I may owe you an apology.

So I removed the FSR and got the freeze at main menu load save game.

Now - I did test this several times before and never had a freeze when FSR was not installed. So I'm at a loss as to how that was happening. And further after testing just that one setting with it off and it would load the game, but now with FSR out completely I get a freeze at main menu again.

So most likely this is esp/esm related. I know what I've added/updated.

Added:
Canterbury Interiors
Faceme3
Reneer Radio Mod

Upgraded:
Fellout

I have several saves prior to these that never has a freeze or crash.
So tomorrow I will test all this out and get no crashes before adding in FSR again.

I apologize for any wild goose chasing and will let you know if I find anything pertinent.

Well damnit!! I cannot figure out what has gone wrong with my game.

This freezing at main menu is persistent and pervasive now. I stripped my load order back to just Vanilla + Fellout thinking that the new fellout was the culprit. I started to reactivate the mods slowly and found many combinations that caused it. If it happen it happened every time. But so often and with so many mods.

I had saved the previous version of fellout and so put that back in and it worked with many mods until again as the load order filled up it just kept happening. Then after I deactivated it the game still froze.

I'm testing various save games and my thinking is that something is happening to the save games where the issue is exacerbated by mod combinations. I'm using FOSE 1.2 and I was not aware of any save game hooks with it like there are for OBSE 18b5, so if there is a mod using anything like that I don't know. I hardly update this game or have a constant flow of mods in and out like I do with Oblivion. this game just is not as hardy as Oblivion when if comes to that, I thnk.

The thing is I care less about Fallout than I do Oblivion - I don't think I'm going to be that dedicated to finding the cause. I may open a thread about it if this continues.

So sorry for the confusion and false blame - I will try a bit more, but if no answer then I'm just going to live with it.

Well I can get a load order I had before that does not have this issue - no Face3, No new fellout, no Cantebury Interiors. This load order:

Fallout3.esmAnchorage.esmThePitt.esmBrokenSteel.esmPointLookout.esmZeta.esmUnofficial Fallout 3 Patch.esmCRAFT.esmCALIBR.esmStreetLights.esmFO3 Wanderers Edition - Main File.esmMart's Mutant Mod.esmMMZombieCemetery.esmPointLookout-FollowersGetToGo.esmDCInteriors_ComboEdition.esmCubeExperimental (EN).esmAmmo Bench.esmEnhanced Weather - Rain and Snow.esmUnofficial Fallout 3 Patch - Operation Anchorage.espUnofficial Fallout 3 Patch - The Pitt.espUnofficial Fallout 3 Patch - Broken Steel.espUnofficial Fallout 3 Patch - Point Lookout.espUnofficial Fallout 3 Patch - Mothership Zeta.espRefurbish [OA] - FWE.espRefurbish [TP].espRefurbish [BS].espRefurbish [PL].espRefurbish [MZ].espDarNifiedUIF3.espRadioHotkey.espGalaxyNewsRadio100[M].espGhostRadio.espLookoutRadio.espmutantradio.espExistence2.0.espRadioTenpenny.espCONELRAD 640-1240.espReneersRadioMod.espReneersRadioMod_MutantRadioPatch.espReneersRadioMod_ExistenceRadioPatch.espPCIdles.espCRAFT - Activation Perk.espCRAFT -Zeta -  Activation Perk.espUPP - Original Perks.espUPP - Pack 1.espUPP - Pack 2.espUPP - Experience Perks.espUPP  - Quest Perks.espCombat Style Perks.espDirectional PipLight HDR.espMore Hotkeys.espMoreMapMarkers.espEnhanced Weather - Rain and Snow in Fallout.espEnhanced Weather - Rainbows.espEnhanced Weather - Weather Sounds in Interiors.espEnhanced Weather - Sneak Bonus during Storms.espFellout-Full.espFellout-Anchorage.espFellout-BrokenSteel.espFellout-PointLookout.espFellout-pipboylight.espAmmo Bench - Alien Power Cell.espAmmo Bench - Artisan.espAmmo Bench - CRAFT Plugin.espAmmo Bench - CALIBR.espAmmo Bench - Car Mechanic.espAmmo Bench - Old Ammo-Benches.espAmmo Bench - Toolkit Retex.espCliff's_Residences Of DC - Player Version.espEcho_BatteryCharger.espHouseholdWaterPurifier.espPortableMattress.espBlackWolf Backpack.espGunnySack.espSS OTS Camera FOSE.esp1Animated Nightvision goggles.espSniperZooming.espExpanded Megaton House V3.espMaintenanceShed.espHomesteadMotelSuite.espUrgeWashingtonBoS.esptubRRCompound.espBoSPatrols.espmerc.espD.C. Confidential.espShadySands.espNotSoFast.espHeirApparent.espTreasure Maps_Underground.espTreasure Maps_Secrets of the Wasteland.espTreasure Maps_Bobblehead Edition.espTreasure Maps_A Fist Full of Caps.espMTC Wasteland Travellers.espMTC Wasteland Travellers (Optional)- Crowded Cities less NPCs.espMaxLevelWorkaround-HP-BS.espWastelandMastery.espSkillCheck.espFO3 Wanderers Edition - Main File.esptubunarFWE.espFO3 Wanderers Edition - DLC Anchorage.espFO3 Wanderers Edition - DLC The Pitt.espFO3 Wanderers Edition - DLC Broken Steel.espFO3 Wanderers Edition - DLC Point Lookout.espFO3 Wanderers Edition - DLC Mothership Zeta.espFO3 Wanderers Edition - UFP Support.espFO3 Wanderers Edition - Alternate Travel.espFO3 Wanderers Edition - Lvl 30 High Skills.espFO3 Wanderers Edition - Followers Enhanced (BrokenSteel).espFO3 Wanderers Edition - Optional VATS Realtime.espFO3 Wanderers Edition - Optional Worn Weapons.espFO3 Wanderers Edition - Optional Sneak Msgs.espWeaponModKits.espWeaponModKits - FWE Master Release.espWeaponModKits - OperationAnchorage.espWeaponModKits - ThePitt.espWeaponModKits - BrokenSteel.espWeaponModKits - PointLookout.espWeaponModKits - Zeta.espWeaponModKits - FWE Optional Worn Weapons.espCALIBR Ammo Schematics - CRAFT.espCALIBRxMerchant.espStealthboy Recon Armor - CRAFT.espCRAFT Improvised Weaponry.espCRAFT Improvised Weaponry - Unmodeled.espjmschematics.espSniperPack by Cornflower.espTacticalWeaponsPack by Cornflower.espMove Workbench - FWE.espBallistics-ALL-MoreRealism.espRealFragGrenade3.espKs_DynamicSneak.espStealth Kills Enabled.espStealth Kills Enabled - Pitt Compatibility.espPHIG_SteadyAim.espEVE.espEVE - FWE Master Release (Follower Enhanced).espEVE Operation Anchorage.espEVE - FWE with WeaponModKits.espEVE Anchorage - FWE DLC Anchorage.espZumbs'_Overhauled_Real_Time_Security.espWasteland Whisperer.espRobCo Certified.espBuildableBots v0.3a.espBuildablebots Robcert. addon.espRobCo Engineer - Robot Repair.espCBOv1.4.espKickDogs.espThePitt-NoFireFollowers.espReplenishment.espPrincess Better Prompts v1pt1.espdD-More Gore.espdD-More Gore-The Pitt.espdD-More Gore-BrokenSteel.espdD-More Gore-PointLookout.espdD-More Gore-Zeta.espdD-Less Blood Time, Larger Blood.espdD-Reduced Dismember Force.espMart's Mutant Mod.espMart's Mutant Mod - Hunting & Looting.espMart's Mutant Mod - Feral Ghoul Rampage.espMart's Mutant Mod - DLC Anchorage.espMart's Mutant Mod - DLC The Pitt.espMart's Mutant Mod - DLC Broken Steel.espMart's Mutant Mod - DLC Point Lookout.espMart's Mutant Mod - DLC Zeta.espMart's Mutant Mod - Zombie Cementery.espMart's Mutant Mod - FWE with EVE.espMart's Mutant Mod - FWE Master Release.espT3T_MiscItemIcons.esp1PipboyPDA.espBurnification.espFireLightFix.espRealistic Interior Lighting.espRealistic Interior Lighting - OA.espRealistic Interior Lighting - BS.espStreetLights - Wasteland.espmegalight.espMez's Merged Patch - FWE-WMK-MMM.espMMM_RtSS_Mod.espKH_FWE Fixes.espKH_FWE Tweaks.espKH_FWE Hellfirefix.espKH_MMM override.espKH_MMMNoIncreasedSpawns.espKH_FWE Unlimited Followers(BrokenSteel).espKH_223EX.espKH_NoAmmoWeight.espTotal active plugins: 187

... now to test again the FSR versions - more to come ...

================
[edit 1]
OK so now I be trippin.

after updating to the 4.1.2 FSR I cannot get the issue to return. What did you do?

This is too optimistic. My thinking is that some other force is at hand (demonic mod god that adds an extra 1 to every 2 preventing a 2 from ever existing and always making us think about 3).

================

[edit 2] Well the short answer is - whatever you did in that latest version fixed all the issues. so far anyway. I so couldn't believe it that I had to take it out and put it back in several times to see it freeze with it out then back in to see it unstuck.

So even though FSR was not the cause of the issue - it fixed it.

thanks much sir.

... you're saying that you now get the issues sometimes when FSR is disabled, but never when FSR is enabled? This is entering the realm of the bizarre. I'm assuming you tried rebooting a time or two during this process?

Yeah I'm a bit lost too.

What occurred was that once I was getting the freezes without FSR loaded (which I discovered about the time that you released the last FSR) I then ditched FSR and tested and tested and tested. Turns out I was seeing this freezing with newer mods installed (which included FaceMe3, the latest Fellout, Reneer Radio mod, and Cantebury Interiors). I tried to map out all the different combinations that were causing it.

Very frustrating, so I decided to go back to older fellout and ditch the others. I returned to a load order that did not have that happen at all. Then I tested out the new FSR (and the 4.1.1 version) and could not get the error, so I'm convinced it is more or less mod related. I then tried the newer mods with the latest FSR and they worked. I then took the FSR out and the freeze is there ... put it back and it was gone.

Who knows maybe tomorrow I will fire it up and I'm back at square one. Not sure what else to say excpet that if it gets weirder I will let you know, but for right now FSR has suddenly become mandatory.

So what did you change? If you mind my asking.

=========

and you got my mind thinking - so I rebooted a few times and tested with several saves and made new ones. With the latest FSR the problem is no more.

Um, not much I think. The 4.1.2 I linked you to prints out a little extra data in the log file about which thread is which. At some point around 4.0.5 I became suspicious that some fairly basic code in OSR/FSR could, possibly, get confused about which thread was which in such a way that it would sometimes or always crash during startup, possibly only on Oblivion or only on Fallout, but I changed my mind and decided that was fixed or not a big issue in every beta released (I had some unreleased versions that were very unhappy for a few hours though). I was thinking that maybe your issue was related, but I can't make iHookPoint match up to much of anything, especially anything that would show up after the main menu is reached.

It's also possible that some change made between 4.0.7 and 4.1.2 that I forgot about had some impact. I don't recall anything relevant, but I don't keep great records of changes, just a code snapshot for the 4.1 release.

Do you have any suggestions as to how I would go about investigating/remedying this? I read somewhere that the card could be outputting 60fps while the monitor is running at 58.7 fps (for example), or vise versa.

I also read that uneven frame output is unavoidable to a degree (single GPU or otherwise) due to every 12th frame or so being dropped, but to varying degrees of noticeably (depending on fps, i.e. if your card is putting out 150fps it likely wouldn't be noticeable at all, whereas you might notice at 60fps). Not sure what to make of that.

I don't know much of anything about the subject. Try installing different graphics driver versions, switching monitors, or installing drivers for your monitor (personally, I've never installed drivers for a monitor and think the whole idea sounds kind of fishy, but I know some of my monitors have drivers available that windows update occasionally volunteers to install - give the nature of your problem, conceivably it could help).

You might also try setting FPS_Management \ iSmoothFrames to 2 in the OSR ini file. It probably won't make a difference, but on the off chance that it would it's worth trying.

Bump, for the same problem... .

Wolfdude-

after more thorough testing I found the issue more to do with mod conflcits than FSR.

Did you update or add mods recently? Fellout was the main thing that I updated that game me that problem.

Give more details.

Thank you I'll try that.

On another note, I'm not sure if FOSE is loading properly. I'm getting a "deinitialized" message in the FOSE log:



FSR seems to be loading, although I still experience fairly noticeable stutter after some play time, but that may just be because of lower framrates in different areas. I haven't really given it a thorough play-through/troubleshooting yet. Here is my FSR log (If I get one, it means that it loaded, correct?)

That message is written when Fallout exits, it's normal.

jason67:
That's not an FSR log, that's an FSR ini file. And it's an FSR ini file for an old version of FSR.

FSR logs show up in the Fallout directory, and have the file extension of .log (though some versions of windows will hide the file extension if you don't tell them to act sanely). The ini file shows up in the Fallout\Data\fose\plugins directory and has the file extension .ini (though, again, windows may decide to hide the file extension just to confuse you).

ini file = configuration that tells FSR what it should do the next time Fallout runs
log file = record of what FSR actually did the last time Fallout ran

My bad, I posted the wrong FOSE log. It's up to date, and even shows that FSR has loaded correctly. It was the "deinitialize" that immediately followed that threw me off.

Thanks all.

Thankyou.

OK last annoying question, I promise.

Here is the correct log file. Every things seems ok except for the bolded (couldn't open file...probably doesn't exist). Any idea why I'm getting that, and if it has any effect?

That's normal if the save was created during a Fallout run when FOSE was not enabled.

It may or may not be normal for saves created during a game with FOSE enabled but no FOSE mods that use certain types of FOSE script functions that require use of a .fose axillary saved game file. I don't know if FOSE will create such a file even if it doesn't need it or not.

No... . I've no problems with the FSR apart from the, absolutely random crashes that I've (and semi-everyone) with the obscure fallout 3 engine.

For the same problem I mean, the fact that I can't never reach to download the new versions of the FSR from the ftp site at which they are uploaded.

So I ask to you (SkyRanger-1), again, to upload the files whenever they are ready, both on this ftp site and to another http site. Or to explain me the procedure to download correctly from the ftp site you use. Thanks.

Everyone: Some guy on tesnexus see performance plummet when Hashtables \ bAllowDynamicResizing is enabled. Does anyone else see anything like that?

Wolfdude: 4.0.7 is up on tesnexus, has been for quite a while. There's no major changes to FSR since then. When OSR/FSR 4.2 is ready it will go up to tesnexus, but that won't be for a while. In a week or two I'll be on a different ISP which may or may not fix your issues. And I'll be sharing a (slightly faster, but still slow) line with a mission critical app, so depending how it reacts I may have to make alternate arrangements. But hosting files on my computer is convenient for high frequency releases in ways that tesnexus is not. I might get around to switching my server from ftp to http sometime, but it's not clear if that would actually help those who have trouble downloading from my computer or not.

This does not seem to do anything. The stutter i get is in the same place every single time. It seems to stutter always in the outdoors. When i get to a new place it will stutter a few times in different area's of a new location. bastheda ruins and springvale i have been too and they stutter a few times. I though this fix removed all of that?

if you don't think it does anything, you either haven't got it installed correctly, or your stutter is too bad to do much about. it's a stutter reducer really, not a stutter remover.

Im pretty sure it is installed correctly. I have Fose. i have the correct folder of fose> plugins. and i use the fose exe to boot up the game. My system is more than enough for this game. Just so annoyed with bathesda for being so damn lazy to patch their game. I bought 2 of their games for what? so they can stutter and run like dirt. If their next installment has these issue they are not getting another penny off me. Only tweaks i have made are setting fps max to 40 and min to 30.

I can't, or rather won't, run the game without this mod. Without it, there's stutter all the time. Some micro stutter like skipping a frame here and there which I find extremely annoying. With it, it's a silk smooth ride. However, of course it does not remove FPS drops due to loading tons of heavy textures, models etc. or if you have options turned up higher than your system can handle. It's a somewhat delicate fine tuning process to find the maximum amount of visual and content goodies that you can run without getting stuttering/bad game play. Of course this level is different for most people in what they will tolerate, and not.

Hello

My sr_Fallout_Stutter_Remover.txt says that i have a wrong version of the game :/

incorrect Fallout version (got 01070031 need 01070030)

I?have got the 1.7 version of Fallout and the Fose version 1.2 beta . FSR 4.0.7

I dont know what to do

My Fose.txt says

plugin C:\Program Files (x86)\Bethesda Softworks\Fallout 3\Data\FOSE\Plugins\\sr_Fallout_Stutter_Remover.dll (00000001 sr_Fallout_Stutter_Remover 00004007) reported as incompatible during query

regards

I had the same issues even with the stutter reducer. I finally left the stutter remover .ini set to default (30fps max), and turned off vert sync in the fallout.ini file. The GUI check box to turn this off does not work. You have to edit the fallout.ini file in 'My documents\My Games' folder. Change the entry iPresentinterval=1 to iPresentinterval=0. You may notice a little tearing in the video at first but after awhile your brain will 'tune it out'

Anyway, doing this made the game playable for me. And the average person can't tell the difference between 30fps and 3000fps.

Hi Skyranger, to answer your unanswered question above, I had some issues with having dynamic hashtable resizing enabled around the potomac between dukov's house and the the purifier. I have it turned off now as performance does overall seem smoother without it. Have you any suggestions for changing hashtable sizes? Awesome work by the way, you've made my game run beautifully.