I like the NCR, but I'm not liking the idea that it is now effectivly THE force in Fallout.The eastern BoS, with lil Arthur Maxton, seems to be getting set up to become THE Brotherhood of Steel, rather than an offshoot faction. This is backed up by them just getting bigger and stronger through FO3 (unless you destroy the Citadel). They need their 'rival order/corrupt knights' as a mirror/counterpoint. I think that as long as the Brotherhood exists so will the Enclave; and both are iconic Fallout factions. I really missed the Enclave in FO:NV.

After a lot of thinking and looking at the wiki, the East Coast Enclave was the remnants of the West Coast who relocated. The Enclave also does have a form of goverment; and we have never even seen, let alone killed, anyone but a couple of presidents and military commanders through the two games the Enclave appear. Our kill-counts can be impressive, in the hundreds, but this is the remnant of the entirity of the whole US Goverment - which knew what was comings and had plenty of time to prepare. There could very well be thousands of them, if not hundreds of thousands.

There are still many places that the Enclave could dwell. They may very well be doing a BoS and be waiting in massive underground complexes. They could be in any of the areas in the US we haven't seen in a Fallout game. In New Vegas, if they introduce it, I wouldn't be surpised to see they are keeping quiet in Area 51. Their vertibirds gave them amazing range of transport for the wasteland.

No, I think we haven't seen the last of them on thinking about it. And, if we have, I think Bethesda may be making a mistake.

The NCR are all well and good but i have to admit I don't find them enthralling; nor did I find the Legion that interesting, so aside from the fate of the Mojave i'm not hoping to hear more about them. There arn't a whole lot of large factions that are intersting in New Vegas (imo, of course). Playing the Enclave Comander mod in NV is a joy. Watching six men with Gatling Lasers take out the ENTIRE Legion Fortress by themselves was amazing. As was calling in a missile strike on Caesars tent. The Enclave are the 'awesome badguys' with all the superior tech. It'd be a crime if they are gone. So, at this point i'm just deciding til proven otherwise that they hold other areas of the wasteland. =D

Your thoughts?

No, they only resided at the Oil Rig at San Fransisco's coast and then moved to the East (Somehow magically), that and Navarro along with Chicago outpost were the only areas they resided in.

The Enclave is dead, now stop beating the damn thing.

No, the Enclave was the shadow government not some monolithic organisation that built bunkers everywhere; it would be as small as possible to keep itself as streamlined as possible. The Enclave "doesn't have a form of government", it is the US Government. It was never an offical organisation, many members of the pre-war establishment were secretly members however, they retained thier power post-war and dimply kept the government going. Hell the Enclave, as a shadow government, was rendered obselete when the bombs dropped and all but they were killed.



Yeah we've only killed a few Presidents, big deal right? The Oil Rig in Fallout 2 was going to launch a virus that required a vaccination, the virus would travel worldwide and kill everyone not vaccinated; the Enclave needed a massive chain of supplies from the mainlanders to get what they needed. Therefore, an Enclave bunker is Kansas, or whatever you are suggesting, would all be killed. The vertibirds have an operational range of several hundred miles.

From President Richardson, President for 6 terms:

{273}{prs54}{You could try, I suppose, but soon the staff of the Enclave and Navarro will be inoculated.}

I hope they never come back as anything more than remnants. Including them in a major role again would turn them into the Bowser of Fallout, which is a seriously stupid idea. I want a new villain every game.

Pointlessly aggressive much? This is my first post on the subject here. If you want to be an ass take it elsewere. I made this thread to discuss things, not get accused 'beating the damn thing'. If your going to be that way I just won't give you the time of day.





Hmm, intersting. Goods points and intresting - but slightly flawed reasoning. Assuming the Enclave are in contact other bunks could easily have their own scientists cook up some vaccine. Just because they were a shadow goverment doesn't mean their resources or numbers were limited. Again, the US is a BIG place. Thousands isn't an outlandish number, especially if they took a portion of the military into isolation with them.



I can understand that to a point - but then what about all the 'good' factions? You could say the same about them. Hell, the NCR has been around since the first game, of a sort. Brotherhood certainly has. As have the FotA and so on. What makes the Enclave different that them still exisiting would be beating a dead horse?


I made the thread to get some interesting discussion going; so hopefulyl there will be a few differign opinions.

Whats the difference? they aren destroyed neither defeated, The Enclave, along with the WBOS and the Master Army, are just a remnats of the past glory, an army of them is trhowing the lore out of the window, again

NCR was in FO2
BOS exist since FO,
FOTA only appeared in FO1 and NV

Why would the Enclave not be in contact with their other bunkers, if their goal is too survive the war and then rebuild America, being out of radio communication might complicate that don't you think? As I said, the Enclave needed a chain of supplies that stretched all the way across California just to make enough stuff, and it all came from Vault City in the end. Unless all these bases have convienient stockpiles of medically advanced societies near them then they aren't going to make anything; assuming of course that the Enclave decided to build all of their bunkers with biological warfare laboratories.

They operated behind the scenes, they were the power behind the throne; all they needed were key people in key places to make sure what they needed to happen, happened. I don't see how they could have been so huge as too have built multiple bases, all of which have enough genetic diversity to last centuries. Also, no other bases are listed on the http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/PoseidoNet channel, Strategic Air Command, NORAD, the ENCLAVE itself, Navarro but no connection to one of the other bases which you propose? I'm sure that you may respond with, "There is no Raven Rock either", in a prelinanry reponse, Raven Rock had nothing to do with the Enclave pre-war. Eden himself says that if was a Continuity of Government base, an official bunker, the Enclave of course were not official and had there own continuity of government plan which was why Raven Rock was uninhabited until sometime in the 2250's (I reckon).

You could slap the, "We haven't been there/we don't know whats there," arguement onto anything; maybe the Commonwealth have built a time-portal, travelled to the NCR and installed an android to the Presidency as a puppet government which worked for them. Can't prove me wrong right? "The US is a big place," arguement has been used before, on this very subject infact but as far as I am concerned it can be used for anything and, unless you can back the idea up with some kind of reasoning (like you sort of did but I disagree) then it ain't worth anything.

I... can see i'm covering old ground here, that potentially has a lot of ill feeling behind it. Don't suppose there are any old threads with long debeates I could read over? Being honest i've found this thread unpleasant more than the interesting discussion I was going for. Infact I think i'll lurk on this paticular section, and restrict my posting to the Elder Scrolls forums. No offense but people here seem pretty abrasive. Thank you for that last post Enclave.

Talked to death it certainly has been that's for sure, in the Fallout Universe section, The Enclave is not Destroyed (the first thread).

Much appreciated.

When one sees the same topic two times a week it tends to get on someones nerves, I don't want to be a [censored] but why the hell do people keep making these god damnned threads?

Because people who haven't been here for the previous weeks thread don't know about that, honeslty want to join the community, and start with a thread about something that interests them after scanning the first 3 pages and finding nothing on the subject. Frankly with the greeting I got with this post my gut reaction is that its not a community worth being a part of if people have such a lack of patience with new posters. People asking the same question over and over is a sign of a good forum population; it means people who haven't been around have just arrived. And probobly leave just as quickly.

Oh and don't forget The Enclave is not Destroyed II: The Sequel.



You have to understand Alixen, that this topic has created some ill will amongst the forumites, and not just because of differing opinions. Ususally when these show up, you have people who create havoc by falling back on the opinion that "You old dinosaurs think you know everything but you don't" (dinosaur being a degoratory term for orginal fallout players of 1 and 2).

Anywho, if you check out the two threads on this subject you'll see what I mean.

Welcome to the Fallout forums by the way.

Yup, found those now, but I was looking in this section as I'm not familair with the site. Interesting read. I suppose i'm going to have to re-fit my NV Enclave character in my head to be from Chicago and only have a dosen or so troopers at her command. Or perhaps be a carryover from a heavily modded FO3 where the Enclave won, but Eden didn't get his way.

Thanks for the welcome. I think.

The Enclave summed it up well :foodndrink:

The Enclave is now nothing but remnants of Remnants outside of Chicago. Their outpost most likely was built on the way to DC as a relay, fuelling station so they can talk to Navarro from DC.

Maybe they will ally with MWBoS under Barnaky :shifty:

With that in mind, would you perhaps like to take the thread in a new direction?

You'll find that if you wish to discuss aspects of the Enclave or the lore behind them, that's when the really interesting threads on the Enclave come about.

Nah, thanks. Kinda got beat into submission by the initial barrage. I'm not holding any ill-will thanks to followup posts; but still don't have any real desire to continue the thread.

Shadow governments have to eb small by definition to remain in the shadows. To not get known. We have killed them twice, technically 3 times, now seriously stop beating a dead horse. The NCR have been in since the beggining and continue to be in because they have never been killed.
Their resources are limited because this is after a nuclear war and there are no that many of them. The Enclave should not return adn hopefully will not, if tehy do, I will stop playing fallout.

How about dead?

Sorry for the bad welcome, but many people show up and says things like you did, sometimes with bad reasoning, and when we tell them that is not the case, or that can't be, or it's contradictory or doesn't make sense or whatever, they get aggressive and all that, defending their suggestion even when we put forth proof from earlier games et cetera. We, in turn, get annoyed and tell people to stop flogging the dead horse (the Enclave), we assume people have some experience from out forums here. Also, it's the internet. It's easy to be an ass behind the monitor


Maybe so, maybe so. I didn't know you were a new user on the Fallout forum. I see you are an old forum user though since '07. And then you may expect that you would have some previous experience with the Fallout forums, who would know? Anyways, as I said, we get annoyed of the same suggestions over and over, gets tedious, and then we throw out somewhat inpolite answers.

I suggest you use the search button up in the right corner instead of skimming through the pages of the forum


We slapped that term on ourselves after being called that alot


Yep. Agree to every word he wrote.


I'm still hoping Bethesda will make a game of your story based on the Barnaky ending
I mean, the Enclave in FO3 clearly has taken inspiration from the MWBoS! And they are all fascists.

Guys, what if the enclave come back as the zombie enclave?

Never changes, people still complaining about mass topics in forums.

Personally, my opinion is just the Enclave is mostly dead with Remnants scattered sparseness in the West and 98% disorganized in the East. As for the Dinosaurs, clearly no one remembers Warhammer's Edition changes comparing to FO2-3.

always though it funny that people get upset that the same topics get made over and over.

what did you expect?
How can you come tot he sam e place for years and not expect that the same subjects will happen, and how hard is it to not reply?

Then it would be time to nut up or shut up :gun:

:toughninja: