Far back in the reaches of 2000 I found myself addicted to the most unique and darkest fantasy world I could possibly hope to imagine, filled with cutting-edge graphics (for the time, of course) and gameplay that required you to click the hell out of things in a very strategic way. Sadly, this game was not Daggerfall nor any Bethesda project but instead was Diablo II from Blizzard Entertainment. You may bash upon me for saying it's unique and such, but for the time I found the fact that a game was so openly dark extremely fascinating. When I went back (or forward) playing other, tamer fantasy games nothing really seemed the same anymore.

I think what really has grated me with a lot of fantasy of today is that they try to make it too fascinating and they end up looking rather corny because of it. The Elder Scrolls games have been able to (mostly) avoid this with the extreme emphasis on scale but running it through a filter of realism. There is only to a limit that filter can go though, and thus I look to other games for the truly gritty fantasy that I love. Morrowind had its dark moments but I felt it was ruined by the "weirdness" that was put too much on it. People acted rather comically in a lot of situations and it ended up taking away from the serious plights. Oblivion I actually felt struck more to home, if only for the Oblivion segments which really added a lot of weight down onto what was to some a "generic" setting. I'm not saying one's ultimately better to the other in terms of story, merely that the truly dark elements were muted in Morrowind.

Around comes 2007 and I think I found one game that hearkens back to old fantasy without being incredibly ridiculous (ala Dragon Age). The Witcher was an extremely deep RPG experience held back pretty much only by budget limitations. Sound familiar? bliviongate: Well, it was pretty much the extremely rich fantasy that took itself rather seriously and thus I loved it all. Those who understand my signature can also tell that I'm a fan of Geroge R. R. Martin's A Song of Ice and Fire series which, by the way, is some of the most terrifying stuff I've ever read.

tl;dr: I like really dark fantasy. Whilst Elder Scrolls has slightly shifted away from it in most people's eyes, I can still see the light (the dark?) shining for it through the quirks of the games. Thus, we bring ourselves to the topic at hand: Skyrim, of course. It's incredibly hard to tell exactly what the mood will be set by the story at this point since we only know the bare minimum. What we know so far seems well enough and will continue to advance on the themes of Oblivion with its advanced technology. How much deeper do you think Bethesda's willing to take it though?

It's no like I'm speaking in terms that it should be like Mass Effect where every single possible ethical dilemma is shoehorned in the story and forces you to make a "right" and "wrong" choice, but more in terms of the environment. I'm fine with the basic "yes" and "no" options we are given when it comes to the quests, for now. The whole purpose of all this and the explanation I suppose is to ask what makes fantasy so great for you? I, personally, find that the only way fantasy can astound me nowadays is to scare me. If I am frightened due to the environment or possibly an enemy or some ominous note or whatever, then I give that game a big round of applause. I want the atmosphere in Skyrim to be dripping with dark undertones and make me as scared of dragons as I have been of demons. Could Bethesda possibly turn these creatures of extremely ancient, and some may say generic, mythos and have them make we the playerbase afraid by what they do?

I believe Witcher 2 - due May 17 - will constitute the toughest competitor to Skyrim this year. It's an open world non linear RPG with a strong emphasys on storyline. Graphics look superb, the best i've seen on this side of the rpg world.

Where i think Skyrim has rhe edge is in stylistic terms and gameworld complexity.

Competiton is good. I have no doubt Bethesda will look deeply into Witcher 2, a strong contender for RPG of the year.

Indeed it is my most anticipated game thus far after the outrageously amazing outing I had with the first, but this is less about comparing it to other dark fantasy and thinking on how or if Bethesda will make it equal.

BGS also has the advantage of a bigger budget which is nice. I'm sure Skyrim is going to have tons of money poured into development with a very thorough and expensive marketing campaign. Don't think the Witcher can match that.

Great topic! I'm also fond of The Witcher's atmosphere, and a rather big fan of A Song of Ice and Fire.

In Skyrim, I wouldn't necessarily look for story. I'd look to take my own stories (whether they primarily be influences and inspirations, or events and characters of my own) into Skyrim, knowing (hoping) that the game's atmosphere, scope, art style, and gameplay design accommodate them in such a way as to let them grow and take shape seamlessly within that gameworld.

That said, I'm certainly sensing a darker side to TES in what we've seen or heard of Skyrim thus far. I'd encourage you to look deeper into Elder Scrolls lore, if you haven't already; you might find it's surprisingly comparable to the dark fantasy you prefer, and that Skyrim's story has the potential to bring out the best of it, returning to the lore-heavy atmosphere of Morrowind but set as it is in the home of the Nords... a very rugged and wintry place. Well, Michael Kirkbride (the man who wrote the words in my signature, incidentally) has implied that much, and I have high hopes.

What makes fantasy great for me isn't just to be scared, though; for me it's just the vastness of it. The possibility. That can be frightening, but it can also be beautiful, awe-inspiring, grim, humbling, sensual, or most anything else...


I see it too (it darkles more, the deeper you look...), but the main thing I love about TES lore -- whether fully taken advantage of in an actual game or not -- is its ambiguity. In a way, it can be seen as a wholly "light" fantasy, or as an utterly dark one, depending on how you choose to interpret it. And I think the open world nature of the games allows the same freedom - we can play them at face value, or we can inject our own visions of fantasy into the gameworld.

The thing as regards to knowing of the lore is that it's not something you do. I can read all about the gruesome atrocities of a faction during this war and how they were severely punished for it, but I haven't experienced it in anyway for myself. Also, it probably happened so long ago that no one who was there still lives and thus we only have a historical account for it, most likely written by somebody who wasn't there either. Simply knowing what one did a long time ago doesn't frighten me.

I do admit that the entire theme or tone of a story is set by atmosphere, which many games nowadays try to shy away from, but it also needs to be tangible. Perhaps I personally have just become desensitized to having a giant world around me that's supposed to intimidate, maybe because every time I booted up DII the world completely changed and thus I got used to expanses that I new only little about. What I would like is a living environment that exists during playtime that is tangibly gritty and evokes a true fear within me. As I asked above, will the dragons scare me? Will I truly want to flee at their approach, or is it just another big mob? Big doesn't always mean scary.