Only problem here with full functioning vegetation you don't have Wastelands and fight for resources anymore.

Don't be that sure about it - without industry ( chemical fertilizer + machines etc ) farming is much less effective and one drought could easily trigger a famine + food is not the only resource you could fight for.

That's very true, but not all vegetation is especially useful as resources for the Wastelanders either and some of it could become a hindrance. Navigating forests, jungles, etc. can be more difficult on the human body than traversing what we have seen in previous Fallout games. Not to mention having to clear out the vegetation to build farms and what not.

Wastelanders could be using mud and dirt and other resources scattered around the wastes to build up their societies, but they haven't been doing so in Fallout 3, New Vegas or Fallout 4 either as evidenced by the enormous amount of items to be found at every turn that our PC finds, but no one else seems to be capable of doing so. If we look at other human civilizations we can see that humanity has fared pretty well in places like Egypt.

I'm not very knowledgeable when it comes to the systems, but I can imagine that the excessive foliage and plant life that I am suggesting would put a rather substantial burden on systems in terms of rendering though. I think it's more a matter of aesthetic preference though. There has been representation of both types of wasteland, but for me I tend to prefer the more colorful ones.

You can have color in a post-apocalyptic world. Go back and watch the Mad Max films for great examples of that. Fury Road especially is just about a master course in color theory.

Agreed to OP. And I really miss the subways.

I've gotta say, I miss the extensive subways too. while there are still a few subways in FO4, they just don't compare.

Subway system DLC is needed

Hey, that's a good idea! Anybody remember a Morrowind mod called "The Underground"? I think it was created by Qarl... anyway, it was great, and an FO4 DLC done a similar way would be outstanding!

Naw I prefer it the way it is now. I never gotten the post nuclear war feel in any Fallout. You run into something at every turn.

You made me realize something: What are the benchmarks that define an environment as "post-Apocalyptic" as opposed to anything else?

Hmm. For all of the games, FO3, FNV, FO4, we have

Pervasive radiation with numerous hotspots -- check

Extensive ruins of pre-war structures -- check

Numerous lethal mutations all across the landscape -- check

Warring factions -- check

Anarchy as survivors go every-man-for-himself -- uhm, check, but to varying degrees

All of the games have Raiders; they don't get along with anybody except themselves. All the games have Supermutants, but in FNV the primary sample have become pacifists, more or less. All three games have BoS, but each game presents a different set of BoS attitudes which affect how well the BoS gets along with other groups.

The difference between "post-Apocalypse" and "post-post-Apocalypse" is that in the latter, Civilization is reforming. With that guideline in mind, we can see that FO3 is barely started, having several "city-states", with at least one major faction trying to reduce the anarchy (BoS) while another (Enclave) strives for total domination. In FNV, the BoS is reduced to a minor player, but there are TWO major factions, NCR and Caesar's Legion, both trying to impress their version of Civilization on everyone. (Unlike the Enclave in FO3 that wanted to exterminate everyone not in their select group.) But here in FO4, the level of anarchy is at its greatest. There are more factions battling each other, and only the Minutemen have the stated intention of restoring Order and Civilization.

Along these considerations, I would say that FNV is clearly post-post-Apocalypse. FO3 is pretty clearly post-Apocalyptic. But given the greater number of adversaries and greater anarchy, FO4 is even more post-Apocalyptic (despite occurring 10 years after FO3).

Good point. There was never a full scale nuclear war in the real world, so all scenarios in games, literature or movies are just assumptions. No one can really know how a post apocalyptic world would look like. But I guess many people use Mad Max as a benchmark. However, Mad Max played only a short time after a nuclear war, and not 200 years later.

On top of that - development after a nuclear war can be different in different regions. New Vegas for example- It's a desert even without a nuclear war. So the Chinese would probably to waste to many nukes on that region anyway.

Heh, on the contrary. Besides Vegas and Hoover dam, the sagebrush in Nevada is liberally sprinkled with military complexes of every stripe. They probably have more nuclear/SAC/ordnance-depo/aero-development/secret squirrel bases and outposts than any other state. Nevada would be incredibly popular on an enemies Missile Command console.

Methinks that Fallout 4 would feel much more post apocalyptic if it wasn't so populated. I perfer the added colour versus Fallout 3's green tint, but I feel that finding pockets of populated areas should be much, much rarer than it is in Fallout 4.

When the GECK comes out I'll be de-populating areas so I can wander around the wateland without bumping into someone/something all the time - especially in the built up areas. You can't go a block without running into raiders or Gunners or something. That feeling of lack of life and emptiness would make it feel much more post apocalyptic to me.

Actually, I seem to recall House saying that there had been targeted by 77 nukes, but that his defenses managed to neutralize the large majority of them. All of the devastation that we see is a result of a fraction of the nukes that made it through. (Just imagine if all 77 had arrived on target.)

Whats wrong with this fallout game feeling different then another fallout game? If they would have added the same atmosphere from 3 like the green tint and brown color you can bet this thread would be " fallout 4 feels samey just like fallout 3 why is bethesda so lazy?" just imagine if oblivion and skyrim were just morrowind 2.0 in a different location its better to have each game have its own feel.

I know what you mean. I don't think it is because of the color and what not though. They lost the art style. The shape of things like mailboxes, houses and mechanical equipment (from generators to track hoes(holla). Of course the biggest detractor is the weapon shape and style. Why did they abandon the weapon style they helped make iconic in fo3? Also the fashion(souls). Completely abandoned the fashion of the previous games outside of the vault suit(except PA). Wtf?

I don't have the problem. I even use a mod to put more leaves and green on plants. Because it's 210 years after the big bang.

Just want to point out that "fallout" doesn't in any way equal "realistic".


It is it's own universe or timeline and ultimatly developmentally it is what it is.


Realistically there wouldn't be deathclaws, mini-nukes or any if the cool [censored] we get to play with.


If you want realism turn off your game and walk ouside.


I want my Fallout weird and strange and well y'know FANTASTIC!

Just include children into all of the various groups. BAM everthing is super dark. The backlash could potentionally destroy Bethesda but totally worth it.


In all seriousness the colors on pre-war buildings should have been a lot less bright (bring the bleach!) and the wasteland should be greener but radiation has a negative effect in the Fallout-Universe for some reason. So I don't sweat it too much.

That is a great point.


Killing children won't cut it for any big dev.


That is prime mod territory.

It has? No one informed me. What i enjoy most about Fallout as a franchise thus far, is that every game feels vastly different and looks it aswell. I think its a strength, not a weakness. Its the same that The Elder Scrolls bring about aswell.

I don't know why I didn't think of this sooner but, I just spent some time fiddling with the settings on my TV and managed to bring the brightness and massively reduce the over-saturated 'happy' post apocalypse. It instantly made it look 10 times better. The whole place just looks so much more depressing and instead of not caring much about my surrounding I now walk past the cars and ruined building and they actually look (to me) the way they should. Washed out and like historical relics so now I'm intrigued and get a kind of nostalgic feel like i did with F3 and NV. It just looks more like the WW2 documentaries that I watch a lot of.

It's a shame the place is massively over populated then the 'biggest city I ever saw' Diamond City is a tiny settlement with few people inside... Where are all the big settlements? I was expecting bigger settlements and a few more of them, spaced out than we got last gen yet we got less but, can't walk 20 foot without bumping into a bunch of raiders or super mutants! Nevermind, again I suppose with Bethesda games you can't complain too much because they give you to tools to fix the bits you don't like.

You shouldn't have to "fiddle" with anything to make a Fallout game look right.


Fallout Boston shouldn't be Nuketown or the Cap (greentown).


Bethesda does quests exclusively "grey" so why can't they environment? Lol

Lol, yeah, good point actually, a somewhere in the middle, grey would be great too but, I associate old WW2 theme 1950

style, especially ages to be dirty and green tinged because a lot of things were a crappy green colour then.

Please don't ever Enslaved Fallout! Lol. That game was beautiful in it's own right but, please no... I don't care about nobodies 200 year argument! lol

Yes, it pretty much did, mostly because it tries too hard with the "oh look, everything's so bleak", I prefer an interesting vibe over DC and New Vegas: A jungle. Nature comes back in full force, vines and trees holding structures together while at the same time tearing it apart, becoming the new foundation. Sentient plant life growing within the region, with man eating venus flytraps, fungi traps and other nasties living within the dense forest. It would have an eerie, beautiful, and alien feeling where even the world is against you: Yes, your entire world is wiped out, and I'm taking it back from whence it came, deal with it.