I kinda agree on this. I'm playing as an old Southern Aristocrat with a twirly stache hearing him talk like Mr young and handsome is a little off putting at times XD.

However for trying to do one voice that can match all types of characters, I think they went pretty much as far as you can go- that's pretty hard almost impossible to do.

So only the original creators of a program / game universe can truly love it?

ADDIT: last couple posters, very interesting! Thanks for sharing your thoughts

Only six more hours and I too can savor it.

I know almost nothing about digital voice files. I wonder . . . might it be possible for a mod (along the lines of RaceMenu) to allow players to modify the players voice?

I'm guessing that, every possible thing the player character can say is recorded in voice files, right? So that means, the engine can _handle_ player character voice files. Which may well mean that, mods can either modify those files or change them out for other files? Conceivably, mods could even restructure the structures that interface player voice files with in game stuff (selection menus, explosions, movement, whatever) and add additional categories of voice/sound files?

IMO, it's a big step up from FO3. But NV does story, RP mechanics, characters and writing better.

I like weapon / armor degradation for a number of reasons; one: it was a significant helper in managing inventory; two: it was a break from live action; and three: it felt right in the game environment, giving purpose to low grade items and allowing you to repair up to sell for more caps...BUT...(and I never thought I'd say this as I was extremely critical of the modding system prior to playing it) I think I'm enjoying the mod system way more than monkeying around with repairing items. I have more variations of a pipe rifle than I can count, and there are still more things I can do...so the gameplay value now is: things that had no real purpose or intrinsic value in previous games, now are extremely sought after because they yield a screw; I still get a break from the action; giving higher grade weapons to settlers to upgrade the usually low-grade crap they carry is a plus; or I can sell just outright sell a virtual metric ton of high grade modded weapons and convert them to caps.

The only thing not addressed for me personally is inventory management benefits while in the field...I absolutely now have to resist the temptation to pick up the 20 pipe pistols/rifles I will undoubtedly come in contact with and a normal "outing"...or go ahead and collect them and drop them in a container to pick up later. Tough choice for me, and not a typical game mechanic for the casual gamer (however they are being defined here).

Not only a step forward, but a big step forward as far as I'm concerned. The bonus in all this is as extensive customization mechanic than I've personally ever seen in a game. If the cost for all this was a little one button repair mechanic. I'm good with that. Like I said, that's anything but a step back.

You're being very selective with how you're reading my post, but yes. Only the original creators of a program can truly love it like it is their baby. There's a big difference between giving birth to an idea and appropriating an idea.

"It sort of felt as if our child had been sold to the highest bidder, and we had to just sit by and watch." - Leonard Boyarsky on the Fallout IP being bought by Bethesda.

I won't comment on anything argued prior, but that is simply untrue. I'm an adoptive parent, and I can assure you beyond all doubt that I love my adopted child as much as my own biological children. Just adding perspective.

Perhaps, but bringing it back to the realm of art, I certainly feel more passion for the songs I've written than any covers I work on. No matter how much I try to make the cover "mine".

That may be true for you, but it is hardly a universal truth. Not trying to be antagonistic by any means, because I don't think it will really go anywhere useful. I simply don't accept statements wrapped in the covering of absolutes when they run contrary to my experience. And I still think Bethesda loves Fallout, just not in the way their birth parents may. Bethesda is fully capable of loving it like it is their own, even if they want to raise it differently.

Getting deep.

Or, perhaps, not.

yeah i guess is a case on both ends. For me the Voice protagonist make it feel more connected to the game

The new map is amazing, i love the Weather Effects.

New crafting system is super deep same with armor and settlements. Combat have improve ALOT.

Im love the degradation system is gone since it was horrible.

And this new perk system finally fix the issue with Skill (i could be 100 gun with 1 Agility and kick ass with guns weapons.)

But yeah i hate in part the new dialogue system. I hate when i ask something i cant back and ask something else. i wish the system was close to ME or DA where u can come back to the preview option to keep asking.+

Still i think Fallout 4 is the best game till date. I love it more that F3 that i was in love wiht that game, and alot more that NV that i think it wasnt that great.

Which was all I meant by my original statement which was sort of selectively pulled.

No it didn't. With the exception of heavy weapons and explosives there is not a single weapon perk path that requires more than 2 in a SPECIAL attribute. You can still kick ass with pistols with 1 agility or deal out max unarmed damage with 1 strength.

Well I don't mean to pick a fight or try to make your position look bad. But I lean toward what the other guy up above was saying. I think that "adopted" parents can love a "child" just as much, maybe even more than biological parents. I think the same thing _can_ be true for art, particularly for narrative art like role playing games. I don't recall exactly who owned Fallout to begin with nor the circumstances under which they sold the rights . . . I can imagine depending on how those things play out that some feelings can get hurt and it seems you are referring to that.

I acknowledge that, sometimes a firm will purchase the rights to an intellectual property, and treat it like a Cinderella, but I never actually had that feeling about Bethesda and Fallout.

I have played Fallout 1 and 2 (I like 2 better as the visuals in 1 are just so low res) and I liked the "feel" of those games. Reminded me of old school "Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay" from the 1990s. Honestly though, I thought Fallout 3 did an even better job of "elaborating" on the themes in Fallout 1 and 2. Fallout 3 really felt like a "world" to me. The kooky alternate-retro world that was presented in 1 and 2 seemed to me more alive, immersive and 'believable' in 3 than it had seemed in 1 or 2.

I guess if you really think that Bethesda, or more specifically the producers, writers, programmers, artists, and other developers who worked on Fallout 4 "do not love" Fallout as much as its original creators did, we just have to agree to disagree. But in playing Fallout 3 (and to some extent New Vegas) I've always picked up on a real love of the universe on the part of those responsible for the game.

It's true that strength did affect melee damage... but the thing is, it didn't matter if you have low strength! If you upped your skill in melee damage, it would easily cover for your lack of strength.

And the +damage perks require you to have a certain amount of points in that attribute in order to get it in the first place. In FO3/NV, you could have a strength of 1, but as long as you pumped points into melee, you didn't need strength.

Firstly, I don't really have the energy to get into a Black Isle vs Bethesda argument beyond saying: Bethesda misinterpreted the already established setting and tone. That some people like their version more is neither here nor there, and I think the newcomers to the series need to at least acknowledge and respect that the old-timers' discontent is real. That said...

Do they love Fallout as much as the original developers? Maybe. Do they love it enough to interpret it correctly? No evidence there. But those are all intangibles anyway. Remember, just because you love your child does not automatically make you a great parent.

The writing is [censored] terrible. There are bits and pieces that are good, but overall, I found it to be just awful.

Don't get me wrong, there are some GORGEOUS and AMAZING set pieces (especially with the BoS and their side of the main quest), and of course the world itself has been pretty fun to explore, but the writing just falls flat. From the way to story is presented and how it flows, to the lack of personality with NPCs (they are either bland or binary in their emotions and how they come across, MAYBE with the exception of Danse I suppose).

At this point, I really just wish Bethesda would do a joint Fallout with Obsidian. Bethesda could do all the world building, and Obsidian could write the story and characters.

It's not bad as a game. A poor shooter but that's what you get from Bethesda. My favorite shooter is Stalker, so I am biased.

It's the horrible UI that will keep me playing ESO for the foreseeable future. It will get fixed by mods eventually and I'll play more. As well the movement in ESO is so much better that I fell crippled in F4. Weird invisible barriers I have trouble jumping over, my play is extremely kinetic, and this stuff drives me mad.

I'll be back when it's not as klunky an experience.

And now instead of being able to do that with 1 strength you need a grand total of 2 to be a melee master. That's not much progress.

They took a step forwards in many aspects. Definitely a step backwards as a Fallout game.

After playing for quite a while I can confirm what others were saying. This game is not RP friendly. You could RP a character more easily in FO1,2 almost 2 decades old games. Seriously go play them and compare dialog, choices, reactions etc. The voice acting makes it impossible too, at times. Degradation - a feature which strengthened RP is also gone.

I will not even speak about the atrocious scripted fight at concord but unfortunately the whole area there represents more or less most of the rest of the game. RPing an evil character here's what I get:

-No dialog option was even remotely covering my RP. All choices were more or less the same.

-The npcs are soulless and don't react much, even if you try to make them react via dialog - being a jerk etc.

-Your choice matters not. Either you help them or decline the quest or they stay there forever until you get the quest.

-Since I did not have much choice I got the quest, got the power armor and minigun, things which obviously were placed at the start to cater for the pewpew players who will exclaim "awesome, I am a badass now!". To me, they had the opposite effect.

-I tried to kill them after the quest, turns out they were immortal.

-To add insult to the injury, [minor spoiler] as a very convenient coincidence, one of them is a seer and tells you about your destiny in a way my 10yo nephew could make it look more believable.

I guess the biggest reason I am disappointed was that, after Fallout 3, which was after all their first, I expected them to improve the series staying faithful to the basics. They seem to want to "modernize" the game in a way which most old fans will not like, so nothing can be done about it.

About skills, well, I already talked a lot about their removal and pointed out a thousand times that they could have improved the system with skills present like many popular mods already have done. And as I posted in another thread, in the future, we will be here again having the following conversation:

I have to disagree fallout 4 is a step in the right direction in alot of ways. And just so much more fun than fallout 3. The whole crafting system and building system makes me want to explore every nook and cranny. And the the wilderness is so much more alive and so much more going on. Im so glad i dont have to keep checking my weapons and have to keep repairing them. Im no casual by any means but i play games for fun and an escape. And this game does such a great job at being just that.

Bethesda games are meh, its the modders/players who turn it into WOW games.

If Bethesda should have done anything in FO4 is providing a TON of elements (=possibilities) with easier access/tools/knowledge for modders and the most casuals so they face a pleasing task when getting to bend/shape/edit the game. That dialog thing sure seems to be a big shot in the foot for Bethesda. The basic goal/storyline is a real lackluster for me as well.

Didnt buy this one yet cause its in "open beta", in 6 months it will probably be playable (maybe a little cheaper too) so I shall reconsider.

In time I'll probably come to hate Bethesda as much as I hate (act)Blizzard nowadays, a company that used to care about games and gamers but shifted its focus to the almighty $$$.

Anyway Bethesda is just a company, they will never possess the "know-how" that true gamers have, cause companies are run by suits.

So you've already worked out the damage formula for how much damage you do per hit with every point of strength?

The removal of ammo crafting among other well implemented ideas in the previous titles is a let down indeed:(

http://imageshack.com/a/img905/3351/lrwAka.jpg

An interesting topic and actually involves some mature, thought provoking responses rather than a flame war.

I think the OP said it when he mention about the nature of gaming today. It's changing, for some of us old(er) timers... we think its bad.. but that comes with the territory I guess. Kind of like the old Star Wars fight ala People VS George Lucas. Those of us who grew up with Fallout are very protective of the brand and the way we think they should be.

I'll also second what others have said, the game, itself, isn't bad - but it isn't the Fallout game I wanted and waited for. Fallout is one of my favorite IP's, and I have accepted some of the changes... from the old isometric really involved RPG to the modern 3rd person story fps... I loved 3 (which most won't even consider cannon), and I liked NV, because they still had that Fallout-esque feel. This one doesn't, yet, but it may still grow on me.

I think my original point was that the nature of the gaming industry has us in a catch-22.... we buy the game because we want it, but then we are upset with how it turned out. Well, because they sold X million units, the game is considered a success... so they try to make more games like that in the future. The cycle feeds on itself. And that is one of the big reasons I am anti-mod... I shouldn't buy a game to depend on the modding community to make it how I want it. Yes, it is a neat future and makes for some really interesting player content, but it also fuels the sales of the unfinished game and sort of lets the publisher off the hook. Just look how many complaints get a response of 'oh, wait for the mod.'