Because they make games. They aren't a fanservice machine. They implement what they think works, and if you don't like it then let's hope you have a PC so you can use mods. From the statement I bolded it is obvious you have NO idea how hard it is to make games. It isn't some kind of document wizard that says "Would you like to make an FPS or RPG today? Ok, you selected RPG, now choose the name and what weapons you want." It takes years of practice to make even a simple weapon look good. Animations are even harder.

Luckily I have.




It's true, it's probably much harder than I think, but still I think spears are a must in this world and they have redone the animations anyway, so they should have added this one too.

Like I've said a thousand times: "the more the better". And in this case the more weapons the better. No matter what weapons is included it will be welcomed (atleast by me). The players need to have a large variety of choices to optimize the gamingexperience. I just hope Bethesda will understand this.

You forgot blunts...

I highly doubt we'll see flails in Skyrim, considering that they'd be rather difficult to do, or whips, for that matter, one would either need to simulate the physics for the chain, or create enough animations for it to be convincing, and either of them would probably be difficult, having it actually have physics could be great if done well, but there's also a risk of very wonky behavior, animations would be simpler, but then Bethesda needs to create some fairly detailed animations just for flails, and I don't see that happening. In the end, if we won't see something as simple as a spear, I highly doubt we'll ever see flails. And frankly, I wouldn't WANT flails if we can't even have spears anyway, spears are a pretty basic weapon, on the other hand, flails are the kind of thing which really should be saved until after you've covered the basics, like spears, swords and axes.

No, for TES VI they'll probably cut another weapon type.

I doubt flails would be as hard to implement as whips, due to the weight on the end and shorter length. What they need to do is ensure the weapons are affected by physics.

Our physics engines have had six years to advance since Oblivion came out, and even Oblivion had swinging chain weapons (in the case of the Spiked Ball-on-a-chain Trap). What they need to do is stick a miniaturized one on the end of a stick, and let the player be able to swing it. Giving wielded weapons physics would solve the problem

The issue with spears is it requires a completely different animation set, making them the more complex weapon to implement. Flails can use the same ones as any other 2-handed weapon, but they'd automatically have a unique quality because of the difficult-to-control weight on the end.

I modeled http://i54.tinypic.com/1jxab5.jpg 3D model in 3Ds Max a while back.

Lol I read this As epic fails lol

Id' love flails, but I doubt they are in. EQ2 even did them with physics and that is an MMO.

Seems like we'll prolly just get the usual swords/axes/maces/bows. Nothing too exotic in that regard.

I want to sneak up on a dragon and bash it in the head with a flail. TRIPLE ELEVENSIES, GET HERE SOON...

Well, it'd been hinted that some kind of pole-arm in a non-classic-spear-sense may be in, so it's possible, although flails are a little obscure, so I wouldn't count on it.

Unless you mean the ridiculous spiked-ball-on-a-chain contraption, in which case, no. Either you'd have to put a ludicrous amount of dev time into giving it appropriate animations, or you'd have to make it a joke physics-based weapon more liable to hurt you than the enemy. I can kind of see the latter (maybe you could find it in M'Aiq's Tomb or something), but the former is too much effort for something so incredibly silly.

yeah no, to make it look convincing they need a good physics animation, and since Beths games uses physics where stuff can suddenly launch like it was shoot from a cannon, I imagen the flail would at some point goof in the same way.

Flails are WAY more obscure than spears. Why would they be in and spears be out, especially considering the obvious reason they didn't want to implement spears (harder to balance game, have to create different animations).

Obviously, I wouldn't mind it, and I don't see why you're getting flamed for wanting to talk about a different weapon now that spears are out of the question. Personally, I'd love to see some sweet multi-headed flails. Flails are interesting because you can't really parry with them, making them great for offense, but not so good for defense. They could add some different gameplay elements (but, again, this makes balance harder).

Um... what's so ridiculous about the 2-handed chain-mace flail? It delivers incredible kinetic energy on impact due to the ability to build up more momentum than a rigid-hafted weapon. And the physics wouldn't be a joke. The hitboxes are there, it doesn't need a massive chain. It wouldn't be an easy weapon to wield due to the flexible haft, and would require good character positioning and face-control to use it most effectively, but it can still be implemented. And considering the ludicrous shapes and weapons and generic animations implemented in Morrowind and Oblivion, the series really doesn't go for historical accuracy or practicality. If we can have swords shaped like the Elven Longsword or Dawnfang (In addition to 40-lb swords), a flail can have a larger-than-practical head.


...That version of Havoc is 6 years obsolete. The new one should be able to handle it very well. This is 2011, not 2005. On the other hand, apparently Oblivion's a better game than the fans give it credit for, since they seem to consider its limitations to still be in place.


Flails aren't a different animation to wield, but the physics engine would give them a different animation. And what's this bull about not being able to parry with a flail? It still has a 24"-or-so long haft, and the chain can wrap around and bind enemy weapons. Because a flail's a 2-handed weapon, and the size of its haft gives it good leverage and grip, it also gives an edge in disarming.

yea and they would have to implement a moving animation for the flail every time you walked to every single side, even up(jumping) or down(falling)

so? there still a few human being coding the engine,still doesn′t mean there won′t be the Beth brand of physics goofs

Guess what... the animation is implemented just by giving the head and chain data for Havok to use. The game will create the animations itself.

I may be wrong about the parrying. I just assumed it would be awkward with the weight so oddly distributed.

The disarming and stuff would also require new animations. Don't get me wrong, I always support variation in gameplay, but I'm also managing expectations.

Disarming would probably require a flail perk... animation just has the weapon come free of the hand when wrapped by the chain. The physics engine sorts the rest out.

These would be awesome.

You may be over estimating the power of this physics engine (or I may be under estimating).

consider how often game developers try and avoid weapon to weapon interaction like the plague unless it′s very pre rendered, it′s quite not just "The physics engine sorts the rest out"


no offence, but ya seam to overestimate the engine as the rest of us underestimate it.

You make it sound like you would be able to easily mod some in... can you? I would download that mod, and start a new religion featuring you as god!

Also to the person who posted the thread: Its not "cos they were in daggerfall" its: cos they're cool as hell!

Unfortunately, I'm not sure how to make a weapon implement the "Chained Ball Trap" on the end of a 2-handed stick. Seems like such things will need to be first implemented by the game engine.

If the Creation Engine doesn't use physics on the weapons, and relies only on Skeleton animiation, then no.