There is a question that has been in my mind for a while, now. While we have free will, are our decisions really all that free? Even though a person can choose to do something, don't our personalities and values dictate what we do? Don't our mindsets dictate all that we do? Whatever path people choose for anything, they only choose that one path, and if time was rewinded, wouldn't people choose the same path over and over again because they are who they are? Since people only go one way through life, how do we know that we truly have free will? If time was rewinded, I doubt anything could change one's decisions except for an outside influence, but what could be possibly be an outside influence when everything is part of the same world? Since people only choose one path, how do we know that we really have free will?

Psychologically, whenever we 'make a decision' our subconscious has already decided. I'm indecisive about everything, so I assume my subconscious is broken.

But, yeah, your subconscious has biological free will based on what it's been conditioned to like and not to like. Or if you're like me, then you have some weird thing going on.

A MAN CHOOSES
A SLAVE OBEYS.

That is all... :whistling:

I've thought about this some, and it only ever ends up with me having a headache. Personally, the only thing that would change a decision I've made is some new knowledge, whether that comes from an outside source or from me thinking about something differently. (Of course, this would put us right back where we started...) If I have the same mindset, knowledge and thoughts that I did have, I'd imagine I'd do everything the same way over and over.

:cold:

This is a very deep and thought provoking topic, but I'm going to choose not to post an opinion.

OOOOOOO SNAP I JUST PWNED THIS

The short answer: Yes.

The long answer: Yes, yes we do.

Either we do, or we don't, but it feels like we do and we can't prove we don't. Both options are quite possible.

Non-issue :shrug:

I feel like this is true. Just 'cause a different part of our brains has already decided before we feel like we've decided doesn't mean decision doesn't occur.

Exactly. And it's usually in my nature to elaborate, but I went against that. It's been proven.

There is no way to determine empirically that a person has free will. Conversely, there is no way to prove that a person doesn't have free will. One could say that a person's actions can be predicted successfully by taking into account everything that has occurred across their entire lifespan (plus with a healthy dose of psychological knowledge mixed in) but this view utterly disregards the internal processes of the mind and brain.

As mentioned by others the subconscious may make its decision before the conscious mind becomes "aware" of the decision, but the conscious and subconscious are not distinctly separate entities that are simply housed within the same physical construct. Either way, simply because there is some lag time between the subconscious decision and conscious awareness of that decision doesn't negate or prove free will exists.

What if you just went against your nature because you are trying to prove a point, making you contradict your usual self? You took one path, and one path only, so how can that prove that people have free will? Your reaction is due to the events happening, and you still have only chosen one path. How can anyone prove that you really could have elaborated on that now that the time in which you reacted has passed?

No.

(Yes, I feel like a bit of a [censored] but it's worth it! )

You chose to choose the opposite of what you would have chosen. I don't see the problem, you still chose to take that choice.

How do we know she would have chosen to do something else when she didn't?

We really can't.

Short answer: ... again, NO.

Longer answer: You don't.

Regardless of the answer, does it matter at all whether or not humans have genuine free-will? We all think we have free will. We all act as if we possess free will. Questioning whether another person has free will is an exercise in futility, pure and simple. We cannot know if a person would have chosen A or B if given the chance again. And even if the person chose A every single time it still does not prove or disprove whether that person has free will. It is true that a person, their concept of themselves and their actions are created by the environment they have grown up in, combined with minute differences in brain formation... but that does not negate or prove free will. It simply allows that the persons actions can, if you know enough about that person, be predicted with relatively strong accuracy. That fact still does not prove or disprove the person possesses agency.

:wacko: Error: cannot compute

Anyone who has posted saying they know the answer - doesn't actually have a clue. As this is one of the most difficult (possibly insoluable) ongoing problems in the whole of philosophy, it's one of those things where the more you know about it, the less sure you become. Hence anyone who says they know the answer has obviously never read a single thing about it. It doesn't take long to learn why this is an enourmous problem with no good answer.

It's always the simplest answers to questions that take your mind back behind a dumpster and do horrible, horrible things to it.

I've come to emotional terms with the whole free will thing. I feel like I feel like I choose, so I just tend to believe that that's what I do and move on to other topics.

Yes!

To your first question, Yep.

So what about pre-determination?
Yep

As far as I can tell, no one here has stated explicitly that humans have free will or not. As for myself I've taken the middle road and said that we don't know - and it is unlikely that we will ever know.

At this I'm going to say that we should be really careful as to not let this topic get into religion.

But generally I agree with you. I'd say we have some degree of choice, but outside powers definitely influence this, usually passive. Even something as simple as a someone's reaction to something small could end up influencing something larger, and the choice you make because of that may not be what you originally intended. The little things can totally alter the way you see and think about things.

Well that's good then. I haven't read most of the posts but I just assumed someone would. I'm on phone and the text is tiny, bad zoom func

Ah, don't worry. IHaveafatdog and I have held up the free will camp quite nicely. Don't worry, we're playing fair.