That'd be hard to, what with the contradiction in terms. Remember, having a lot of text doesn't mean it's text-based.

I was always a fan of the TES 'keyword' dialog because at least it wouldn't spoil the idea of the personality of my character that I had in my mind.
I mean... polite and evil seems to be impossible in most games for instance.
But yes, the "I'm looking for my dad - middle aged guy, seen him?" deserves a prize for the most ridiculous dialog choice ever!

One more point for old Fallout here. FO1 has my favorite dialog in a game ever! (planescape might have been richer and more sophisticated but you never got to say things like "I just wanted to know how someone as stupid as you can still be alive"!)

For some reason I can imagine the Vault Dweller saying that to the Lone Wanderer.

And the LW can respond via "[Intelligence] You're calling me stupid ?"

I'd hate to express myself like so, but... roflmao! :lmao:

Your all just expressing opnions and by the poll your in the minority.

I played all four of the Fallouts, beaten 1,2, and tactics with custom characters using 3 different character builds each and with all the premade characters, the game I enjoy the most is 3 followed by 1 closely and 2 just barely edging out tactics (Highly underated IMO)

In fact I have spent more time customizing the ultimate Fallout 3 characters then the other 3.

Btw, Interplay lost the liscence everything Bethesda now is canon, if you dont like it go write some terrible fan fics or something.

Oh well, at last the True Fallout fan is here, heh. What does all your Fallout experience have to do with anything ?

I overexagerated in response to the doom compliment.

Even if there was a poll this is a Bethesda forum.



I can't think of anyone here who simply hates the game, just because we don't agree with everything Bethesda does doesn't mean that we abhor them and their games with an unyielding passion.

Descriptive being, getting your message across with words in a way that the reader can best understand

I feel that Sims 3 is more realistic than ever, the whole town grows with you and you're not tied down to a lot, those are the best features a Sims game has had yet in my opinion

Super Mario Brothers has gotten more realistic, 3D is closer to life than 2D, Mario more resembles a person than ever, in the future I think Mario games will use more realistic physics so that Mario can interact with the world in a way that makes sense, I think all things things add up to a more enriching experience

Street Fighter is not a good example, those fans are more nuts than any hardcoe Fallout fan, they actually do want a carbon copy of the same game produced over and over again, they will tell you so, and as a result the fighting game genre is dying, fighting game developers refuse to consolize fighting games, meaning, make them less over-the-top, implement customization, implement story modes, and use realistic physics, they don't work anymore and fighting game fans won't admit it because the want to force it to be a niche genre, meaning, they want to purposely make it bad so that only they can stand it, the fighting game genre could do with more realism, and some games are already doing that, Bushido Blade was ahead of its time

Chess will never be able to offer the fun and innovation of a well done video game, Chess is fun because you like challenging someone to a game of wits, video games will always have a greater capacity for being more engaging, intellectually stimulating, and more enjoyable than Chess, realism combined with tactics will offer more to the player than tactics combined with stiff mechanical chess-type gameplay because it becomes more than just a task to complete, it becomes emotionally engaging as well, I have found Swat 4's combat to be way more emotionally engaging that Fallout's or Jagged Alliance's, I've never jumped out of my seat while playing Jagged Alliance and have not felt the same sense of danger than when I'm playing Swat 4, also, Swat 4 online was much more tactical as well because we had much more freedom to be creative instead of being stuck on grid.

I don't think you can "consolize" fighting games more than they already are, fighting games have always been console games.

I think he means, making it more mainstream, and by that term he is quite correct Tekken, Street Fighter, MvC are all really hardcoe and hard for the average gamer to pick up. They take a ton of strategy but the genre is dieing because of it.

I sure this is not your case, as not also of the majority on this thread; however, the most "radicals" and bethesda haters were quite vocal, mainly after the release of FO3. Radicals ofter expressed and express as the "only authorized people on content" and some times people mistaken regular vets x fanatical vets.

1) Yeah, I thought that was pretty clear (and I've spent the last few pages, actually, reiterating that it's all subjective; regardless of anyone's thoughts.)

2) Which poll, again? And also, yeah, I think that's a given, as well. Wow, those who had any criticism against a Bethesda game, being in the minority in the Bethesda board? I think it's become pretty obvious over the past month or so that there's maybe half a dozen people here, relegated this sub-forum, that have anything critical to say about FO3. I "get" why a lot of people like Fallout 3. I quite enjoy it, myself. I'm still playing it, and I've bought all the DLC as well. But even if I was the only one who felt like all the changes weren't automatically good things, or that the Fallout franchise didn't end up losing at least some things in the translation - just because I was outnumbered wouldn't mean that I'd feel any different.

(Hey, I'm a Browncoat - I'm used to feeling strongly about things most people just don't care about... )

Hey, you have your preferences, and more power to you. In my mind, that you can make an Ultimate Fallout 3 character, points to an unbalanced game system, though. Ideally, no combination of Attributes, Skills, and Equipment, should make one character "better" than another. But hey - I'm also totally willing to agree to disagree. Fallout 3 didn't want to go down that route, and that's fine. But if I feel that wasn't a step that I agree with, I'm going to say so.

Again, the only point I'm trying to make is that you have your preferences, and I have mine. The only difference is that I see them as subjective opinions, and you see (seem to see) yours as the only "right" one. Just because you don't understand why some people might prefer a turn-based game, or what-have-you, over the games you like - doesn't mean that they don't have valid reasons for feeling that way; or that they're just clinging to "dead and outdated" concepts.

If you find real-time to be more emotionally engaging, that's great. But thinking everyone should feel the same as you is where there's a problem. I love Lima Beans. I can't understand why anyone could dislike them. But that doesn't mean I feel that everyone should like them; or that I hold the Lima Bean up as the Ultimate Vegatable that every other vegatable falls short of, and is inherently lesser. Instead, I realize that my subjective opinion is that Lima Beans are good...

When I mean ultimate Fallout 3 character its what I have done in the others, usually maxed out 3 SPECIAL stats best combination of perks and the best equipment, and its easier just IMO to do it for Fallout 1 and 2 and about as hard for Tactics (Because of having 6 characters).

Yeah your right about the poll, but I think the sales numbers speak for themselves.

Anyhow I think I was getting a little defensive, as these seem to be the most negative forums I have been on, including WoW and Mtg.

And I love every Fallout game, I dont consider Fallout: Brotherhood of Steel a real fallout game, turn based or not.

Im just really trying to bring up the point that series take different directions, look at one of the longest running RPG's Final Fantasy.

And that some of the people are using Nostalgia glasses when looking at how great Fallout 1 and 2 are, and they are great but they arent perfect.

Yeah, not as if they can actually play the game nowadays. Poor Fallout and Fallout 2, lost to history.

The last Final Fantasy I played wasn't all that different from its predecessors (FF10). The MMORPG FF11 and upcoming FF14 sure, but there are a lot of FF fans who feel the same way about the MMORPG FFs that some of us do about Fallout 3.



Not quite, after Broken Steel was released I went back and skimmed through the main quests of all three games only doing side quests when I needed EXP or certain equipment. I'm well aware that the first two titles are not perfect, I don't believe anything can be perfect, I have plenty of problems with Fallout 2 in particular, but I still feel that they're better games overall.

It's a matter of preference, you prefer Bethesda's TES style and I prefer the original Fallout style. To me the original style is Fallout, Fallout 3 feels more like TES with a post apocalyptic skin shoved on it. It's a good game sure, but I don't think it's a good Fallout sequel. All of this becomes really apparent when playing all three games only a short time after the other, Fallout 3 felt like the odd child of the bunch after I finished the first two. No matter how many sequels Bethesda does, their style will always feel like the odd one because it's not what the series started out as, nor what it was intended to be.

Yeah, it's a popular game; and critically-acclaimed. Fallout 1 was also critically-acclaimed, and at least sold well enough to rush out a sequel. (I can't remember, but didn't Fallout 2 come out only like a year after Fallout 1?) Obviously, FO1 didn't sell as well as FO3 did, but that's going to be a given, as well.

Heh, well I don't want to drag (what's left) of this thread off-topic, but if you want to see negative you should go visit the Sims 3 forums right now. There's always going to be a negative undercurrent in a game forum, in my experience.

See my sig...

Final Fantasy 12 is completely different then every other FF and it was the highest rated, and best FF at IMO, you had computer controlled AI, think FF11 but you know good. FF11 is the Fallout: BOS.

Im sorry but this arguement is tedious, I have been playing Fallout 1 2 and Tactics (BTW do you know how to play Tactics online? I cant figure it out, and do yall want to play it?) and I think that Fallout 3 is a worthy sequel, you dont and we arent going to convince each other other wise.

They were made to be played in arcades instead of home consoles, that's what I meant, few fighting games have deviated from the Street Fighter II formula, which was designed to be played in an arcade, playing at home is the exact opposite experience to what Street Fighter II was designed for.

I have a bit of trouble with that! I don't think it's a matter of wrong/right or subjective/objective opinions. Everything seems to be subjective in the internet doesn't it? That’s pretty annoying... but I don't think that's the issue here really. What bothers me is that the first two games had interesting concepts that could have been developed in order to give something really, unique and even groundbreaking. For instance, the action point based combat was very interesting… some people might not like it but: it was fresh and unique (back then) that’s hardly subjective! With FO3 there was a chance to take the interesting parts of the previous games and develop them further, thus making something intriguing that people had never experienced before… Instead Bethesda takes the easy path of getting rid of any aspects that would alienate the more mainstream game crowd – people don’t seem to like new experiences, they just seem to want what they know (I bet that’s not subjective either but I can’t be bothered find ‘proof’ now).

Ultimately that’s not progress! It’s just flattening things out, its striving for homogeneity… slowly turning things into one another (rpgs into fps in this case) thus losing the exciting variety that games used to have.

I bet that’s great for most people! That’s why FO3 sells so much right?
But it’s just disappointing for people like me – who admired the original and unique aspects of the first games, to see Bethesda not only refusing to develop them further but to actually getting rid of them in order to make yet another fps/rpg hybrid.

You should see why I’m bitter (I won’t claim to speak for all entire FO1-2 fans here) – there are dozens of fps coming out every month but extremely few developers try to progress some other rpg concepts further – such as parties and tactical turn based combat for example. And if that wasn’t enough they now even taking those things out of a game franchise that I particularly like.

FO3 might be cool and everything, but… in FO1-2 there was a time after many hours of playing when, with the right selection of perks and skills, my char could walk right in the middle of a group of enemies and shout four times in a single round – each shoot a critical insta-kill – and being turn based I had all the time to savor the triumph while deciding who was the next unfortunate guy to fall, while they could do nothing but stand there waiting for me to finish them off. I rarely get that sense anymore.


In a different matter

Numbers say just one thing: FO3 sells a lot. Yet FO1&2 are classics. Don’t compare good sales with classic status; it’s unfair for all and they’re not valid measures of quality… We’ll have to wait another ten years and see if FO3 achieves to maintain a core of dedicated fans like FO1&2 have now and then we can talk numbers. (Which I highly doubt because of the reasons I gave above). The only fair comparison of numbers I can think of would be like this: FO1 sales/pc game audience of 1997 compared to FO3 sales/pc game audience of 2009. And that still might say something about popularity+marketing etc. - not strictly quality.

Well at least it kinda sounds like the traditional Fallout's, but I'm guessing there is still quite a LONG way to go, until it meets up to Van Buren/Classic Fallout standards.

I don't get it. Just to start out here I'll say I enjoyed Fallout 3. But somehow people don't seem to understand that some people didn't like the direction Fallout 3 has taken the series, with an entirely different emphasis on what's important gameplay in a Fallout-game. Fine, Fallout 3 isn't a bad game, but I was hoping for a game that has globally the same strong points as Fallout 1 and 2. That to me is a real continuation. But apparently when we give our opinions we're the worlds biggest sourpusses and we are nostalgic and arrogant for using criticism on a game that the vast majority worships to death. The whole 'get over it' attitude is infuriating and shows a complete lack of respect to someone elses opinion, even if it is just about a game. And by that time, it starts to become really difficult to remain calm and respectful to people who trivialize, twist and turn every word you have to say.

*Sigh* I grow weary of this discussion and I'll stay out of it for a while.

And Fallout wasn't made to be played on home consoles either.

I know it wasn't for Fallout 3, but one of the lead developers of Oblivion totally overhauled Cyrodil to what it it now because he thought people wouldn't buy something so different (in lore it was apparently supposed to be a tropical jungle with Roman architecture).