Fantasy is cliché, end of story. But that doesn't mean it's not good :hubbahubba:

Well, from the "about to be destroyed in favor of something new" guys standpoint, I think he's evil, or at least threatens my existence enough I'd rather destroy than be destroyed


This

Can you call that evil though? In Alduin's view it would simply be justice.

I like Robin Hobb's Stone Dragons, carved by a skill coterie who send their memories into the dragon which is then able to take flight and when they have served their purpose return to some field (forgot the name) turning back into stone until they are called on again.

She also has the Dragons that balance out the world, for without them the humans would destroy themselves.

Why should this terrifying creature, this ultimate badass, the most fearful monster of all monsters in mythology be friendly? That is just so counterproductive.

The good, talking kind of dragon who is this "person" with a hard shell and soft core really is cliché for me.

How can Dragons in TES be a cliche now, when they have been around since the very first ES game??

I was kind of trying to describe the mindset of Tintaglia and Icefyre earlier from Hobb's Liveship Traders, Tawny Man and Rain Wild serieseses.

I like the idea of Dragons feeling themselves to be utterly superior to us, like we do with other animals, but being completely overwhelmed by toadying flattery from humans. Like dogs do with us, I suppose.

I think dragons as a whole are pretty much overused, same goes for orcs(just putting them out there also).

So I would rather have seen something else but i'm not crying really, if the story is good then I won't mind that much.

I didn't vote because I think dragons in general are cliche, whether they're evil or good. I was really disappointed when the devs brought dragons back. I was enjoying having a dragon-free Tamriel. Now it's just taking another step toward generic fantasy, regardless of how smart/cool the dragons are, and regardless of their cool shouts and other abilities.

YES I know dragons existed in Tamriel, I played all the other games, I fought dragonlings in Daggerfall and Nafalilargus in Redguard, I'm NOT saying dragons NEVER existed and don't fit into the lore, I'm just saying I enjoyed having them be extinct and/or rare.

So many people in modern fantasy started making dragons good to combat the old Western cliche of dragons always being evil, but now SO many people have made good dragons that IMO dragons in and of themselves are standard, predictable and boring, no matter if they're made to be good, evil, stupid or anything else.

Just to clarify things, in Dragonlance there are two types of Dragon- Metallic (think Gold, Silver, Bronze, etc) and Chromatic (think Red, Green, Blue, etc). Metallics are generally Good; however, I know of one occasion where a group of Metallics were forced into being Evil. On Chromatic's side, they are generally Evil; I wonder whether White is a Chromatic color, though, because I know of one White dragon that was Good, and a Blue that wasn't that Evil at all.

Then you have to consider the Draconians- the eggs of Metallics were manipulated by Evil, causing them to be born into a sort of human-dragon hybrid; Metallic Draconians were Evil, while the small group of Chromatic Draconians were Good- a complete flip-flop of their parent's alignment.

So I would have to say that no matter what Bethesda does with Dragons, it won't be awful or cliche at all; hell, I think it would be hilarious to find a dragon eating cattle or a virgin in his cave filled with a hoard of gold.

imo, the 'peacefully, all knowing intelligent' dragon is cliche.
so is the 'malcious evil beast' dragon.

a good combination of the two cliches produces interesting results.

honestly, i dont think anyone in the gaming industry will have created dragons this well.
the fact that todd said that you can just throw one of them into an area and they will just 'work' gives me a heap of confidence.

Dragons are always cliche no matter which morally ambiguous "good or evil" side they are on.

In most lores, dragons are powerful beings that fear little and live long, so for them to be wise and good is not a problem.

In some lores, dragons can shape shift into other beings, so deceiving other races, for benefit or prank would be no problem.

You must LOOOOOOOOVE avatar eh?


ON TOPIC:

Dragins are pretty cool. I just don't really like the reptilian design they have in SKyrim,,, The design IS cliche. Not very imaginative. Pterodactyls.
I'd prefer more beastly animals like smaug in that cartoon: http://www.comicbookmovie.com/images/users/uploads/9186/rbh_Smaug.jpg
Mammal-like head... Hair....

DID YOU KNOW:
that dragins irl are actually a race of reptilian entities that have been manipulating/eating mankind since prehistory?

Anyone else think that Dragons have been done to death and they are cliche whether they are smart, dumb, reptillian, sciptillian, winged or snake-like, good, or evil?

No...they haven't been done to death in the elder scrolls.
Plus you could say that about alot of other RPG's etc,as regards story plots etc,but we still buy them.

Well we're gonna see a lot of Dragons from the gaming industry this year; TES has them, Dragon Age II has them, Guild Wars 2 will have them... sooo seems like it's a new fad of some sort.

But.. back to the op's post;

Dragons no matter how turn and bend them will always be cliché, since they've been done in just about every fashion conciveable since the first humans picked up the bones of a dinosaur and tried to imagine what kinda animal he was dealing with. That's were the dragons come from, the bones of real-life dinosaurs.

Dragons have been used so much it is just as much cliché as humans...
Meaning that even though you think dragons are a cliché, they are an important, if not even essential part of RPGs. Dragons adds so much mystery (if done right), that even if it is a cliché, it adds so much to a story!

Yes, no matter what. Just like prophecies, chosen ones and reincarnated heroes.

In fact, the whole high-fantasy genre is done to death.
You know what? Screw the main quest! The sons of Skyrim can go [censored] themselves, I'm not doing whatever the [censored] those [censored] greybeard [censored]s want.

I don't really think it matters whether they are 'good', 'evil' or 'indifferent' as long as they are executed well. Alot of people love dragons, that's probably why they are so popular in fantasy. Less of a cliche, more of an archetype.

will the dragons look like the one in the end of oblivions main quest? with no arms but wings?

It helps if you don't look at characters being stark black or white/good or evil (unless one is watching a nostalgic 80s cartoon). Look at motivations and reasoning behind their actions.

I guess I don't know my lore. I voted first saying that yes dragons are cliche evil. I just haven't really seen good dragons.