I´m still in Seyda Neen to build up a bit but it looks promising. Interesting environments, new weapons (spears! no not Britney) and I like that NPC:s greet me with voices as in Oblivion. The persuasion doesn´t allow for planning though and that´s a bit of a downer. But I have serious issues with the combat system. If you fire an arrow from point blank range you´re NOT supposed to miss! This game is more about luck and that´s fine, but you simply don´t miss from that distance :banghead:
I love combat but not in Morrowind so I guess my prediction was true, Oblivion will not be put away.

I always like exploring and Morrowind doesn´t fail me there. I really feel like a newcomer, undeveloped and unexperienced and I have to be cautious and forget my powerful Oblivion dunmer for a while. I think it´s good that creatures are not leveled with me, they do make a challenge and I´ve already died once by a simple skeleton.
With all the talk about cliff racers I was anxious to see one, and I did so last night. Reminded me of a pterodactyl and as a former amateur dinosaur expert I thought that was cool ^_^

Good game, will play it a lot but that combat system is a pain in the *****. And yes I know there´s more to it than that I just had to say it once more

:rolleyes: You don't play many RPG's outside Oblivion, do you?

While you probably wouldn't miss with an arrow point blank, the combat isn't more about "luck" -- since just as with Oblivion luck has a small effect upon everything that you do -- but rather character skill. Oblivion focused more on player skill, i.e. how good you are at knowing when to block, when to swing, etc, while Morrowind combat is based more on what skills your character has and how you utilize them. If you would rather have combat be more like Oblivion's, there are some mods (such as Blocking Enhanced, or simple attack bonus / defense bonus adjustments) to narrow the gap.

Creatures and such can be leveled, but they aren't always, and you definitely overtake the "power curve" at a certain point.


Have fun!

Quality over quantity:
Shining in the darkness (yeah, that old cow )
Deus Ex
VTM: Bloodlines

Same problem with Deus, I couldn´t aim unless my character got good. I just think it should be more about player skill since the character doesn´t play himself. I know all about RPG:s but that doesn´t mean I like it all.
It´s something about first person mode, if it had been only third like Zelda I guess this wouldn´t have been a problem. I want to see all or nothing regarding animations

Shining in the darkness I had no problem with since it was turn based with only flickering as animation.

By that I mean most RPG's are about character skills, not how fast you can press block.

In Morrowind, you're playing as someone else, who has thier own skills, and can only do what they have the skills to do. It aint an fps. Besides, there is mods, I wont hate you for downloading them, it's your game, but if you want a good morrowind experience, I wouldn't download them. Just my opinion.

And don't come into Morrowind thinking Oblivion. You are going to miss until you raise any skill and the only way to do that is buy training or use it over and over. When you think about it ,it makes perfect sense. Thats why Oblivion is more hack and slash. Nothing like getting killed by a rat because as some npc's will say "you really are green". Morrowind plays like most mmo's. You start out learning how to do combat on little things until you get better. If you don't have the Patience to do this,the game is not for you.

It's annoying that you miss from point blank BUT, Oblivion only feels "right" at first because all the creatures are leveled, so, you fire point blank at a rat, you don't miss, and it dies.

However, the rats scale, so as you get better, you still aren't missing, but it takes 2-3 arrows to kill that same rat. The damage each arrow does is less. It will take 50 arrows to kill a bear.

In Morrowind, you miss from point blank. But, when you DO hit, you do the exact same damage, depending on how high your skill is. And as your level gets higher, you miss less. So by the end of the game, you are one-shotting rats and crabs, and taking down bigger enemies with a few shots which before you could not even carry enough arrows to deal with.

Take it easy. Focus on your main weapon skills, pick a few mushrooms, build some gold. Morrowind is a slow game at the start, and you are nothing at the beginning. But great thing's start out small, and by the time your level 30+ You should be god

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Morrowind:Morrowind_for_Oblivion_Players

this is a pretty good read if you're looking to get into the game

I'm recently doing the same, but I remembered the essential mods from the last time. There are a great deal, but to me you've got to have the no cliffracers mod. They get annoying after a period of gameplay, and the longer it goes on the more annoying they get. It's worse when you can't hit a cliffracer a hundred times even though you're standing right in front of it and physically connecting with you're sword. So then, mods that make sure you actually hit you're opponent are necessary too, like Accurate Attacker. Gotta have that. I have to have marksman's mods for Oblivion and Morrowind. I might could throw arrows better than I can shoot them in vanilla.

For the love of Azura, please don't make that comparison ever again. :glare:

@ mirocu:

Don't worry, combat gets better. Once your skills have increased you will practically always hit. Meanwhile, make sure your Fatigue remains high, as it has a considerable effect on everything you do, from fighting to spellcasting. You may also wish to llook into bound weaponry. A Bound Longbow not only has the damage of a Daedric Longbow, but also gives you a +10 bonus to Marksman.

Deus Ex was an excellent game but it was not an authentic, traditional roleplaying game by any stretch of the imagination. Deus Ex was a hybrid first-person shooter/roleplaying game (much like Oblivion, in fact).




Speaking as a player who plays only in third person mode, I would like to say that Morrowind is in fact a third-person game.

About this issue of missing. I think part of the problem people have with "missing" is a lack of animations. If Bethesda had included proper dodge and block animations new players wouldn't be so upset when they appear to "miss" at point-blank range. And, arguably, you shouldn't be able to shoot a ranged weapon at point-blank range without a penalty to hit anyway...but that's another topic.

Want a good success ratio, go for 40+ in a given skill and you should hit close to half the time (with full fatigue).

Marksman starting at 25 is practically like marksman starting at 5. And combat is horrendous. The spell chance failure makes sense in MW, but repeatedly missing a paralyzed character is like the world pointing and laughing at you.

I'm in the same boat as the OP and combat is the only letdown in the game, and its not the "miss" factor, its just so antiquated in look and feel. The game's 8 years old, so I'm really not going to hold that against it. As far as mods, I left everything alone from a mechanic's perspective (since its my first play through), but modded the heck out of the landscape and NPC/Creatures. It looks much, much better than it did stock (thanks Pseron Wyrd :bowdown:).

Oh, and rats in Oblivion don't scale. A rat's a rat, beginning or end of the game. The level table does stop for many enemies at a certain point.

Morrowind and Oblivion each got half of combat right, and the other half horribly wrong.

In Morrowind, there were no "miss" animations, so when (not "if") you missed a swing at low skill levels, it looked silly as your weapon passed harmlessly through the adversary (a very bad thing). Hitting was based almost purely on the skills, agility, and luck of the character (mostly a good thing, but annoying that it was purely a "pass/fail" test), and damage was based on the weapon used and the strength of your character (again, mostly a good thing). There were no "glancing" or "weak" hits, only clean hits and clean misses. One drawback of the "stat-based" hit/miss check was that it didn't take the DIFFERENCE in skills/abilities into account, only those of the attacker, so it was hardly any easier to hit a paralyzed or knocked down adversary than one dodging and weaving to avoid your attacks. At low skill levels (notably for a starting character) it could be pretty tough. In spite of the weak animations and inherent limitations, it worked surprisingly well as a RP combat mechanism, but was still "inadequate" at best for "arcade" action play.

In Oblivion, you simply couldn't miss an opponent who was in range of your attack, regardless of how unskilled you were with a weapon (mostly a bad thing from either a "realism" or a RP point of view, but worked very well as an "arcade" game mechanism). Damage was done according to your skill with that weapon type (really bad), plus the stats of the weapon and your strength (at least that part made sense). The biggest problem with this system is that any bumbling incompetent character could hit anything in the game 100% of the time, but it would take dozens of hits with a heavy axe or sword to have any significant effect on an opponent, which is somewhere between silly and stupid. No matter one's "competence" with a weapon, in reality, one or two successful hits with an axe is going to put ANYONE in a world of hurt.

The combat system in FO3 went one step further, so that a handgun or rifle in the hands of a novice would need 5-30 rounds that HIT to put down a typical adversary. If your character was relatively incompetent with heavy weapons, an opponent could practically stand there relatively unharmed in the burst of a flamethrower. Seriously, scaled damage was equally as bad for both realism and RP as scaled opponents.

I believe Oblivion is closer to the truth regarding combat. Anyone can hit anything if he´s just close enough, he doesn´t have to be trained at all. He might do less damage and so but he still hits.
What some have said though I agree with, the game is eight years old and didn´t have the "right" animations. It´s just that when I see my sword hit and nothing happens...

I still like it and I will definitely not stop playing. I can adapt to almost any game and Morrowind isn´t an exception. I can also adapt to the fighting in due time but I may need more time for that. Believe me when I say it though, I´m not impatient and not a quitter



I guess there are just different types of RPG:s. I think I prefer player skill but I won´t download mods to tweak it. I want Morrowind to be as Morrowind it can get.

i think the orginal idea is that they other creature/play dodges the attack, or you miss, but its to old to have the animations to back it up.

makes sense, a fighter would eaily be able to see how you are attacking and dodge, and a creature would often be too fast for you to hit it wiht an unusual weapon. hel,l for an totally inexperienced person holding a crossbow can still easily be dodged at point blank range. and when you start...you are totally inexperienced with any weapon.

Eh, its because you don't play yourself that it shouldn't be about your skill, but about that of the character you created
I've got lousy reflexes and hand-eye coordination. Fortunately in a RPG my character isn't stuck with that (or my partial colour blindness, tone deafness etc, tendency to freeze up in emergencies, and other physical and mental flaws)

Actually, it's because the combat system is flawed

I am actually quite good with a bow irl but that´s not what I meant. I understand totally where they went with this, you´re not good if you´re inexperienced but as I stated, anyone can hit firing ten arrows from less than one meter.
I think we can finish this discussion now, too much about combat here.

It´s a rich game and I´ve barely scratched the surface of it. A lot to discover, a lot to do and I can´t wait till next session :foodndrink:

Btw in Deus Ex, you´re supposed to be a fully trained agent right out from the academy so aiming shouldn´t be a problem :shrug:

About that Cliff racer mod.. Doesn't Morrowind use cliff racers as a level checker. In other words its a check of your level so the game knows what mobs to send at you? I thought i heard this awhile back. So if you take out the cliff racer does it screw up the game?

no. I use it, and exploration is a lot more fun without those bastards constantly coming at me every 3 secs.

Annoying, yes. Bothering me? Not really. Yet.

Kinda agree with that. OB's combat was just too simple. Morrowinds was more interesting IMO. More mechanics.

That´s the thing. I want to be in control over my character/game, not vice versa. I´m trying to raid a cave and it´s annoying not to hit the bandits even though I´m standing right in front of them. But I try to think that they´re avoiding my blows so fast I can´t even see it

About cliff racers, they don´t bother me yet. Have only encountered one so far. Comparing to Oblivion the constant attacks from wildlife animals can be just as annoying imo as you describe cliff racers. Odd name really, the don´t run they fly. Cliff flyers? :blink: