This is very true (and, to an effect, implementing weapon degradation to those games would probably be detrimental to the experience -- not much, but to a degree). But ever since the gameplay was turned to utter [censored] (to be blunt), I'd rather figure out how to spice it up to at least some degree.

Expect an anvil in FO4, and to see the PC hammering away on a baseball bat; repairing it.

Or creating one.... (wooden; from a collection of chips and pieces of plywood)

Seriously, though, yeah. That's about what I expect.

With spare parts.

Fortunately, the series has a built-in weakness for Power Armor - EMP weapons.

I care much more for balance than for realism, because as you said it Gizmo, why take off Power Armor once you get it? The "dress-up fantasy" is a gameplay element directly connected to combat. If I have no choice in what armor I wear, why even have that element in the first place? Exchanging worse armor for a better one is as interactive as clicking away nagging ads. The game could simply assign the armor to my character and basta.

Power Armor should be powerful. That doesn't mean it should be the number one choice for every situation or character. Since I think a large variety of PA to prevent that isn't helpful - the setting should have them stay rare - other armor should also come in handy.

Repairing weapons is another gameplay element that gives value to the repair skill in order to balance it - it consumes the same resource as the other skills after all, so the payoff should be different, but of similar worth.

I've suggested it several times, that EMP grenades paralyze PA clad combatants.

I disagree. Skills in this series are for situational utility; not upkeep. Ideally, they are option gates.
Even 'Doctor' could be used in conversation in Fallout 2. Repair was to get a broken thing running ~even just for the moment; as a means to an end.

yeah better to svck todd howard's [censored]

1. Yeah, that's nice. Enemies need to use them frequently though, which requires a setting to permit that. And an AI that's somewhat sophisticated.

2. Speech for example is inherently situational. But Repair/Mechanics could have upkeep value, so why not?

Can spice it up removing degredation and adding crit failures and broken weapons(which can be fixed at a work bench + tools and parts).

But why not have them all? It's not really "spicing things up" if the net weight is less than before, which it is if you remove the largest element and replace it two smaller and simpler.

The system wanted removed is [censored], everybody agrees. Fix it (try, at least). Don't remove it because of poor previous implementation. It's a really uncreative way of doing things to only use the scissors. If everything that now doesn't work was to be axed (and there's a lot of it), there's not much of a game left after all that is gone.

If anything, Fallout as of right now, needs more gameplay complexity and consideration as it has been streamlined to the bone. Simplifying things won't make them better (anymore, that threshold has passed), just more simple.

The added complexity would come from building own weapons and armor at a work bench using mechanic/engineer and repairing broken weapons(or breaking down weapons for parts).

Need to pick your battles. I don't think there is any fun way to fix repair which would add much to gameplay. I rather that energy used in areas more desperate for fixing. Like c&c, quests, story.

I'm all for them restoring critical failures. The idea that it's not fun ~is the point. It's not supposed to be fun, it's supposed to be what happens; and partly as result of PC development choices.

Less can be more; for the same reason we all understand why a PC's need to pee is not part of the game mechanics, or why we are not all forced to watch the PC sleep.
By not focusing on minutia repairs, the player is not thinking about them. Repair should be about getting the elevator to work, not about patching bullet holes.

I really enjoy having to repair my weapons and pack food. Its great for roleplaying, and it makes the world feel a lot more real. I would be sad if they were axed out.

No, Fallout 4 needs armor and weapons degradation.

Because there is no armor and weapons degradation in The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim playing vanilla The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim is very boring to play for me. I have a mod downloaded that brings back armor and weapons degradation in The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim. I also downloaded another mod that removes regenerative health permanently. It makes playing The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim way more enjoyable to play now. I have to take care of my armor and weapons. I have to have healing potions and healing spells. Combat now is just more fun and hard.

Fallout 4 needs complexities, it needs to be challenging, it needs to be hard, I shouldn't travel on irradiated land being invincible killing NPC's and my armor never getting damaged or my guns never getting broken or jammed.

I am very happy more and more video game developers and video game development companies are adding armor and weapons degradation to their video games now.

I count a total of 9 video games right now that I know or at least think have armor and weapons degradation. There might be more, but who knows.

Yes 100% exactly this it makes the world feel more alive. It makes it more enjoyable to explore the world and try to overcome the hardships that come with it. It feels rewarding.

Hardships equal rewards to me. Overcome the hardships and expect great rewards for your accomplishments.

Broken weapons also have narrative value, particularly in Fallout's setting.

That's what I'm more or less going for. Repairing 5% or 13 points out of 100 doesn't really sound appealing (nor was it in FO3/NV). I'd want to add things that make a difference to the gameplay.

Weapon/armor degradation isn't an issue that, when looking at it in isolation, makes much of a difference by existing or not, but it is one of those little streams that build up the river and since it has been put in it might as well be taken some advantage of. There are possibilities in the design and concept (especially now that we know how it doesn't really work for the better of the game) that a clever designer can make use of. It's a wasted potential to just lose it (just like the TES attributes) - not a big one, but nonetheless.

Cluttering things up with redundancies is one thing ("less is more") and going with that, they might as well discard the whole character system (that much of a redundant mess it is right now); creating meaningful gameplay by addition of new and molding of old of features is another.

Anyway, there's not much to argue about this; just the feeling that cutting down and removing potentially - and sometimes factually - useful features (which has been Bethesda's forte in their past 3 games) seems counterproductive and unimaginative to me.

I'm in agreement with the removal of weapon degradation. But that's it. I would prefer if weapons had their condition bar removed unless the PC has both a high repair skill and equivalent skill level with the weapon. If a player specializes in Energy weapons than they should be able to tell it's condition with a high repair skill. But should they use a conventional firearm where they have no skill or knowledge in that condition bar is gone.

Thus weapons can just break on low level characters. Guns require constant maintenance. But if the PC doesn't know what a gun needs, they'll need to have them repaired by a professional until they have the skills to repair it themselves.

How is it more challenging or fun? I sure as hell don't think it makes the game hard having to repair. my weapons and armor. It is just a nuisance, a time sink, that adds as much complexity as a bullet sponge NPC. If you want things to be difficult, work on AI.

There can still be broken weapons that would need to be fixed. As it stands, you can repair weapons and armor on the move, in the middle of combat, and how that adds to realism, roleplay, or makes the world feel more alive, is beyond me. It makes it feel fake to me. Oh, I just repaired my pistol in the middle of fighting 6 raiders.... makes sense.

It is much better to have weapons break via crit failures that must be fixed at a work bench, then to have any on the fly repair system.

Oh... unless they make it a VATS action.
[Vault-tec Assisted Tinkering System]

Alternatively, instead of a workbench you could utilize a portable repair kit in the field - 15 minutes would pass (screenfade as in F/F2).

This could be good; better if the time was linked to the PC's skill and intelligence. (Allowing for it to be 15 minutes, or even 15 hours, depending on PC competence.)

Most importantly, that this wouldn't be happening in combat, and perhaps could spark it's own ambush encounters if done in an unsafe area.

It is challenging and fun to me because what if my gun jams when I am shooting a bunch of enemy NPC's then I have to take cover to not get killed from the enemy NPC's.

I love doing this in Far Cry 2.

The guns breaking, if you fire the guns to much they should overheat and stop firing until they cool down the springs should break to. The stocks though on the guns if they are made of wood you should be able to make a new wooden stock out in the world to fix the broken wooden stock on your gun no need to go to a anvil or some work bench. You can find glue and wooden planks in the world and do it on the go.

Axes for example you can carry a small bottle of wood glue and glue a piece of thick wood that fits properly to the axe.

There we go portable repair kits should exist as well.

Some guns come with spare parts. Finding spare gun parts on other guns should be easy and hard. It all depends on what kind of gun you have if there's a bunch of the same type or certain unique and rare guns.

When did the Fallout series stop being about exploring the ethics of a post apocalyptic remnant civilization; and start being about crisis inducement?
*When will it return to form?

I would very much like to see a return to form in any future Fallout derived titles, now that it is no longer their first attempt; (as had been pointed out by so many)..