Both genres still make [censored] up.

Wrong, that is what large amount of trees looks like: http://earthjustice.org/sites/default/files/styles/image_800x600/public/mistyfjords_LeePrince_shutterstock.jpg?itok=loHbCvc1, now compare it to your screens.

Wrong again, it may sound like techno babble to you, but it is actually possible. Like how you know that ghouls are impossible? There are billions of people on earth and mutations can be unpredictable, so out of all those people, some may actually survive in some form.

Science Fiction takes those, extremely unlikely but still posible things and build a story around them.

Which is the same thing as in the game.....

WHAT? No really.... what? Ghouls ARE 100% impossible, it just CAN'T happen. Exposure to that much radiation simply kills you, period. You are completely making up a meretricious set of prerequisites for scifi. and no, science fiction can take things, even things we know to be 100% impossible, and makes up science reason as to why they are possible in that universe.

u are wrong, Science Fiction take sciences facts and make it fantasy but with a sciences explanation, a good exm of it Frankestain, u cant revive someone with lighitng but is science that tell that life cant happen w/o it

All the more reason to assume that it's not just radiation that does it ~in Fallout

I always liked the original concept where the nuclear winds were a mixture of FEV and radiation.

I like the concept that it was a fluke of the war, and has never happened since.

*As in no cause particularly nailed down [defined], and nothing to point at.

it is state that is radiation, u can hear from the ghouls at DC how they saw the bombs hit and how the sky turn fire, and after a while they start changing, and how the ghoul doctor there is trying to "rever" it, but it cant.

moira on Megaton can disagree with that. remember the quest.

No I don't.

Not in Fallout; just FO3. In Fallout 1 & Fallout 2, Ghouls were each and every one from Vault 12, where the event that spawned the ghouls took place.

the quest was the one blowing the Atomic bomb on Megaton and the only surv was Moria and she was a Ghoul

and on Fallout 1 and 2 is state on the vaults log when u read it, that the vault was make that way, so radiation filter inside, it was one of the sick experiments. And that why ppl from Vault 12 become ghouls. The only other ghoul that wasnt creat from radiation was harold but i dont know if is correct to call him a Ghoul bc he have the tree on his head forever. he is more mutant that ghoul

Not really, given that Fallout is partially based on scifi b-movies, which often showed massive amounts of radiation causing weird mutations like ghouls.

Fallout was never based on fact or real science, but on scifi b-movie cliches, and the 50's perception of the future, and atomic war. I don't see why there needs to be something beyond radiation, when the entire foundation of the series is based on "yeah radiation CAN do this because these movies!"

Even Tim Cain used that very same argument to justify ghouls being only radiation based.

Just because it was crippled does not make Radiation the only ~or even an operative agent of the change.

You are telling this to me?

*I can say 'not really' too, and say that there was more than just fear of radiation in b-movies ~or https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dgq2b17QMzE.

modern games are 1000 times better than old 90s games, for their time fallout 1 and 2 were awesome, but i wouldn't want to go back to the old days of gaming and old style rpgs, they were a bit tedious compared to now and really don't have the immersion compared to todays game, i think you're just being nostalgic and looking back at old times, but when you really compare side by side todays games with 90s rpgs, there's no comparison. F3 and the now FO4 really make fallout 1 and 2 look like childs play, nostalgia is a funny thing.

actually i think there is a explanation about relation bettewn ghouls and radiation on the Fallout bible, i really dont remember but i should go look for it

Given that the guys who created the lore aren't consistent about the creation of ghouls its hardly surprising that it doesn't make a lot of sense.

true. so much true. AND in the end since for good or worst Fallout lore universe and whole are now propertie of Beths what ever they say is true from now on. If u dont like it u cant do much about it.

Look what Disney did to SW universe.

For me i like where fallout have gone since Bethesda took it over, it maybe not be the same as it use to be, but for some reason maybe bc im older i cant play games like Fallout 1 or 2 anymore i tent to get bored just looking a little map and traveling by a dot. It happen to me while i was playing Westland 2, and wondering how all that picture map actually look like, if it was actually made 3D

The OP says there is less sense of danger because you don't feel like you are in the middle of nowhere.

I think part of why F3, NV, and F4 don't make you feel like you are in the middle of nowhere is that it would turn too many people off. They probably want people to feel excited rather than lost or not knowing what to do. I like feeling lost, but that's just me.

One point about making the player feel small in a big world: When I left the vault for the first time in F3, I immediately knew where I was because of the landmarks you can see on the horizon. I wish they had left the reveal of downdown DC until a bit later in the game...just my opinion.

bout u are comparing Fallout 1 or 2 set in a WHOLE region and Fallout 3 or NV or F4 that they focus on a City and the sorounding area. is Hard to get lost on a small rigion like it, and really there isnt much sence of been lose when what u have is a picture as map to move.

The original devs could scarcely work out how the world was supposed to work, even when they weren't cramming Monty Python and Elmer Fudd references in as if the game was a hyperactive Family Guy episode. I'd hardly expect Bethesda to wade through that mess for Fallout when they hardly give a damn about consistency in the IP they created.

Eh, it's probably more Science Fantasy, since it's based on the hand-wavy "radiation is magic" 50's B-movie kind of thing. Plus wacky aliens, strange mutations, Lovecraftian whispering monuments, etc. (Giant insects don't work in real science, for instance.)

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Anyway, "wasteland" =/= "desert". The Mojave, that's a desert. Big chunks of California & Nevada are desert & certainly would revert back that way without irrigation. Densely-developed city & suburban Northeast US? Not a desert. Even if you nuke it. It's still a semi-mountainous / hills / plains region. Sure, the temperate climate would be effected in some way by all the nukes, but there's more to being a desert than a lack of water.

why u said that Dishonor was incrible.

Of course it's dense....

If all locations were spaced out like Fallout 1/2 it would be fun for about.... 5 seconds.

I meant TES, I don't know or care about Dishonored.