a crippled mummy, trapped in a fridge, hiding behing his computer... So I think DC stands a better chance. All in all.

Well technically it''s been confirmed that they were small and limited to their bases in America. So your wrong.

And anyway's where would tehy stay. The world was basically in a global conflict, no one was friends with anybody.

Also they would all die from the FEV because the Rig was the only place where the immunization could be produced.

And why would they send people far away where they can't communicate with them to do things that don't have to do with their master plan?

So really your wrong.