I would add to the conversation, but this is all that needs to be said.

Yes, Broken Steel was so nice that it denied the Enclave ending.

So... Considering Bethesda took away the ending for those who whined hard enough with Fallout 3 (Broken Steel), does anyone think the reverse could be true? You know, give an ending to the game as a choice? Preferably it would be one that I don't have to pay $15 to get what I think to be a complete game...

@BrotherGrimm, my main issue with Broken Steel in Fallout 3 was the fact that the game had an ending. A horribly written ending, but one that I could accept because it had some finality to it. Broken Steel just kinda removed those consequences. PC magically alive, choices didn't really matter, etc. The story was just so.. meh because of it. Although what you also said definitely plays a large factor for me (I can't speak for others, and you shouldn't take me as a representative of others either).

You can't just flat out say the ending will svck because it lets you continue playing. We know very little about the story of this game, sure there have been some bad examples in the past however that doesn't mean that it will be like that in this game. My advice is wait till after it launches watch some youtube videos if you don't mind spoilers then determine whether the story is meh or not before buying.

If Fallout 4 could have a choice at the end and we get to see that play out while also continuing to explore to our hearts content. Now that would be a Dream come too.

Assuming of course that the choice is meaningful instead of black and white.

good. level cap is the biggest joke in Beth games. for a game you can easily spend 300 hours playing, it just kills me that you get stuck at level 30 after 50 hours. And the mods are very confusing for extending the level cap. Level cap it, but steadily decrease the benefits of gaining a level. so at level 100, you don't get all that much. maybe past level 50 it takes 3 levels to get a single perk,etc.

A Perk Limit, I'd be down with that.

Black and White morality can have very meaningful choices, ranging from saving the world, to utterly destroying it.

On the other hand, many grey morality games lack meaningful choices, since they can end up being nothing more then slightly different variants of the same thing.

Morality has nothing to do with how meaningful an ending is

Pssh. What a bore. As expected, but bore.

Thejedio, I never said that it "would" be a guff "ending", I said that MOST (not all) open ended cRPG's have had guff endings to their main questlines, however while the chances are that the "end" of the main questline will be insipid, I'm hoping that won't be the case, but am prepared to be disappointed if it is.

Really pleased to hear this, especially the "play after the credits roll" bit. Hopefully this signals that Beth will go for a micro focused story instead of a macro one; a story that's personal and revolves around the PC's family instead of another "save the wasteland and completely change the landscape".

As many have pointed out, its impossible to do macro level consequences justice; there's just no way Beth can accurately implement all the consequences of, say, the Enclave being destroyed. However, something much more focused that the whole wasteland wouldn't know about (say, the protagonist convincing his kid to turn away from a life at the Institute) would be much more doable and a refreshing change of pace from the whole "Lead faction X to victory in what should be a massive battle but isn't because our engine can't render hundreds of troops!"

Not exactly hard to do given that they basically didn't exist in the wasteland until the MQ started, in both Fo2 and Fo3.

Destroying them would only result in everything going back the way it was before they showed up, except minus a few stragglers in remote posting still being around.

It would be no more difficult to do then showing the results of what slaying the Emperor would do to Skyrim, which is too say logically nothing at all.

I agree, the aftermatch was decent, much more effects than in Morrowind or Oblivion, note that in Skyrim where would no other world changes than fame for you.

Same in any other save the world, city or situation plot who is the obvious to use if the game continues, you might get results of the fighting but nothing else.

And the Fallout 3 ending was bad in that it was no reason for the player to die in many settings.

An player went on an adventure to Europe would been an happy ending.

An heroic one you die holding an position against hordes of enemies, think 300 but ending in an nuclear explosion. And yes you volunteer as sacrificial rear guard as you was the best warrior.

Yes everybody give you lots of cool stuff to help you. Some followers will offer to help you, you can accept or refuse and send them to safety.

the benefits of such a open system, you can just decide when that "loophole" is.

Well I don't actually stop because I've hit the caps, it just so happens I've run out of things I want to do with that character at about the same time, and level 40-45 is more than enough to do any quests in the game.

Don't confuse end game with meta game.

I'm pretty happy that it won't have an ending to the game even after I finish the main quest even though I don't really mind that it might end. But after I complete the main quest I start playing around in the world. Settling down, collecting rare items like certain toys or harmonicas, jewels and building a wardrobe for my character. Just playing it sort of like a SIMS at that point. Something to spend a bit of time relaxing in the world.

Yes, it's not much of a game at that point but I do enjoy it.

Oh ye of little faith!

Let's assume you can spend a perk point on your SPECIAL to increase it by one, and you can do this to max out your SPECIAL. If that's how it works, then it would take 42 levels (without taking any other perk) to max out all your SPECIAL. And then another 275 levels to take every rank of every perk. So I feel like the whole MOAT thing is a moot point; especially since you won't be going through the entire game as a level 300 god, but as a developing character.

As for the open ending, Bethesda wrote the plot with this in mind from the start. With Broken Steel, they threw in an open ending for a plot that wasn't really designed for it. I thought the way Fallout 3's main quest affected the game world (with the Enclave presence halfway through, and then everything with Broken Steel) was a really cool way to make it feel significant; if Bethesda can do that with player choices, then it will work for Fallout 4's plot.

And, as has been said, a personal plot is a really good way to write for an open-world and still keep it compelling.

DING! DING! DING! WE HAVE A WINNAH!!

Given that the game is supposed to provide over 400 hours of gameplay, and the potential to take over 300 level ups to max everything out, I am seeing no issues with this.

this is all fine and dandy, but I'm hoping that, since there is no end, if we do something by the end of the story that changes the lives of most/every person in the wasteland, that we get recognition for our actions, good or bad.

I'd prefer a cap, well maybe not a cap, but I'm hoping for something more restrictive than the legendary system.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, I'd really like a system that at least makes an attempt to deliver consequences for the build choices I make.

So it's essentially the everythingman's adventures in the never ending story, again.

yay, one less issue from NV that ruined the game for me.


This. Slideshows do not make for a better ending. I'd rather have the choice to not load up a save after finishing the MQ or have the choice to keep going. I dont always want to do the MQ last. As well as I want to play my end game character after all that stuff.

I assume said restriction will come in the form of rapid increase in exp requirement after a soft cap is reached, which would discourage those not dedicated to the idea of trying to max themselves, so in the end there will be consequences.

People are kidding yourselves if you think were going to be forced into fully perked characters. As far as not wanting to play after the main quest, simple fix there. Delete the file when your done. Thank you Bethesda for not forcing everyone to be done with the game once the story is done
I for one am going to still have a settlement to run once the story is finished.