Your confusing real life with a game. The characters of Brink don't even fit your description. The girls wouldn't be "chubby" they would be exaggerated just like the males.


Why does it have to be a fat chick v. a muscular guy? Its the art style, they can make big girls without making them "chubby"

I agree, female avatars could be made to have an appealing look regardless of size. No need to make them "chubby" Brink has talented artists and would have very few issues in that regard imo.

I think their biggest obstacle is handling the "Heavy" body type with women.

Devs are always reluctant to add what is generally considered unattractive female characters. It's chauvinistic, but it's true. you just don't tend to see burly, heavy weight women in games.... which would be a REQUIREMENT in order to match heavy body type.

That's a potential problem for some.

There is also the technical issues. Women move differently then men. That means 2 times the animations for every body type. Proportions also tend to differ slightly (arm/leg length in proportion to the torso length) which again, alters movement animations.

ANyways, I totally agree with the OP... obviously we all know that release won't have it... and we can bet fair odds it won't make it as DLC either (though that would be bloody awesome)

Hopefully having more of the ground work done already for Brink2 will allow more dev time to increase character customization to include both sixes.

BUT WAIT! We can't leave out trannies! we should have 3 sixes to choose from

http://c3.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/38/l_6d04e19e2a2c4d41bc0920c626b1ce9a.jpg

http://s.bebo.com/app-image/8129033745/5411656627/PROFILE/i.quizzaz.com/img/q/u/08/09/07/Fable_2_Female_hero.jpg

I didn't say it wasn't possible....

it is a challenge for artistic devs though for some reason (probably legitimate reason... what do I know? I'm a lowly php programmer )

I would highly reccomend the developers to include females in the game, otherwise:

A: Female players won't fully enjoy themselves
B: Inconsistencies with the plot (Why aren't there any Female Resistance or Security?)
C: And some bit of sixism

If it's too hard to include it with the original product, then have it as a DLC, preferably cheap or free,
because we do know the guys at splash damage and bethesda are working very hard with this game.

@Wyatt Waste Ranger
Sure it wouldn't be problem to add heavy females with the size of a male, the possibilities are endless.
As I allready stated in my first comment about that topic, I fully trust in Brinks art department, because it's one of the best I've seen for a really long time of gaming now.

However, you said in Brink everything is exceggerated, now what are the typical features of a woman?
Right, slim body lines, less mucsels than a male, a bit shorter in size -> other hitboxes.

Again I do not say that they could not find a solution for it but it would be difficult -> more work.

Another thing is that I reffered in that comment to chubby characters, in a game like Brink in general, not about the possibility to make females with the size of a heavy male.


All in all it still comes down to the other agrument of mine, that if they would leave out heavy girls they would save themselfs a lot of work and that would raise the chace to see them implented some time.


However there is the chance, and I allmost hope fore it, that Brinks design team will stay true to their principle, all or nothing.
Because right now for me that team is really a dawn of hope between all those money orientated companies pumping out shiny games that most times seem lack most what the soul of gaming once was...
I really hope they have succes with it, I may enter that profession too some time and it would simply be nice to finally have a valid paragon to go after.

/sentimentality ^^

Anyone play City of Heroes/Villains?

MASSIVE character customization (though a tad dated now)

males & females...

BUT!

The "brute" body type was MALE ONLY


They could do the same...

however in CoX size only affected ease of clickyness, not chance to hit/hitboxes... there was no extra HP etc....

ie; no in game difference...

here, there is a diff, so leaving out heavy females would short them of a playstyle.


Fable 3's females do big just fine IMO

so what if the "heavy" female class is disproportionately larger then life... the whole game uses surreal proportions anyways!

How about this http://img.thesun.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00443/SNN2832VIK_280_443693a.jpg?

I think a female "Heavy" archetype could only be achieved through massive body armor.

Actually that's a pretty good solution. I still think female models is a waste of time at least until balance is achieved, the game is optimized and the SDK is published.

Obviously just don't put heavy females in the games, leaving an entire component of your game 2/3's complete will definitely make it look good.

Whats this, an exaggerated female without a pinched waistline or tiny muscles,

http://s.bebo.com/app-image/8129033745/5411656627/PROFILE/i.quizzaz.com/img/q/u/08/09/07/Fable_2_Female_hero.jpg




What is everyones opposition to heavy females? I seriously don't understand, it would not be hard to not pinch the waistline. Get the stereotype of a petite female out of you head. It would be no more difficult to make a heavy female than it would be to make a light female.

The devs mentioned that size was an issue, although from the perspective that women tend to be smaller then men and it wasn't fair for them to have a smaller hit box. However I don't think they've ever mentioned that the Heavy body type would be difficult for women and they also said that the hitbox/size issue was something they'd largely figured out.

You are correct that adding women would double the amount of animations and that's a considerable amount of work given SMART. Even greater than this would be doubling the art resources which seems to be the primary reason women were eventually cut - they couldn't double the amount of artists and animators they had and they didn't want to halve the options available to you by splitting their resources between men and women. The art resources are already divided in half by faction, if they add gender as well each individual character would only have access to a quarter of the total available options and the amount of individual character customization would be much smaller after initial character creation.

Besthesda Softworks ( or rather the sub-sector that made this game), made a decision, they didn't not think about female characters before they started making their models, they decided your demographic wasn't worth the extra resources, there was no "well I guess we can't do them now that we've invested so heavily on mail designs" games are made years in advance, we heard of brink how recently? Either way they either decided you could deal with playing male characters, or that you would have to live without playing their game, and in the current climate of crappy game design they knew most would settle.

Corporations are not friends, they're not neighbors, they're money farming machines, this one just runs on games.


Also in the interviews you hear a lot of "anyone whose never played a first person shooter" so they're also marketing to even wider markets, even if it doesn't work you can see what I'm addressing, gamers are a resource to companies, they're not trusted long time friends, even valve isn't your friend they just perpetuate that trend and it works for them, its marketing.

Er, none of that is correct.

Splash Damage did consider female characters before making their models: not only have they mentioned this fact multiple times but they've mentioned making concept art and discussing solutions to several issues they expected to encounter. This was a feature that Splash Damage cut, not something that they initially decided against.

I also doubt Bethesda made the decision, from everything we've heard Splash Damage decided they didn't have the resources to commit to this.

I think people are under-estimating the time it takes to make good quality assets (lol) Not feeling the anti heavy-female vibe, either. The art style in brink looks pretty damn good, and with a green light and enough resources and time I'm sure the artists could accommodate various female forms at some later date (through DLC I suppose)

and they decided it wasn't worth the resources, the fact that they've mentioned thinking about something does not alter the end result, its just a means of making the community feel like "they tried" I do not know if you are obligated to tell the truth so ill leave it at that.

So wait, your implying that SD lied about attempting female characters? Just to appease the fans by saying, "Well guys, we tried our darnest but we just couldn't fit females in" Thats not far fetched to you?

Ignoring what has been said in the last few pages about size and all, i wouldn't mind brink 'not' being a sausage fest. just saying. because not all of us swing or roll that way, know what i'm saying? :foodndrink:

Tho some of us are gentlemen and show mercy to women IRL,
we don't have to show mercy in game! (ye i thought of this randomly, does not relate to my first 2 lines.
no intention of offending anyone.

Intent is not a requirement of offense

but none taken...

OT: We already know that the primary reason they were left out was resources. Be it File size on disc (which could truly ONLY limit 360 really), or animator work hours (the real issue I'm sure). The OP says as much and does not expect it to be added for launch.

The question is is it worthy of DLC?

I can't imagine the DLC being a profit maker... while they could probably charge a FEW bucks to add female characters (everyone DL's.... only buyers can use them though) I doubt it would be enough to cover all the work it would take.... who knows though.... 100,000 people buy the DLC at $5 (that's a low number on both sides I think) that's a half million dollars.... I think that adding female customization could be budgeted to a half million dollars.

They'd prolly sell much more then that too.

Though I hope for just $5

Possible since f.ex. Security must wear shirts(possible Body armor with things like the Bug/ the bomb[new meaning ho] or just figure obscuring like the Freak), Resistance on the other hand has no shirts making several heavily traumatised people on the battlefield though it could work with stuff like tire armor and stuff that the resistance already has + they're living in what can generally be considered Poverty so a woman there probably woudn't be as "well kept" as a Woman in the Security as they have access to more water, better food would be doing a lot of labor etc.

But if they released it on DLC I'd have no objections to that because then they woudn't be splitting their art resources for the development as they'd have all that on hand after it all comes out anyway, and a little variety never hurt though I most cerrtainly hope that choosing either gender has no downsides/benefits or we may have some people simply rolling one gender because "it's the better one".

Honestly, I really don't see it as a feature worth the extra time that could be used on designing new maps/weapons, or something else with a meaningful impact on gameplay.

I mean, if Splash Damage had decided to design this game solely with females, as long as everything else was well done, I sure as hell wouldn't deny myself of an awesome experience even if I did care whether my character had a Y-chromosome or not. In addition, if I enjoyed the game, I'm sure I wouldn't find myself going "Man, I wish I could shoot at dudes!" instead of "Man, new maps/weapons would be awesome!"

Also, I don't remember seeing an ex-Team Ninja member on the Splash Damage roster - meaning jiggle physics would be way less fun severely compromised.

Female characters is not wasted time...

for #1... it would be done by the character animators and artists... not the level designers or weapon balance team. Yeah, they are also responsible for weapon skins etc.... but cmon.....

#2 it DOES add to replayability.... designing and leveling your new female chars

#3 it would make some players happy.....


Of course we would like map pack expansions etc.... but I think you undervalue more character options....

I, for one, would prefer they added female characters then to double the male options again..... that would be a more appropriate DLC comparrison.

Obligated to tell the truth? I was referencing developer comments, if I was lying it's quite easy to check on that (the FAQ has a link). If you don't believe the developers that's not my problem. However there appears to be absolutely no evidence to back up your original claims or your new claim that Splash Damage is putting on some elaborate charade about this issue - unless you can provide that please stop posting this misinformation.

While what I said may have somewhat implied that implementing female characters would be a waste of time, it wasn't what I meant. I was just saying in comparison to OTHER activities the developers could be focusing on instead it isn't as worthwhile. My apologies if there was a misunderstanding.



Instead of time, I probably should've used the catch-all term "resources," meaning not only time, but money and whatever else as well.



Meh... While I can't speak for designing one, leveling a new female character wouldn't necessarily require much time due to that fact you can transfer XP from your other characters to her.



Sure, but I'd be willing to bet it would make a much a larger portion of players happy if those aforementioned resources were used on something else.



It's not that I undervalue more character options - after all, I'm certainly looking forward to regularly tweaking my character's appearance - it's just that the addition of even more character options isn't as high of a priority to me as the addition of new maps is.



If Splash Damage was deadset on introducing additional character options and these were the only two options... I'm undecided at the moment over which I'd prefer.