And neither did Vault 87. They didn't know that either. But they knew it had some sort of strength and endurance enhancing properties, which would be ideal for post-apocalyptic survival.

And Vault 87 isn't all that different from any other Vault, not much would have been required to re-fit it. Vats to hold the FEV, a filitration and distrubtion system, and some misc equipment and databanks. Thats it. Perfectly doable in a few months. :shrug:




I disagree.

I do agree that Fallout 3 got some things wrong in terms of staying true to the originals lore, but I don't feel Vault 87 was among those points.

Necropolis was to see what would happen if they didn't seal the Vault, this could have been to see what would happen to people given radiation directly. Then they decided that this test was not necessary and shipped FEV there, and the rest is history.

How many years did it take to build a vault? decades? How long would you think it would take to completely retrofit an underground maze to house the right equipment? you'd have excavate and then knock down whats there and the rebuilt in the chambers. I'd say thats more then a few months of work. The only other explanation would be they knew about it before it was possible to know.

All Research means all research. To create an airborn FEV, that would have been done at Mariposa. It would have been done in the months before October 23, 2077. There would have been no time to make Vault 87 or retro fit it. There would have been no reason to make Vault 87, since airborn FEV would have been created at Mariposa, it would have had areas to test it. To study it. Mariposa was build just for FEV and all its research. This would include airborn FEV.

There would have been no need to make or retro fit Vault 87 because Mariposa would have been able to house it and have the means to study and test it.



This ^

I say those chambers were for radiation testing but they felt FEV was more important so they just installed FEV canisters.

The Vault in LA was for Radiation testing. A lab meant to test Radiation and a lab for airborn Virus are totally different and you need alot of retro fitting. An entire Vault would have to be gutted and rebuilt. That would take many months.

Also Mariposa would have been the birth place for the virus from Fallout 3. This means that Mariposa has labs and the means to house it and study it. This means Zero reason for Vault 87. Also All research was sent to Mariposa.

The word All has no other meaning. All measn 100% of the research was sent to Mariposa.

No time to make it.

Plenty of time to retrofit it. Unless you can come up with evidence to back that statement up.




1. Mariposa didn't have the means to study its uses in a post-apocalytic world of re-settlement.

2. The government may have feared that the location of Mariposa was compromised and would have been a target of a Chinese nuclear attack. The base and its location was likely not secret, but what it housed would have been.

3. Vault 87 is hidden, and can survive a direct nuclear hit. It also allows for an excellent test environment.



"All" can have several meanings depending on the context.

Another factor could be the time the statement was made in relation to the FEV transfer. FEV was transferred from Mariposa to Vault 87, not West Teck to Vault 87.

The statement isn't as ironclad as you assume.

It could have easily meant all West Tek research.

There was no other research at the time, that's why the government nationalised it.

Or it did mean research but Vault 87 was just testing.

Actually I do think now that it did indeed mean "all" reasearch.

All research that was being performed at that time. I believe the transfer was made after that statement was made. And the lore on 87 confirms this as it says that FEV was transferred, from Mariposa, to Vault 87.

Building a Vault takes Years. Retro fitting would take years as well. There was no time at all. You can hold on to that idea that there was time if you want. :rolleyes:

1) Mariposa would have been the birth place of it. Means all the equipment was there and all research was going on there! The over all goal of FEV was to make supermen, not to study how it can help after a nuclear war. They would not have risked a leak in security for such research.

2) Maripsa was built because they feared West Tek was compromised and it was. Mariposa was not because it survived. If they feared Mariposa, their new secret building was compromised then all their stuff would be feared compromised, including vault 87.

3) Mariposa was new and was not hit, therefore it was safe to say there were right to keep research there. IF they thought Vault 87 was go damn safe why did they not have all the FEV at Mariposa moved to Vaults? Why build Mariposa in the first place. Just move it all into Vault 87? They must have been confident in Mariposa.



So you believe they build and or retro fitted a vault in less then 10 months and moved research from a base made just for ALL FEV research to DC? Very stupid writing and it makes no sense at all.

The afterthough I had was it was all research, and FEV was just being tested in Vault 87 (no research).

I have to go with Styles here, if you go by the Vault 87 terminals the overseer is [censored]ing about being under pressure from Mariposa. So they had the time to retrofit the Vault, mobilise everyone into it before the bombs had even dropped and begin experiments to the point that Mariposa was getting impatient?

I'm guess test results of the first few test subjects.

Testing and research are the same damn thing! You test to study which is research. It is all the samething :banghead:

You come up with an idea. You make up a test. You study results. You come up with a conclusion based on results. This is research

God I hate when people twist words and fudge facts to fit things that make no sense. To try to cover up stupid mistakes made by others. This is why War.war never changes. To many people that can't take facts for what they are and drives other crazy.

I assume you are a Vault tec engineer then? Elsewise I need to see a quote or some hard evidence. I'm not just going to take your word for it.

Vault 87 doesn't look any different from any other Vault aside from the "testing labs" room. And even that equipment looks like it would have taken minimal effort to put in place.



I fail to see how providing the higher-ups at Vault tec the information that FEV was being used at Vault 87 would have consituted a leak in security, or a risk of it.

And its seems logical that a substance that enchances physical aspects would have been considered beneficial to life in a post-apocalyptic world




Mariposa didn't survive very long and it was compromised.

I seem to remember the rebellion of certain commanding officer.




Why would they need all FEV moved to Vaults? Why not keep some at Mariposa and some in ONE Vault? What is illogical or unrealistic about that?

This ^

To add to that. All before Mariposa even discovered FEV's effects on people and all under 10 months. The timeline does not add up :facepalm:




@ Lt. Andronicus, what do you mean Mariposa did not survive very long? Have you played Fallout? It was still there, 100% untouched, which means it survived, which means China or anyone else did not know about it, which means it was not [censored] compramised!!!

Vaults take years or decades to build, not months. This is also Fact!

Twist the meaning of words and facts all you want.

Yeah talk about being chronologically confused :blink:

Getting impatient and worried that the work may not be completed, but I don't think that necessarily means that they didn't have time or shouldn't have had time.

Mariposa didn't know when the war would strike, but they probably had an idea that it was imminent.

I think it also states that Vault 87 only opened up for residents only a few weeks before the bombs fell.

You are looking at a 10 month window for all this to be done. It is not possible. It makes no sense to even move the research.

You said Mariposa was compramised and "did not last long." It survived. It was never compramised.

You are twisting facts, the meaning of words and trying to make something fit into a 10 month window of time, when all the evidence shows it just isn't possible.

Still you can think what you want.



Why would Mariposa be upset with Vault 87? didn't you say the research at 87 was different then Mariposa? Clearly it wan't. Mariposa would have had the means to do all the stuff going on at Vault 87. If Vault 87 was retro fitted, in just 10 months.

Yes of course I've played Fallout.

But the research didn't continue after the Great War began correct? It was compromised in the sense that the information was leaked to the soldiery that FEV was being researched there. Thats a breach of security.



I never said Vault 87 was built in months, I believe you are twisting my words.

I said it was retrofitted slightly in months.



Styles, I have a feeling this debate is becoming hostile quite quickly. And I didn't mean for it to do so.

It may be best just to agree to disagree and be done with this. You know that I often agree with you concering Fallout 3 criticism (aside from this instance) and I dislike hostile conversations.

Mariposa was never compromised. It was moved from West Tek to Mariposa in 2077 because the military thought West Tek was compromised. Mariposa was built just for FEV research. All FEV research.

Vault 87 would have taken years to make or retro fit. FEV and it's abilty to make super mutants was not known until just before the great war. So how can they build/retro fit an entire Vault in less then 10 months? Why move it to a Vault when you have Mariposa?
FEV research into making super mutants was only for the last year or so before the war. Before that it was just a means to find a cure for New Plague.

I think it is best to agree to disagree with you. I don't like being this hostile and toward you of all people. I am sorry :foodndrink: . Still facts are facts and I feel very strongly that they are against Vault 87 as a whole.

I can understand your position, the same as I understood Okie's. :foodndrink: To be perfectly honest, I do believe that FEV was never really intended to be found anywhere other than Mariposa, I think thats clear. I suppose I am defending Bethesda's use of a loophole that I believe they found, and perhaps thats not really worth defending in retrospect.

Anyway, "I may not agree with what you say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it".

It is good to debate these things, its just when two sides start repeating themselves over and over it can get heated. I need to do better at keeping my cool.



Agreed :celebration:

Agree to disagree is sometimes the only way to end things peacefully :foodndrink: