There are lots of thread comparing fast travel of Morrowind and Oblivion, but we can have other options so that if someone does not like one he could fall back to another.

One option can be a little bit of borrowing of a system that IMHO is the best of both worlds, and something in between the Morrowind method and oblivion method, i.e:

Two World's method, or their equivalent in TES series, The Ayleid Steps.

When playing Two Worlds, you may find several monuments scattered throughout the world's area, and each one that you find becomes active, when you enter an active monument, a map of the world opens and you can select another monument's icon for the destination and jump to that place, nice and easy, and immersive as well.

You have an Oblivion style fast travel, but you have fixed source and destination points, more accessible than Morrowind's method, because there are a lot of the monuments scattered throughout the land, some inside or near the towns and others on far-off lands.

And you have the oblivion's freedom to select the destination from the map, but you have to find the monuments to make them active before you can select them as destination, and you have to be inside one to be able to jump to another, and it is quite immersive and does not eliminate the need to travel on foot and random encounters.

IMHO this is the best method, and you can add Morrowind's method to this, for more immersion and more options.

And instead of the Two World's monuments, we can have Ayleid's steps, just like the mod of the same name in Oblivion, so if that is incorporated into the game engine and let us select the destination target from a map, then it would be perfect, and after a while when we reach some specific stages of the quest regarding those steps, we can have additional features, like random destinations to some deep dungeons and the like.

The quest regarding those steps can be started near the beginning of the games, and can be part of the main quest, or a misc one, and can be developed into a full fledged treasure hunting quest, or something like that.

If someone ignores the quest, (s)he would not be able to use those steps effectively, and would have problems with them, and would have to fall back to the Morrowind's style, until (s)he decides to attend the quest regarding those steps.

Another method can be like oblivion but with more options, so you can find rides, boats, carts and the like, and use them, a bit harder to use but quite immersive and opens opportunities for new quests.

What do you think? :deal:

I feel that "immersion" is subjective, and therefore the poll responses should not determine what is or is not immersive.

What isn't noticable to me might beat you over the head with the "THIS IS A VIDEO GAME STICK", while something that totally makes you feel part of the world kicks me right out of it.

Well, in your book, which one is more immersive, in a medieval environment?

You are a nord fighter, and you want to travel to another town, you can find a vendor and pay him for your travel, or you can open your map, click on a place on that map and jump right into that place. :mohawk:

I'd prefer a system similar to Morrowind's. Oh, and, by the way, Morrowind does also have the Propylon chambers, which work similarly to what you were describing with Two Worlds' way-points.

That's a question without an answer. Every game is different.

To me, for example, Morrowind's travel system reminds me I'm in a game quite a bit: I hop from Gnisis to Ald'ruhn... and can't walk an inch... but I can apparently board a giant flea and get to Balmora... where I am still laden down to the point of immobility, all through a little black and gold box that really doesn't feel like a conversaion, ticket window, or service. It feels like... an in-game menu.

On the other hand, Borderlands, the menu felt fine... but the travel itself is a bit jarring. Go figure.

Oblivion, aside from the initial city markers, actually feels more real than Fallout 3 for me, probably on account of the Pipboy being monochrome and otherwise clunky as a "pinnacle of technology" interface. See, when navigating, the first thing I need to know is where I want to be. (No, not where I am. Where I want to be. YMMV, but I can say from multiple experiences that it works better for me). So to that end, Oblivion makes my initial navigation step easy... and handles the rest. Fallout 3? too dense in places, makes it hard to find my destination. It actually doesn't jar me as much, on account of "no menu at all".

That said, none of them are "really great". Ideally, you'd have a game where you don't even WANT to fast travel...

To each his own?

Just now a theme for a Morrowind style fast travel came to my mind:

In the start of the game you find a town, a settling or any place which has a stable, you ask the attendant that you want to travel to another place but he says that the roads are unsafe, and he can not help us.

You ask him that if you can make the roads safer, would he be available for travels and he would answer for a fee, yes.

So you start to kill the baddies in the roads, or remove other obstacles from the roads, and persuade the governments to add patrols to the roads, and make roads safe one by one, so that new destinations are added to the travel systems of stables.

When you clear the roads, you can find the stables at the other end of the roads and find a way to persuade them to join the travel system,

Sometimes a new event might close a road again and you have to find a way to remove the obstacles to make the road active again.

Sometimes wars, or conflicts between governments close the roads in between, and you have to find diplomatic ways to solve the problems at hand, and so on...

Edit:

I had forgot about those chambers, but they were not that much, if a similar system were developed but with more target places scattered troughout the land, then it would be great.

Anywayz, it would fall under the Ayleid Steps line.

Morrowind: Find a vendor and pay for travel, immersive, harder to use, encourages random encounter and detailed landscapes.
Ayleid Steps: Find the steps and use, immersive, not so hard to use, encourages random encounter and opportunities for new quests.
Rides and boats: Find your rides, carts or boats and ride them, immersive, a bit harder to use and opportunities for new quests.

All of the above. Morrowind also had the Propylon Chamber system which was sort of like the Aylied Steps.


I would like Mark & Recall to return, the Mage Guild travel, Boats & Coaches and an Aylied/Propylon Chamber of some sorts can round it out and if they are well placed then Fast Travel would have less of a reason for being. More precisely, I'd like to see a quick way back to town nearby after quests.

As "mark & Recal" can fall into the "Another Method" line, you can check all the check boxes except for "Oblivion" and "None".

Random encounters and the level of world detail are not encouraged or guided by any travel system. Those elements are guided by what the designers and artists want. Also, the only thing new about quests made available by any of these travel systems is the opportunity to use the particular travel system. I enjoy Morrowind's systems (including spells), but making repeated trips to out-of-the-way locations can be a hassle, so supplementing them with something like Oblivion's fast travel would be nice.

Unfortunately, it seems a number of players have unfairly made Oblivion's Fast Travel their whipping boy for everything wrong with the game. Besides being highly convenient, it can be made into something interesting and immersive, but sadly there are those who believe that the only way to deal with it is to stand it up against the wall and shoot it dead.

Something like the Ayleid Steps, if done right, i.e. place way-points at all the right places, can enhance the game-play, and be almost as easy to use as the Oblivion's fast travel, and it can be quite immersive if it has the right story behind it.

You know, given the differences of provinces, it is like Cryodiil is a place to use fast travel, Morrowind is a place to use many boats, silt striders and magic... I really like them to have more than one province and show how drastically different they are... even the means of fast travel. Let's say this province is filled with Propylon Chambers but they are like stargates and NPCs going and coming all the time but when you travel to another province, what is that, everyone is using flying mounts!!! That would be more interesting and offer more interesting choices. You can go with the province's common methods. (or I would find a flying mount and use it for fast travel even in Morrowind. )

All in all, Oblivion still can use some boats..

Brilliant!

All the above options including the spells, and different parts of the land can have different themes for the execution of the ideas. It would enhance the sense of exploration when you enter an area.

You see different culture and different means of travel, like riding an insect in morrowind, but have heavy usage of magic in a land populated more by Altmers, and something like Ayleid steps in another place, and so on...

This would be a bit like Morrowind's differect culture in different towns.

You forgot Daggerfall's fast-travel system in your poll, which is nothing but the enhanced version of Oblivion's system, and a very good compromise between Morrowind and Oblivion.
In it, you choose a destination where you want to go. Then you choose, if you want to go there "reckless" or "cautious" (the first is faster, but random encounters are more likely), if you want to sleep in inns or camp outside (the first is safer, but more expensive), and if you want to go by horse, by ship or by foot (which definitely affect the speed of traveling, and I think the better ones become available only after you purchased a ship/horse, but I'm not so sure).
Anyway, in the end you have a certain chance of random encounters, a certain duration of your journey and a certain gold/hour cost for your journey.

This system is incredibly realistic and it's fun, and it doesn't feel like cheating at all.

Concerning Oblivion's and Morrowind's travel systems: If you ask which one is more realistic in a medieval setting, the answer is of course Oblivion's. Because in a medieval setting, you didn't really have transportation networks. In the end, the question is moot; because we have a medieval setting in Oblivion without much "out of the ordinary" stuff (at least at first glance), but a high-fantasy setting in Morrowind, in which a transportation system is fairly realistic (you can easily imagine that it kind of evolved from the circumstances).

Each game has a fast-travel system which makes sense - the problem with Oblivion's is rooted in gameplay, not in realism. It is boring and feels like cheating. (The only point where I would argue that OB's system is unrealistic is the missing Mages Guild transportation, because that kind of transportation in Morrowind was introduced by the Imperials, so it should have been there in Cyrodiil as well.)

You want realism in a game with daedra and cat-men?

Ayleid Steps is not really a substitute for Oblivion's fast travel. The main purpose of Oblivion's fast travel is to allow the player to fast forward to the end of his character's trip. It is more fair to the character (and consequently to the player) than are Ayleid Steps and Morrowind's systems because it acknowleges the primary mode of transportation used by characters -- feet. It follows the same principle as fast sleep, fast dress, and fast eat. It is a service to the player alone, not to the character, so it is not right to exact a price on the character for the player's using it.

It can be fairly debated that Oblivion's fast travel does indeed also benefit the character, for the character is guaranteed a safe journey. The best solution, however, is neither to drop it nor to compromise it, but to make it better.
Have a character's navigation skills and tools, or a guide's navigation skills and tools, influence how successful he is in hitting his target. Have the player's choice of whether to travel cautiously or recklessly, and the character's stealth abilities and encumberance, influence how long the journey takes and how likely it is to remain uninterrupted by hostile encounters. If hunger, thirst, and fatigue are factors in the game, then factor them into fast travel too.

Hey, I live in South Philly, so I'm surrounded by trolls all day long.

Fantasy monsters are real, trust me.

:rofl:


... Then again, you're also a member of Bethesda's forums... I agree with the realism of trolls!

..another one?

how about a mix between morrowind and oblivion, you can only travel from towns, but you can travel anywhere on the map as long as you are dropped off at the road, no small paths, so if you want to travel to a location out in the woods you would be dropped off on the road between the town you are traveling from and the town that is closest to your dropoff

I disagree with the pros and cons you've given the specific fast travels. I want mounts and traveling services to be the source of fast travel.

I agree with this, if you mean what I think you mean. Picking a location on the map and saying "lolplzgo" isn't my idea of a immersive fast travel system.
Silt Striders, carriages, horses, mages guild teleportation, etc. That's how I want travel to be in TES:V.
You wanna talk about being realistic? Ok, lets talk realistic. I hear the argument, "Well, I can't carry all this lewt from the dungeon to a city at once, so fast travel location to location from anywhere is needed!!!!"
I don't know about you, but I sure as hell can't fit 4 Daedric Katanas, 3 Dwemer Longswords, 6 Ebony Pauldrons, and 594,049 gold pieces in my back pocket.
If you want a realistic, immersive fast travel system, then you have to look at that realistically. Drop some loot, and make 2 trips if you must. That's how you do it in real life.

That is pretty much what I meant, although I didn't find anything gamebreaking about Oblivions fast travel, it needs to be worked on. When I say mounts, I mean that a mount kind of works like a mobile fast travel device with a chance of random encounters depending on the mount.

i chose another method. I like morrowinds system but id like an option after i finish the climix of a question to fast travel back to where i need to go to finish the quest. Example during the fighters guild in morrowind: having to travel to sheogorad from khuul and than walk back to khuul before being able to catch a ride to ald ruhn. this way we can keep immersion and not waste alot of time going to places.
My Second option would be a daggerfall system where i pay a certain amount and can fast travel to anywhere i need to go.

This argument pops up way too often. Every time it does I die a little inside.

you must be a lich by now then :laugh: