[Georgine Lee]

I don't see the problem here can't you just not use the fast travel system and get over it if you don't like it?

[Marcin Tomkow]

I don't see the problem here can't you just not use the fast travel system and get over it if you don't like it?

That's sort of like saying if you don't like that combat system than don't use it (which I'm sure some people actually do), but that doesn't get to the point. What they are trying to do is find a middle ground so everybody will be happy. It's not enough to ignore a feature that a game is somewhat built around (quests being made with fast travel in mind).

Also I don't think the people on here opposing Oblivions fast travel just don't want fast travel at all. Usually people just think it was implemented terribly, and would like a more creative immersive fast travel system.

[Solène We]

I don't see the problem here can't you just not use the fast travel system and get over it if you don't like it?

The only other option to fast traveling is walking or riding a horse. Sure, Oblivion has a pretty landscape, but we don't time to walk from one place to the other, and those of us that don't like Oblivion's fast travel are stuck with either using it or traversing the same terrain over and over and over again. I've got nothing against fast travel, but it should be implemented as it was in Morrowind, with travel services. Oblivion's Cyrodiil is simply not big enough to justify a Daggerfall-esque fast travel. Especially when Oblivion's fast travel has no penalties.

So really, as I've stated many times in the past, the argument of "Don't like it, don't use it." isn't valid.

[Kayla Oatney]

So really, as I've stated many times in the past, the argument of "Don't like it, don't use it." isn't valid.

It is invalid in response to claims that Oblivion's fast travel needs improving or that it needs alternatives. However, it is often valid in response to "Get rid of it."

[CHangohh BOyy]

Eh Hem buddehs
Hmm id Say Fast travel is awesome but you should only be allowed to fast travel to any major city regularly.
Then Every mages guild has its mages guild teleporters. at a cost equal to distance needed to travel.
Then secondary travels like boats or silt striders maybe it depends on the area
and then also 5 mark locations. You would use Recall to bring up the list and then choose which one you wanted.
Using mark would create th exact spot you could recall to. Certain places would be unmarkable to prevent cheaters messing around ness.
Then You would have Mark/Recall = Mysticsm Spell Lv25, and Potions//Scrolls
Recalling takes Some Mp,But all your Fatigue leaving you weak for a bit so it has a side effect.
So yeah i know its been said but i just stated it a bit more clearly lol
also i was thinking of the tome thing from oblivion, They were way to rare and it seemed like a horrible download
but maybe in Tes5 tomes would be all over the place, But you would need a certain lv to access and learn the spells from them.
1, 25,50, 75, 100 // that means 5 levels of spell tomes to learn from which could be rewards or special treasured loot found in dungeons or earned from quests and they could be leveled so you would get a better one depending on your level.
Horses though should be harder to get killed, the regenerate, and are faster and maybe you should be able to customize them
almost like the horse armor thing but better where you could change it out as well as being able to enchant your horse, name it and make it a pack mule
id say they could hold up to 100 pounds and then be upgraded to 250 at a rate of 25 pounds for gold. maybe add a revival or summon spell if your horse dies or dissapears so you can get it back just in case. =]
my only problem in the landscape of oblivion was the dang hills, they were a pain it was hard to get up and if you used a horse all it did was fall and die really fast. my friend played oblivion and hated it cause he wasnt really smart and kept falling off the deadly hills which are eveyrwhere.
Tes5 should have some rolling hills but it would need plains. and should be diverse like Morrowind which had over 6 areas of different land types
where cyrodill only had i think about 3 or 4. maybe but it was still awesome.
hmm and Deer, Does should run but bucks should be bigger and attack you. yay lol

[Nauty]

I don't see the problem here can't you just not use the fast travel system and get over it if you don't like it?

The existance of an Oblivion style fast travel system would make the game much harder for me to enjoy. I'll be honest, I'm a lazy person by nature and I tend towards doing things by the easiest method possible due to this, since there was an option for me to freely teleport to any location that I'd already been to, I didn't really bother to explore the game world. Also having minotaurs and other strong enemies spawning right on the roadside everywhere I went was a pain. What was good about the morrowind system was that there was an opportunity cost for using the fast travel versus walking (which was in itself a more pleasant experience because it wasn't hard to outlevel most of the roadside encounters, thus making them less annoying)

So the most important thing imo is to give the FT system in the next game a sense of balancing consequences - paying for travel / buying a spell vs fighting off the creatures in the wilderness.

Consequences in the system encourages exploration and makes it feel like less of a crutch imo..

[Dean]

It is invalid in response to claims that Oblivion's fast travel needs improving or that it needs alternatives. However, it is often valid in response to "Get rid of it."

I don't understand what you're saying.

[Jani Eayon]

The existance of an Oblivion style fast travel system would make the game much harder for me to enjoy. I'll be honest, I'm a lazy person by nature and I tend towards doing things by the easiest method possible due to this, since there was an option for me to freely teleport to any location that I'd already been to, I didn't really bother to explore the game world. Also having minotaurs and other strong enemies spawning right on the roadside everywhere I went was a pain. What was good about the morrowind system was that there was an opportunity cost for using the fast travel versus walking (which was in itself a more pleasant experience because it wasn't hard to outlevel most of the roadside encounters, thus making them less annoying)

So the most important thing imo is to give the FT system in the next game a sense of balancing consequences - paying for travel / buying a spell vs fighting off the creatures in the wilderness.

Consequences in the system encourages exploration and makes it feel like less of a crutch imo..

Exactly.

[~Amy~]

I'll be honest, I'm a lazy person by nature and I tend towards doing things by the easiest method possible due to this, since there was an option for me to freely teleport to any location that I'd already been to, I didn't really bother to explore the game world.

So going places you've already been counts as exploration? And what teleportation spell was this?

[gemma king]

So going places you've already been counts as exploration? And what teleportation spell was this?

If I have already been to Azura's Shrine, and I want to go to Dive Rock, I'll fast travel to Azura's Shrine. This cuts out the exploration I would have done with the different route I would have taken from Cheydinhal. The spell was known as "The Fast Travel Map".

[Carlos Vazquez]

If I have already been to Azura's Shrine, and I want to go to Dive Rock, I'll fast travel to Azura's Shrine. This cuts out the exploration I would have done with the different route I would have taken from Cheydinhal. The spell was known as "The Fast Travel Map".

So instead of choosing to travel from Cheydinhal, you'd rather have no option but to travel from Cheydinhal. It sounds like you're not that interested in exploring if you're cutting it out yourself.

The fast travel map is available without using spell points, and with no teleportation spell in the game, I'm pretty sure the map isn't magical.

[Mariana]

So going places you've already been counts as exploration? And what teleportation spell was this?

FT feels like teleportation to me. At least with silt striders and things I could sort of pretend that I was getting a ride whereas in Oblivion I found it much more intrusive.

As Hircine pointed out, FT allows you to use previously explored locations as shortcuts to areas. It was very easy to teleport to a nearby location and skip the journey entirely which, while great for convenience probably lessened my enjoyment of the game as I didn't often stumble upon things unless I went out of my way to make things difficult for myself in which case there was always the nagging feeling that I could just avoid all these annoying creatures that take several minutres to kill and insta-jump to my target location, or at least to a nearby site. I find this lessens my enjoyment of the experience and makes it very hard to end up somewhere by accident or to get lost.

In short it takes away a lot of the things that I find most enjoyable about exploration.

[ZANEY82]

So instead of choosing to travel from Cheydinhal, you'd rather have no option but to travel from Cheydinhal. It sounds like you're not that interested in exploring if you're cutting it out yourself.

... Seriously? Is there a single fan of Oblivion's fast travel system that has the ability to accept our problems and try to come up with a comprimise? Put it this way:

How the hell was Morrowind's system a pain? It was a realistic, immersive feature that didn't take too much time, as most places where never far from a fast travel point.

You see, I don't find any problem with Morrowind's system, yet, I'm not too obnoxiously narrow minded to try to come up with a comprimise, and instead debate about how Morrowind was perfect, and nothing should ever change from it. I've never once explained how Oblivion's system should be removed in it's entirety to make way for the system that I want. If you want to mindlessly debate and go in circles, please, get the hell out of this thread, and join the many Morrowind vs Oblivion threads.

(Don't actually answer my question, I was putting across a point)

The fast travel map is available without using spell points, and with no teleportation spell in the game, I'm pretty sure the map isn't magical.

You do realise that the only person who started talking about magic was you, right? I simply answered your question. :rolleyes:

[Dustin Brown]

5 bucks says you don't realize what Shades is getting at.

And these

I'm not too obnoxiously narrow minded to try to come up with a comprimise

:rolleyes:

don't help anyone with anything.

[Melung Chan]

5 bucks says you don't realize what Shades is getting at.

5 bucks says Shades doesn't realise what this thread is about.

And these

don't help anyone with anything.

Neither does completely missing the whole point of the thread and starting up a Morrowind vs Oblivion debate. The whole purpose of this thread is to recognise the problems people have, and come up with a solution to fit all. This isn't about going in circles until the thread gets locked. People have debated about thier problems hundreds of times in these forums. I think we get that we can't just stick with one type without upsetting a group of fans.

[ezra]

Shades?

[Lakyn Ellery]

... Seriously? Is there a single fan of Oblivion's fast travel system that has the ability to accept our problems and try to come up with a comprimise? Put it this way:

How the hell was Morrowind's system a pain? It was a realistic, immersive feature that didn't take too much time, as most places where never far from a fast travel point.

Who said I liked Oblivion's system? I sure didn't. Are you kinda guessing because I mentioned it that I like it? Lol. That ain't it.

And for the problems with Morrowind's fast travel system, I'm just tired of retyping it. I can't find it in my past posts because it was trimmed. I'm alright with letting you think Morrowind's system was realistic or immersive, or whatever.

You see, I don't find any problem with Morrowind's system, yet, I'm not too obnoxiously narrow minded to try to come up with a comprimise, and instead debate about how Morrowind was perfect, and nothing should ever change from it. I've never once explained how Oblivion's system should be removed in it's entirety to make way for the system that I want. If you want to mindlessly debate and go in circles, please, get the hell out of this thread, and join the many Morrowind vs Oblivion threads.

(Don't actually answer my question, I was putting across a point)

You're misrepresenting my position, some call it strawman.

You do realise that the only person who started talking about magic was you, right? I simply answered your question. :rolleyes:

Roll your eyes again, little buddy. It'll be super effective on the second time around.

If you were quick on the draw today you'd see that I was ribbing him for saying Oblivion's fast travel was teleportation, and you didn't catch it, so I went after you.

5 bucks says you don't realize what Shades is getting at.

I'll get in on that.

5 bucks says Shades doesn't realise what this thread is about.

Do you have ten bucks?

Neither does completely missing the whole point of the thread and starting up a Morrowind vs Oblivion debate. The whole purpose of this thread is to recognise the problems people have, and come up with a solution to fit all. This isn't about going in circles until the thread gets locked. People have debated about thier problems hundreds of times in these forums. I think we get that we can't just stick with one type without upsetting a group of fans.

If you'll notice, I was pointing out the similarities between Morrowind and Oblivion.

FT feels like teleportation to me. At least with silt striders and things I could sort of pretend that I was getting a ride whereas in Oblivion I found it much more intrusive.

As Hircine pointed out, FT allows you to use previously explored locations as shortcuts to areas. It was very easy to teleport to a nearby location and skip the journey entirely which, while great for convenience probably lessened my enjoyment of the game as I didn't often stumble upon things unless I went out of my way to make things difficult for myself in which case there was always the nagging feeling that I could just avoid all these annoying creatures that take several minutres to kill and insta-jump to my target location, or at least to a nearby site. I find this lessens my enjoyment of the experience and makes it very hard to end up somewhere by accident or to get lost.

In short it takes away a lot of the things that I find most enjoyable about exploration.

Maybe, but you can't call it teleportation and be taken seriously. You were joking with us. A silt strider was the same type of teleportation by that standard, which is no teleporting at all. Quests weren't time dependent in either of the two newer TES games, so it didn't matter if you teleported or rode the silt bus.

Right, but I don't get why if you wanted the enjoyment of exploring much of the same area multiple times, why not go to the city and depart from there? Go could go to a closer location if you've been there before. but you're making it sound like you're shooting your enjoyment in the foot. Oblivion's fast travel in Morrowind would have been just as bad because every location is on the other side of mountain ranges while there is no skill for climbing. What you're really saying is that the level scaling is what's getting you.

Shades?

We'll just chuckle. I don't think Hircine really reads this stuff.

snip

Here's my position from earlier, so it's clear.

[electro_fantics]

i came up with a compromiseable sequence to Tes5 i liked Oblivion and Morrowinds Fast traveling ways but combine them and voila lol
Hmm id Say Fast travel is awesome but you should only be allowed to fast travel to any major city regularly.
Then Every mages guild has its mages guild teleporters. at a cost equal to distance needed to travel.
Then secondary travels like boats or silt striders maybe it depends on the area
and then also 5 mark locations. You would use Recall to bring up the list and then choose which one you wanted.
Using mark would create th exact spot you could recall to. Certain places would be unmarkable to prevent cheaters messing around ness.
Then You would have Mark/Recall = Mysticsm Spell Lv25, and Potions//Scrolls
Recalling takes Some Mp,But all your Fatigue leaving you weak for a bit so it has a side effect.
So yeah i know its been said but i just stated it a bit more clearly lol
also i was thinking of the tome thing from oblivion, They were way to rare and it seemed like a horrible download
but maybe in Tes5 tomes would be all over the place, But you would need a certain lv to access and learn the spells from them.
1, 25,50, 75, 100 // that means 5 levels of spell tomes to learn from which could be rewards or special treasured loot found in dungeons or earned from quests and they could be leveled so you would get a better one depending on your level.
Horses though should be harder to get killed, the regenerate, and are faster and maybe you should be able to customize them
almost like the horse armor thing but better where you could change it out as well as being able to enchant your horse, name it and make it a pack mule
id say they could hold up to 100 pounds and then be upgraded to 250 at a rate of 25 pounds for gold. maybe add a revival or summon spell if your horse dies or dissapears so you can get it back just in case. =]
my only problem in the landscape of oblivion was the dang hills, they were a pain it was hard to get up and if you used a horse all it did was fall and die really fast. my friend played oblivion and hated it cause he wasnt really smart and kept falling off the deadly hills which are eveyrwhere.
Tes5 should have some rolling hills but it would need plains. and should be diverse like Morrowind which had over 6 areas of different land types
where cyrodill only had i think about 3 or 4. maybe but it was still awesome.
hmm and Deer, Does should run but bucks should be bigger and attack you. yay lol
yeah i know what your thinking

Also Every forum is always exaclty the same it starts as one thing and will end up being a debate about 2 cheeses and which one is better the Green cheese or the Red cheese it always happens and that was a metaphorical thing.. i miss guar and netch's
Hmm what if instead of just horses people could ride Guar, Horses, Netchs, Cliff racers, Or Silt striders

[Shelby McDonald]

Maybe, but you can't call it teleportation and be taken seriously. You were joking with us. A silt strider was the same type of teleportation by that standard, which is no teleporting at all. Quests weren't time dependent in either of the two newer TES games, so it didn't matter if you teleported or rode the silt bus.

Right, but I don't get why if you wanted the enjoyment of exploring much of the same area multiple times, why not go to the city and depart from there? Go could go to a closer location if you've been there before. but you're making it sound like you're shooting your enjoyment in the foot. Oblivion's fast travel in Morrowind would have been just as bad because every location is on the other side of mountain ranges while there is no skill for climbing. What you're really saying is that the level scaling is what's getting you.

Difference in Morrowind is that they dress it up a little better imo, it's not ideal but I prefer it.

Why go to the city and depart from there as opposed to going to the nearest convenient location and then, once you'd finished whatever quest you happened to be doing didn't you just teleport back to the start of the quest? If I'm able to play the game in this way, why bother trying to explore? I can just insta-zip from location to location, never doing anything besides the prescribed quests. It bothers me that I'm able ot just zip to the closest location, it takes any sense of risk out of the equation if I'm out exploring - if I run out of anything I can just jump back to the nearest settlement and recover at any time, oblivion style FT makes it much, much harder for your character to get in out of their depth.

Not sure I'm conveying this very well. :/

[Jon O]

I for one actually enjoyed the way travel was implemented in Morrowind. Sure, it had certain limitations but it conveyed the part of actually travelling somewhere and getting back. That's why I had a little Multimark addon; offering me 8 mark slots. This combination worked perfectly for me.

In Oblivion it was more of a "click-you're-there"; where in Morrowind you actually had to think about how to get somewhere. But I guess that the 'casual gamers' and 'impatient generation' were among the causes why Oblivion featured this style of teleport-travel. No thinking, easy access, mainstream.

I loved pondering my (highly detailed) paper map of Morrowind (often with a small magnifying glass), checking where I needed/wanted to go and made mental notes of which striders/ships/etc I needed to take to get me closer to my destination. To me that was part of the roleplaying experience of actually having to think my way through to my goals. The paper map of Oblivion was a big dissappointment and had absolutely no value to me. The same applied to the insta-portation travel methods as it did not add anything to my level of immersion or feeling connected to my character. I didn't have to think my route, I just clicked on a dull-looking brown ingame map.

So it would be awesome if the next TES game would bring the Morrowind style travel back (with a few tweaks); accompanied with a detailed paper map a la Morrowind! That way people can stop behaving as mindless zombies and actually have to do some thinking to get from A to B.

But that's just my opinion on the matter


Greetz,

Milt

[Channing]

If everything in the game didn't respawn every 3 days, like in OB, then FT to places you've been before wouldn't be that big an issue one way or the other. Having all of the loot levelled and scaled to be the same bland garbage as everywhere else also contributed to the overall problem. The result of all that, in OB, was that there was no incentive to explore or try anything new, when you could just keep FT'ing to the same handful of places over and over and over.....

Since OB didn't have Mark/Recall or Intervention spells, or paid travel services, and because Levitation was taken away, there were really no alternatives to using it, especially if you wanted to do some repetitive travel task like hauling loot. MW's system worked well in that game, because the game was developed around it, and there were plenty of alternatives and "exploits" to move ridiculous amounts of loot or return to places you needed to revisit. Somethng like OB's FT system was desperately needed once all of those other options were removed, so I can see why the OB fans would be so defensive about giving it up.

The problem is just one part an overall design choice between an open-world RPG and a more casual and fast-paced Action/Adventure game, not specifically FT versus no FT. Scaling, Mini-games, FT, and Respawning are all interwoven issues, not seperate entities that can be added or subtracted individually.

[Mason Nevitt]

Somethng like OB's FT system was desperately needed once all of those other options were removed, so I can see why the OB fans would be so defensive about giving it up.

That's a shame for the OB fans. Of course, if we just got the Intervention/Recall/Levitation spells back, everyone would be happy!

EDIT: I must admit, though, that Divine Intervention wouldnt've worked well in Oblivion. It was an interesting tradeoff in Morrowind because the Imperial Forts were few and far between, and often fairly out of the way. However, with the local chapels in Oblivion, it would effectively have been a free ride to the place you'd usually go to sell your loot.

[Avril Louise]

That's a shame for the OB fans. Of course, if we just got the Intervention/Recall/Levitation spells back, everyone would be happy!

EDIT: I must admit, though, that Divine Intervention wouldnt've worked well in Oblivion. It was an interesting tradeoff in Morrowind because the Imperial Forts were few and far between, and often fairly out of the way. However, with the local chapels in Oblivion, it would effectively have been a free ride to the place you'd usually go to sell your loot.

It was also fun frequently to be uncertain which shrine (or Dunmer temple) you might end up at. And I loved Mark and Recall even more than the Intervention spells. If you fight your way to an objective there's really no reason to make the return journey onerous as well.

[evelina c]

I like the potion idea, but the problem I find is I'm now spoiled with Oblivion and Fallout's travel system. I'm playing Morrowind again and I find a lot of the time I'm using the COC cheat to get to places (this is like my 3rd or 4th playthrough, I've earned it ). I honestly think I would miss the fast travel option from Oblivion if they cut it out of ESV. I'm big of exploring and wndering, and if I want to, then I can explore. But if I'm doing a quest and want to get to point 'b' from 'a,' I want to do it quickly.

I like Oblivions, but mostly because I like to wander and explore in my free time, and when I want to do a quest, it allows me to do it faster. It encourages exploration, but doesn't punish you when you've been there before and the fourth is just tedious.

[glot]

That's a shame for the OB fans. Of course, if we just got the Intervention/Recall/Levitation spells back, everyone would be happy!

EDIT: I must admit, though, that Divine Intervention wouldnt've worked well in Oblivion. It was an interesting tradeoff in Morrowind because the Imperial Forts were few and far between, and often fairly out of the way. However, with the local chapels in Oblivion, it would effectively have been a free ride to the place you'd usually go to sell your loot.

You could sell your loot at Imperial forts, anyway.