Does anyone know where one could find the Ideas and Suggestions for what turned out to be Oblivion?
I think it could be interesting to see exactly what people disliked about Morrowind, and what suggestions Bethesda actually implemented.

Probably long gone by now, anything older than a year doesn't have a chance of surviving the forum upgrade.

Topics get deleted from the forum as they get older, and as you can see by looking at the last page of General Discussion the oldest topic is from 2009. So a topic from before 2006 is long gone. But I'm sure if you asked older members of the forum that were around before Oblivion was announced in 2004, they might be able to tell you what people were suggesting.

I don't have the initiative to look myself right now, but I would suggest http://www.archive.org/web/web.php. I've found quite a few long-gone web pages through it.

I have a general idea of what was being suggested, I'm just curious about some of the little things that never actually got changed, and I never expected to find them on this site.
Thanks for the site Rhekarid, I'll have a look.

M'aiq the Liar gives hints as to what was suggested, but was not in Oblivion.

I was around at about 03, on and off, on a different account.
I participated in MANY threads, that actually involved devs posting in, during the development of TES:IV. I remember talking specifically with MSFD about the magic system. People were requesting the ability to shoot more than one spell at the same time, people requested the ability to be able to shoot spells without having to put your weapons away, things like that.
As far as combat goes, I can't really remember a whole lot. I remember a LOT of people complained about the compass though, when it was first revealed. They thought it cheapened the game, before they even played it. :rolleyes:
A lot of people requested fast travel, too. Now it seems like everyone is against it. I remember some just random request too, in the threads I participated in. Some like:
~Target dummies that raised your skills in weapons
~Dummies that you could put your armor on as a display
~Mounted Combat
things like that. Good times. Too bad the game turned out the way it did

Hehe, you can go back to 98'.
http://web.archive.org/web/20030801073402/www.elderscrolls.com/index.php.

People really never are satisfied, are they?

Which Oblivion did you play?

Mounted horse combat didn't make it's way into the game, I know M'aiq addressed that issue, and I know it was suggested. Wasn't there even some petition for it by Elder Scrolls fans?

People complained about being overpowered at the end of the game. So we got level scaled creatures.

People complained about confusing quest locations. So we got the compass.

People complained about missing sword blows, so we got auto-hit at 1/10 damage.

People complained about reading too much, so we got 1/5 the dialogue, all of it spoken by 3 people.

In short, Bethesda made two mistakes. One, they listened to the loudest section of the gaming population, which is invariably the dumbest. Two, they came up with solutions that were also dumb. I will withhold judgment however until TESV comes out, although in the last interview Todd Howard game he did nothing but sing Oblivion's praises, which was very annoying.

If it were up to me, I would have...solved overpowering (which happens in a game where you ultimately kill a god-like being) by slowing down the leveling process, not speeding it up but at the same time doing the same to enemies.

I would have...never made a compass, but simply made sure dialog given in quests was clear and accurate, increased the view distance (which was bound to happen anyway) and make the in game map more accurate.

I would have...animated a difference between a hit and a miss, besides the reaction of the target being hit...and maybe included some explicit dialog such as "If your sword skill is 5...then you will hit something with a sword once for every 20 friggin swings."

I would have...ignored people who don't like reading. If you play games with elves and yet cannot stand to translate written symbols into human speech, you are the worst kind of person and the world needs as few of you as possible. At best, I would have only voiced as much dialog as I could without sacrificing total amount of dialog in game.

There..there is so much truth in this post I..I don't know what to say. I have a tear in me eye.
:eek:
But seriously, the sad thing is, you're exactly right. Beth listened to the whinny FPS players who likes things HERE and NOW as FAST as possible, and made the game with that mindset. Sad, really.

I joined in 03, don't remember anything.



Just for the record, not arguing with you.

I remember a bunch of people applying the things they loved from Morrowind's mods to what they wanted Oblivion to be.

For instance, lot's of people wanted something similar to Better Bodies, Dual Wielding, Marriages/Romances, Mounts, More realism (Having to eat/Clothes being heavier when wet/A bajillion other things hardcoe RPGer's love to put themselves through), a joinable Dark Brotherhood, Scripting on par with stuff like princess_stomper's, Expanded Cities, and Other playable races.

Just off the top of my head.

And of course the numerous upon countless unending posts demanding MMO (full-out, mini-games, stores, etc.) that locked so many threads.

Whenever a new MMO thread popped up, I swear I could actually hear the moderators heads explode... A very sickening squishy-thump like noise.

Oh the flames burned so bright on those days.

Many different things were suggested, and there was a lot of complaining and some very, very loud complaining too, just like now. We still don't get to play flying werewolves with spears, do we?


Good places to look are in interviews, such as you will find in the http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Oblivion#Previews_and_Reviews at the UESP. Another good place to look is in the Developer Quotes links here at http://waiting4oblivion.com/developer_quotes.html. I doubt you will find much along the lines of "We did this because our fans requested it," but you will find some comments about how fan input influences game design.

Then Bethesda made the mistake of appealing to them in any way with Morrowind. FPS players are the majority, and Bethesda will have to listen to the majority because that's how they make the most money. It is sad, but what can we do? Bethesda is a business. However, I wouldn't go so far as to say Oblivion was designed for FPS players. Oblivion seems to still be too complex for many FPS players and Oblivion is still an RPG.

Agree. I have been playing RPGs way before some of you guys were born, so yeah Oblivion is an RPG.

I have a lot of complaints about Oblivion. However, if I hadn't played Morrowind I would say it was the best RPG ever. It just fell short in the series, I feel like they mixed An Elder Scrolls Adventure (ala Redguard) with Something in the series like Daggerfall...which, I admit, a proper mix is ultimately the goal. But I think either smaller steps, or larger steps that are better defined.

I'm still waiting for a game you can play online on the Xbox that's essentially Call of Duty: the Crusades: You've reached the rank of Squire! You have unlocked the Boar Spear. You've made ten kills with the Boar Spear! You've unlocked the Bill Hook for the Boar Spear, extra chance to dismount an enemy!

Basically a first person hack and slash, similar to the PvP of MMORPG but real time. Everybody has the same health but you can get better armor, weapons, perks such as more damage done by bows/axes/etc.

It could be called TES Adventure: Imperial War. You build w/e character you want but you are in a fixed storyline, no side quests but a branching storyline. First mission would be a pitched battle on an open field. You'd attack/defend a castle. Do a night raid to sabotage....poison wells, burn a temple, assassinate a general, all depending on what your characters good at.

It would attract people not normally attached to the RPG genre, but would not alienate former players as it is not an official part of the series, just a foray into a different medium, almost like Fallout was.