Im playing F:NV on hardest difficulty hardcoe mode. Im level 15 and just started using energy weapons and OMG OMG. They weigh insanely heavy. Energy Cells weigh 0.08 per unit. If you have Pew Pew, you will use 15 cells per shot, and man its insane. You use 1.2lbs PER SHOT. Its the heaviest ammunition using gun behind missile launcher. What the hell man? I can stop using pew pew no problem, but the ammunition is still damn heavy. What the hell do characters who are using energy guns skill and not guns skill going to do? Does Obsidian/bethesda have any idea how insane this is.

Take Microfusion cells. 0.1 per unit. If you are going to be using laser rifle (average weapon, nothing special), you will use up 1lb for 10 shots. Its heavier than 45 Govt. and weapons which use that ammunition are badass. Gauss rifle is going to use 0.5 per shot. Yes thats right, you get 2 shots per 1lb, heavier than AMR ammo, though both are meant to be variants of Guns skill and Energy weapons skill users. Still, whats the point of this skill when i cant even use a laser rifle in the game. So if you are going to play in hardcoe mode, forget energy weapons and missile launchers and grenade launchers.

(Please dont tell me to turn off hardcoe mode, i love it otherwise)

I suggest bringing Energy Ammo more in line with Guns ammo weight.

Microfusion Cells : 0.06
Energy Cells : 0.045
Electrong Charge Pack : 0.018

I hope Obsidian/bethesda can bring make energy weapons ammo more viable in the next patch or along with the next dlc. It is extremely impractical to use them right now.

I agree, considering when a plasma rifle reloads, it's technically putting in just 1 MFC

they should change the name to Micro Fusion Charge, Small Energy Charge, & Electron Charge, or something along that nature. So instead of carrying 200 actual cells, it would be like you are carrying 200 units of energy in whatever amount of cells that would be

With MFCs, it makes sense. They're little fusion batteries. >.> We're talking heavy, radioactive metals, lead lining to keep said radioactivty from coming out, so on. In Fallout 1 and 2, energy weapon ammo was insanely heavy, too. If you didn't use energy weapons, you kept that stuff on the market or stuffed in your companions' pockets.

I know they were heavy in fallout 1 and 2 but thats not really a justification. What if you have a build that uses energy weapons skill as the only fighting skill? Besides look at the damage output of laser pistols, its not massive. I seriously dont think that reducing the weight of energy weapons ammo will break the game in any way.

I dont use any companions as im a stealth based class, companions just kill the fun in being stealth. I think the developers should seriously consider doing something about it.

MFC cells are like little D cell Batteries....dont know if you have any guns IRL or if you have handled them...but if you do or have...hold 1 bullet perhaps a 9mm and hold a D cell battery....i agree they are heavy but i think they should be...IDK i actually enjoy actually being forced to plan my load out of supplies before i head out into the wastes...i dont wanna be able to carry 9000 rounds from each gun.

ammo weight is the sole reason i give up on every EW character i've tried.

Trust me, if you played Fallout 1 and 2, you'd never complain about New Vegas's Microfusion Cell's weight again :laugh:

I suggest using Pack Rat so you can carry twice as much ammo for the weight

Guys, realism isnt the key point here. There are alot of unrealistic things about fallout, but they are there to make the game playable. If any of you actually tried playing with an Energy based character you would understand how big an issue it is.

And dont tell me how i can carry more, i know about pack rat and strong back and companions and all that stuff.

I know how microfusion cells are radioactive and all, how their batteries look much larger than normal ammo. But thats not the point.

Its really sad and shocking that the developers have tried to do nothing about energy weapons weight. Its alot worse for guys who go explosives. Try using a missile launcher. Each missile weighs 3lb. You cant even think about using machine grenade launcher in hardcoe mode. Yes its realistic, but it also breaks the game. Realism is an important part of the game, thats the reason i am playing hardcoe mode in the first place. But gameplay shouldnt be compromised for the sake of realism.

You're the one who wants to be hardcoe.

The weight is not too bad. Just don't walk around with 100's of cells! I have had no problem in hardcoe.

Did play an Energy Weapons character; really no change. All you really have to do is have carry management. How much ammo do you think you need before taking a pit stop at your safehouse? Often times, all I need is about 1500~ MFC cells total, a mixture of standard and Max Charge, and 1500 EC Max Charge Cells, and I'm set for quite a while. Of course, I have melee as a secondary weapon choice but it's only used in interiors usually.

Played an explosives character also; really no change. Same concept comes into mind. If 25mm grenades and several hand grenades are all you got, that's all you need really. Grenade Machinegun uses 25mm's, which are affected by Pack Rat. Missiles I use for the heck of it sometimes but tend to have a secondary weapon just in case.

Not saying how you're playing is entirely wrong, I can understand the frustration of not being able to carry more ammo, but at the end of the day, it works. If you include patch 1.3's stats, carrying those explosives are going to be more effective so it's an exchange of weight for damage. I can say the same for EW characters with ammo eaters being knocked down like the Pew Pew or Tesla Cannon.

I've played an EW class before. >.> And like weight management for my guns-using characters, I tend to only carry five or six 'magazines' for each of my guns. Less for the secondary, more for the primary. It's all about taking only what you need. And trust me, you do not need to be carrying a few hundred MFCs around, usually. On my current guns character, I carry 66 .357 Magnum JFP rounds, and only 88 .308 JSP rounds for This Machine. It does me fine unless I start spraying ammo.

Basically, in hardcoe mode, you need to learn how to pack for a trip, like a soldier would.

This

Yeah, you are carrying 150lbs of MFCs add to that 38lbs of EC. Real pro.

Divide that by 2 thanks to Pack Rat. I like to stock up before a journey as the carry weight eventually goes down from combat.

What I do works for me; it just doesn't for you it seems.

From what I can tell, even though you seem to know what Pack Rat does, you're clearly underestimating its ability.

It would a pretty dumb soldier who didn't carry more ammo than he thought he would need.

There's a difference between 'carrying more than thought needed' and 'carrying a shipping container of ammo in your pocket'. Like I said, I usually plan to carry only four or five magazines for my guns, and still usually end up carrying six to eight, as my loadout on last game mentioned.

That's why you get two companions to divide the weight between you all.

Breaks the game? No...just means you have to go back to grab more ammo a little more often and/or carry a little less other stuff. And perhaps Pack Rat, as mentioned.

Quoted for truth

MFC's back in the day were HUGE

from the Vault Wiki

weight: 5 pound

of course that being said I dont Like the way Fo3 and NV do ammo for Energy weapons. a MFC in fallout was supposed to last about 50 shots. none of this 1 shot per MFC crap

Well, true. Back in the original FOs, ammo was weight-divided by 'blocks'. A full magazine for the Colt 10mm Pistol (12 rounds) had a weight value to it, as did a Hunting Rifle's 10-round magazine of .223.

You got THAT right. :biggrin:

Playing hardcoe I quickly discovered that it becomes very important to limit how much ammunition you carry regardless of your chosen weapons. Sure, it was fun in FO3 to be able to carry over 60K rounds for Vengeance, but I never used more than a couple of thousand before acquiring so much loot I had to go back to base to drop more stuff off. Since I was there I could restock anyway, so I ended up dumping most of my ammo in a locker rather than carrying all of it all the time as there was no point.

Looking at the fairly low ammo weights in F:NV I figured I could still carry around several hundred of each type I was using, however it added up a lot faster than I expected once I started lugging around the larger calibers/stronger cells. I eventually decided to check my WGT both before and after dumping off all my ammo, and I was a bit surprised to see I had been lugging around over 125WGT in ammo for only 4 weapons. Now, this did include a few missiles and about 3 or 4 mini-nukes I'd found, but without those I still had about 90WGT of small-arms ammo on hand. As a result, I decided I would carry enough ammo for a total of 6 full loads per weapon (this includes the ones already in the weapon), divided per sub-type where appropriate (such as 3 clips each HP and AP).

Now, 'vanilla' Energy Weapons did have some rather egregious ammo consumption rates compared to their (approximate) Guns counterparts, so I can see the OP's complaint from that point of view since if I carried, say, 48 rounds of .50Match for the AMR I had to carry 240 for the Gauss Rifle, as it used 5 cells per shot, to maintain usage parity. My game is modded such that this is no longer an issue, but for those on consoles I can see where long-term EW use could be annoying considering how much more ammo per shot you need to carry around in a lot of cases.

Still, the best thing the OP could do would be to drop the vast majority of his ammo at his chosen base and carry a small number of clips for each weapon, as this alone will shave off a huge amount of WGT that is currently tied up in ammo supplies. This is assuming the OP visits said base frequently, since upon each visit he can refill to the chosen limit from the stocks on hand. If the OP does not visit said base frequently this still works, he'll just end up either rotating weapons more frequently or giving a second thought to whether or not it's worth plugging that Molerat with a clip of .50s.

Make more trips to safehouse, manage your inventory. Nothing a person wouldnt think of when hes having weight problems.

But none of you pointed out what would be the downside of reducing the EW ammo weight. Either the developers should bring it in-line with Fallout 1 & 2, where 1 MFC could fire several shots, or reduce the weight of the cells.

well 50 points of MFC ammo used by a PC now weighs in at 5 pounds....sooo bascialy nothing has changed since fallout 1