I really hope Obsidian/Bethesda makes the CL in another game, and have a good story.

And what? More populated doesnt meant that few millions can destroy a powerful ang giant republic. so it makes no sense.

A nukes primary target is heavily inhabited cities mainly, so if you wipe out the most population = Less Resistance

I thought that was Bethesda's explanation to why DC was such a dump.

I am not sure if nuclear theory in relation to an invasion is the same in the FO universe as it was IRL, but if so, you are incorrect.
If a nuclear war had happened, the vast majority of nuclear weapons fired would not be aimed at cities. Military bases,
important infrastructure, communication centers, and America's own missile sites were the primary targets for the Soviets
if their intention was then to invade. Knocking out the cities doesn't help you at all if the enemy can do the same to you.
That is why most missile defense systems when they were being developed were planned to be deployed around our own nuclear silos
and military bases. You were safer, for example, in Pittsburgh than you were in Cheyenne or Colorado Springs.
Now, some cities would be targeted due to their vital role in the nation's transportation and communication. Atlanta and Kansas City would
be directly targeted. Many other cities would be heavily damaged as military bases are very close by, but by and large, if you live in a non-important
big city, you'd be saved from the initial attack.

MAD is what stops this from happening, but ths above is not MAD. Now, nuclear theory could be different in the FOverse, but where it
is a reality in the real world, the goal of a nationstate that wishes to invade another with the aid of nuclear weapons is not the destruction
of urban areas for the sake of resistance purposes.

Everything is a dump.

What invation are you talking about? China was being overrun by American forces. Chances are they launched their nukes because of "psychotic rage." "I am going down so I am taking you all to hell with me." The USA alone has over 2000 nuclear weapons so does Russia. More then enough to kill everything on the planet many times over. Fallout timeline the world went to hell. The Great War was just two hours of the world being nuked to cinders by every nation that had nukes letting them all go at once.

China has such a large population because in the 1950s it was reasoned that if there was a WW3, America and USSR would only have a few thousand survivors while China would have millions.

The Great War of Fallout was not an attempt to invade anyone it was "I am going down so I am going to take you all with me." When you have thousands of nukes you're going to run out of military targets pretty fast and still have thousands left over for the major cities.

There was something like what 12 nukes for Las Vegas Alone.

Styles, there were 77 nukes fired at Las Vegas, only 12-20 hit. (Due to house's "FIARINH MAH LAZAH!" moment.)

I knew I fogot the number but 77 wow. That just proves the point even more, thanks for the right number :foodndrink:

True not all 77 were for Las Vegas but also for targets in southern Nevada but Southern Nevada is not that big and thats alot of nukes.

You missed the point. I was responding to the post by Boradam when he said:
"A nukes primary target is heavily inhabited cities mainly, so if you wipe out the most population = Less Resistance."

Next time, I advise you to read the post that someone is responding to before jumping to a conclusion.

I was refering to the game universe.

Even in the game universe, unless nuclear theory changed absolutely, what you saw was MAD and not the primary use of nukes. One side fired, the other side fired in retaliation, and the first side(having failed to achieve operational surprise and therefore screwing the world), launched their entire stockpile.
Unless we know differently(and we don't), nuclear theory is likely not different.

It doesn't change the end result since MAD still comes into effect.

We don't know who fired first but we know the end result of the great war. Major Cities were priority target for everyone. Everyone was out to annihilate the other, not just military targets. You can't have suprise in a nuclear war, someone launched (most likely china) and therefore everyone knew they were done for so they launched as well. MAD did not keep anyone from holding back.

Surprise is more than achievable in nuclear war. Missiles launched from submarines and dropped from planes could hit their targets
before the silos could respond.

Not, mind you, before governments knew what you did. But it takes a minute or two just for the proper authorities to be alerted
to a launch on a good day. It would take more for it to be confirmed. More for a decision to be launched...and if you have fired the missile
through a gap in their detection, you can add five-ten minutes to that time. And in most cases, that is all it would take.

Surprise is achievable. It is just very, very difficult. Failure to achieve surprise results in MAD, like in Fallout.

Who says they weren't suprised?

I thought half the country was blown back a few centuries before America fired back (I'm not positive, nor do I know where I heard that, so don't ask)

The war was two hours long, and I'm sure it'd take more than a minute or two to get the message to authorities.

In our timeline America would know about a land based missle launch as soon as the silos open. As for subs they had/have a submarine detection system sonar set up in the Atlantic and Pacific Oceans. This was over 50 years ago. Fallout timeline with America's satellites I am sure they would not be caught by suprise. Also America was invading china which would give them even more of a chance to learn of any launch. Also we don't know who fired first.

Maybe Ameirca did. Members of the Enclave upset America was winning the war against China. Their plans would not happen, so they could have done it.

What we do know it lasted to hours and in that time the world was nuked to cinders.

The Enclave's primary goal was the absolute eradication of communism (before the war), and for this reason they welcomed nuclear war. However, just because they welcomed it doesn't mean they started it. If America was indeed winning the war in China (and by all accounts they were doing pretty good, just got bogged down on the way to Bejing), then my guess is that the Enclave would have had no problem in simply winning the war and dealing with communism that way (remember the Enclave is America).

The Enclave's beliefs in regards to nuclear war, was that if it would happen, they would have no problem with it because it would allow them to rise up from the ashes and rebuild the world the way they wanted, (i.e. without communism), and they had contigency plans for continuing the "war" following a nuclear holocaust. Following the Great War, the Enclave's goals shifted from fighting communism to fighting mutation, so that they could rebuild America the way it was. It seems to me then that if an organization is hell-bent on remaking what once was, then they are the most unlikely canidates to have destroyed what they had in the first place. Its also not as if the Enclave was able to assume power because of the Great War, before the war, the American government was the Enclave, the Enclave is simply what remains of the American higher-ups and soldiers who had been "in the know" about the Enclave.

When why didnt america attacked USSR? They were communists and they not only werent attacked by American forces they had diplomatic connections with America and citizens of this two nations could freely travel back and forth. They were communists when why didnt America attacked them?

1) It was not fifty years ago, it was 66 year into the furture

2) America was almost to Bejing and winning the war, why would they give up and nuke the place where their soldiers are? (They only way I see that happening is if they were already nuked and would rather the soldiers die then let China survive)

3)Well that's kind of obvious knowledge that I did mention in my last post... the Enclave wouldn't destroy what they had left, as other people have posted.

Simply put, because America didn't have the military strength to take on both Russia and China. Just because they weren't at war with them doesn't mean that America didn't hate the fact that they were communists. More than likely, had China been dealt with and American forces occupied/devastated China, then Russia would have become our new main rival.

I don't think that the Enclave's actual mission statement, or if it even had one at all, has even been mentioned. I always assumed that the Enclave was less an actual seperate organisation and more of a code-word or something. Even in Fallout 2, "Enclave" was used in a variety of different contexts from the Oil Rig itself to the organisation. Regardless, the Enclave, IMO, was just the people with the power before the war, the President and Cabinet, Military, US Energy Companies and Military Contractors, Media, the New World Order type group which operates unto itself, lying to outsiders to continue their own agenda. When nuclear war became aparant (even House predicted war some 15 years in advance) they objective became survival and continuation of government. I doubt if it has anything to do directly with Communism as an ideology but rather when Richardson talked about the "commies" just as general pre-war insult.

I agree with the OP. It did feel like they were testing the game. Plus they used a very simple engine; gamebryo. Maybe thats their plan. To use a simple engine to create the game & test it if people like it or not. Then if they do; use a much nicer engine.

And allow citizens of russia freely travel to America, and allow citizens of America freely travel to Russia. I found that your communism idea though makes some sense is completely unsupported by game lore and facts. Chinese were communists, doesnt initially make Enclave against communism. You might forget that the war started, or better said, the roots of the war were because of fuel crisis. Resources were scarce and China more when anyone needed them. America was also in the need of supplies and Russia had their own huge resources, but maybe in the time of 2077 not huge but enough not to go into war.

Surely it was because Gamebryo was the engine they were using anyway, and it took time to create a new one.

Fallout 3 was a test... of my patience.