Hello. I'm starting to play Fallout 3 again with FWE and MMM, and I'm looking for opinions and recommendations on two areas. I'm actually starting for a third time I restarted the first time because of an incorrect install, and the second time because of a bad perk choice. Both times I got to about level 5. So here are the points:

1. Perks. I took the Comprehension perk. I should have read the readme's more carefully, but as it is it seems to be pretty much worthless given the changes to skill books. Is that basically true? At least at lower levels?

Also are there other particularly recommend or not recommended perks in FWE, compared with the vanilla game.?

2. Combat. I understand the combat is much more difficult (and realistic) with FWE. In that weapons actually do some real damage. Is there any general advice here?

I already know about trying to split up the enemies and have a place to get cover. But usually when going against gangs of raiders (I'm focusing on radiers at lower levels vs the stronger enemies) no matter how I try to sneak a gang of about five come running after me. If I hide some of them get through. And just about 1 second of a raider using an assault rife will kill my character.

The only effective way I've found of dealing with this is plan some land mines and then draw the group over the mines. Are there other ways of splitting the enemies or dealing with gangs of raiders, particularly at lower levels?

Thanks.

Well, the comprehension perk means that you need to read fewer of a particular type of books to gain the book perk perks. It also lets you obtain a higher level of book perk perks, that you can't reach without comprehension. So if you're planning to collect the books, it isn't a bad perk to pick up. Keep in mind that in order to get the higher perk levels, you also need to have a higher skill requirement.

As for other perks, many of them are pretty useful. With all the added uses for action points, the new perks that replenish your AP's faster are pretty useful (Track Star + Olympian). There are new advanced PA training perks if PA is your thing. I also find the toughness + cyborg perks levels can be used to make a really tough character if you don't want to use PA. Also, most of the skill increasing perks now give you an extra boost when the level 5 "mastery" perk is sleected, so depending on the skills you want to focus on, that coudl be helpful.




Raiders are not easy at low levels. Nothing really is easy at low levels. Frag grenades and mines are really your friend in dealing with large groups of raiders early on. Also, learn to use bullet time and sprint effectively. I'll use bullet time for just a second or so to line up a headshot, quickly kill my target, and sprint back before the whole group is on to me. I'll try and hideout, work the corners, or throw some grenades to keep the raiders back until my AP's recharge and I can go for another headshot. Remember grandes have a knockdown effect, so that helps stall raiders coming at you.

Once you get a few levels and/or some better weaponry, raiders tend to be less problematic.

EDIT: Also, engaging raiders over a longer distance with a scoped weapon works well. Even in the subways you can often get some long-distance shots on the raiders. They like to close in before they start shooting (most of the time), so if you can keep them at a distance, that helps a lot.

Thanks very much for the comments.

The problem I have with Comprehension, at lower levels, is that as I read the README for it, it looks like you need to have a high skill level to even receive the first perk. At at low character levels my character have low skills, except maybe for the tagged skills. So seem to me to be much better to delay that perk until later levels, even though it's available at lower levels.

Given that skills were removed from skill books, it seems like some of the skill boosting perks like Daddy's Boy/Girl or Gun Nut are significantly more valuable.

And I see the point on perks like Track Star. That's why I was disappointed in Comprehension, since something like Track Star would seem much better.

Thanks for the advice on combat too. I'll try to get better with bullet time and/or sprint. It does seem like Raiders at least gang up more than usuall. They seem much more difficult to seperate into managable groups. That is not a complaint, just an observation which affects combat strategies and tactics. It really seems like explosives are critical with FWE/MMM at least at lower levels.

*randomly wanders back in*

There is another little readme somewhere, which explains that the skill requirements have been lowered to better suit FWE's balance. If I recall correctly, the skill requirements start at 35 for the first rank (ish, I am not sure that is universal).

Edit: *self-fives*

Yes this is correct =)

thanks,

Oh. The readme has it much higher for the first perk.

It wouldn't let me read the book until I had skill of 40. then it said 1/3 then 2/3. I didn't have three of the same types of skill books to I guess get the first perk.

So if I could read the book I can get the perk? Is that right?

And if i don't have Comprehension does it take more than three books to get the book's perk?

Yes, if you don't have comprehension it takes 4-5 books to get the perk (can't remember). If you can read the book that you see the 1/3, 2/3, keep reading text, then you have the correct amount of skill. It won't display that message or even let you "use" the book if you don't have enough skill.

Thanks. In that case Comprehension is not as worthless as I originally thought from the mod readme.

I thought I was going to almost have the assocated skill maxed before I got the perk. But if I could get the first perk at 40 that's different.

I might not restart. Thanks again.

I am currently testing out quite a few mods for a very long and thorough run through the game. Anyhow, in testing out FEW, I too noticed this new ganging up behavior with the raiders. Most noticeable in the Springvale school where I have always been able to pick off 1 or maybe 2 raiders at a time. Now when i enter (I always go left first) and engage the first raider there, more come running from the back, and the guy from if you go right come running out from that side. Even the guys from the 2nd floor come running down wanting some meat too (not the ones behind the locked door but the other 2). Took me with complete surprise the first time it happened and since they are very lethal now with FWE...it didn't end all that well on my behalf. Bullet time FTW though and I now have it hotkeyed to a button on my mouse. I would not live long without it on lower levels.

It is however very refreshing with some challenging combat for a change. I come from FO3 on the XBOX so nothing but vanilla there. When I first tried it out on the PC just recently, it was WOW as far as graphics goes. But as I ran around checking things out (framerates, changing/tweaking things for my setup), I noticed I could kill almost anything out there with just a bat and some stimpacks. :/ So the hunt for a good overhaul began. Been hard to decide between FEW and Arwens. FEW has so much built into it though, so very convenient. It also have some stuff I don't think you can even get elsewhere. Like the Hunger/Thirst/Sleep meter on screen? I, just as Savlian is a little, confused, though, as to what perks to take, the use of skillbooks, and such. Not to end up getting a completely 'borked' character after half the game. Again, am used to FO3 on the XBOX and there, well, at 30, or even 20, you are GOD! So no real worries there.

Hey there, I recently started playing again and installed FWE with WMK, MMM, and EVE.

I understand the game is supposed to be significantly harder but I'm having such a hard time I wanted to make sure my weapon damage wasn't messed up or something. I'm having a really hard time killing just about anything, every single shot that hits me is an instant crippled limb even with weak guns so I was wondering if this is intended 100% or if I've got something installed wrong or a load order problem.

Here's some of the damage ratings on various guns, all around halfway repaired:
10mm Pistol (SI) - 26
.32 Pistol - 53
Shabby Shotgun - 105
10mm Submachine Gun - 133
Tommy Gun - 187
Laser Pistol - 62
Laser Pistol (AF, EC) - 170
YK42B Pulse Rifle - 129
Wattz 2000 Laser Rifle - 84

One of the WMK kits nearly doubled my guns damage rating(Auto-Fire Kit I believe), and afaik none of the modkits adjust base damage do they? Appreciate any help with this, until then my character is raider food.

My Load Order:

[X] Fallout3.esm[X] PointLookout.esm[X] Anchorage.esm[X] ThePitt.esm[X] BrokenSteel.esm[X] Zeta.esm[X] CRAFT.esm[X] CALIBR.esm[X] FO3 Wanderers Edition - Main File.esm[X] Mart's Mutant Mod.esm[X] Animy_prostitution.esm[X] AgeBasedBodys.esm[X] CrossModData.esm[X] CRAFT - Activation Perk.esp[X] CALIBRxMerchant.esp[X] BlackWolf Backpack.esp[X] FO3 Wanderers Edition - Main File.esp[X] FO3 Wanderers Edition - DLC Anchorage.esp[X] FO3 Wanderers Edition - DLC Broken Steel.esp[X] FO3 Wanderers Edition - DLC Mothership Zeta.esp[X] FO3 Wanderers Edition - DLC Point Lookout.esp[X] FO3 Wanderers Edition - DLC The Pitt.esp[X] FO3 Wanderers Edition - UFP Support.esp[X] FO3 Wanderers Edition - Alternate Travel.esp[X] FO3 Wanderers Edition - Lvl 30 High Skills.esp[X] FO3 Wanderers Edition - Followers Enhanced.esp[X] FO3 Wanderers Edition - Followers Enhanced (BrokenSteel).esp[X] FO3 Wanderers Edition - Optional Restore Tracers.esp[X] FO3 Wanderers Edition - Optional Worn Weapons.esp[X] WeaponModKits.esp[X] WeaponModKits - FWE Master Release.esp[X] WeaponModKits - OperationAnchorage.esp[X] WeaponModKits - ThePitt.esp[X] WeaponModKits - BrokenSteel.esp[X] WeaponModKits - PointLookout.esp[X] WeaponModKits - Zeta.esp[X] WeaponModKits - FWE Optional Worn Weapons.esp[X] Stealthboy Recon Armor - CRAFT.esp[X] Dragonskin Tactical Outfit.esp[X] EVE.esp[X] EVE - FWE Master Release.esp[X] EVE - FWE Master Release (Follower Enhanced).esp[X] EVE Operation Anchorage.esp[X] EVE - FWE with WeaponModKits.esp[X] EVE Anchorage - FWE DLC Anchorage.esp[X] Mart's Mutant Mod.esp[X] Mart's Mutant Mod - DLC Anchorage.esp[X] Mart's Mutant Mod - DLC The Pitt.esp[X] Mart's Mutant Mod - DLC Broken Steel.esp[X] Mart's Mutant Mod - DLC Point Lookout.esp[X] Mart's Mutant Mod - DLC Zeta.esp[X] Mart's Mutant Mod - Natural Selection.esp[X] Mart's Mutant Mod - Reduced Wasteland Spawns.esp[X] Mart's Mutant Mod - Tougher Traders.esp[X] Mart's Mutant Mod - Zones Respawn.esp[X] Mart's Mutant Mod - FWE with EVE.esp[X] Mart's Mutant Mod - XFO.esp[X] Mart's Mutant Mod - FWE Master Release.esp[X] Wasteland Weather Overhaul .9.esp[X] R18BodyPack.esp[X] APReanimated.esp[X] Mez's Merged Patch - FWE-WMK-MMM.esp

Load order looks good at first glance.
If you're not decently armored, enemies will do a high amount of damage. You can also use my http://fallout3nexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=10273, it reduces all weapon damage by about 37.5% among several other things.

Also the damage value from Fallout3 is pretty much useless. Which is the reason why we included my Weaponscanner mod in FWE, it shows you the real values of your weapons, so use it (simply press 'E' while you are in your inventory)

Wow the tweaks look like exactly what I was looking for, thanks so much! :twirl: And thanks for explaining the damage thing, was bothering me.

I just restarted a third character in FWE/MMM last night (first two made it to about level 5, then stopped to to various reasons). The first place I go is Springvale -- I view it is as kind of starter dungeon to get some experience and supplies.

And it seems very different with FWE. First shot and pretty much everyone in the Springvale School building runs down. Whether it's good or not, or realistic or not, it does seem very different. My level 2 character has to fight about 8 raiders ganged up in a very confined space. That seems to make it very difficult for a sniper, but again the character is a low level.

This is primarily a result of changes to the sneak/detection formulas. Making loud noises, your sneak skill, and light all have a much bigger influence on your ability to stay hidden. In addition, the Combat AI changes effectively extend the AI's combat engagement behavior. So if they hear sounds, or their fellow mates switch to a hostile mode, they will too. It's more challgening this way, and also a lot more realistic. Why would a raider hanging out a floor above, upon hearing gunshots and fighting, not rush down and get into the action?

Yes, this makes the game substantially harder, especially in springvale at level 1 or 2. You either have to get really creative, have good stealth skills and silenced weapon, bring some companions, or be a higher level and have better gear. As mentioned above, learn to use bullet time, aim for the head, use explosives, sprint when needed, etc....

As an example, when I'm tackling superduper mart early on, I'll often go in one of the set's of doors, take out 1 or 2 raiders, and run outside, and reenter at the over doors, take out 1-2 raiders again. At this point, I might be able to start sneaking in if no one else has seen me yet.

In this example, how does a silenced weapon play into this?
If I used a silenced weapon and one shot killed a raider would people from the second floor come running down?

edit: English corrections >.>

Thanks. That's what I figured. And I do agree it makes things more realistic, though sometimes frustrating too. But I guess that's life in the wastlands B)

They shouldn't come running down. If the raider you're killing goes into alert mode or otherwise detects you before you get your shot off, there is a good chance the raiders will come running down. In that case, provided no one else has seen you, you might be able to remain hidden if you don't move for a few seconds. Moving is one trigger for the whole sound part of the detection formula. So if they don't see you (I mean NO LOS), and you're not making any sounds, you should be okay.

Hi there to the people in this thread and especially to those who gave their valuable tips for my CTD issues. After a fresh install from the GOTY discs, I first kept the LO as is was but just unchecked my merged patch and did no MasterUpdate. This had zero effect on the CTD per hour ratio, neither negative nor positive.

I then shifted around some mods conflicting with each other or FWE according to preferences and started extensive tests with my old character as well as with a new one started in the newly installed game. It turned out that probably only two mods had any effect on CTD/hour ratio, and although I more and more believe what Kai Hohiro said in another thread about MUM and LO having no massive effect on CTDs, I have my own vodoo belief founded hereby and the voices tell me the advantages of the Backpack container mod might not be worth the -even if it's just a little- impact it seems to have on CTD/hour ratio.

Also, I decided to let Shadow of the Swamp out of the LO until I will have visited Point Lookout at least once without that mod active. Instead, I checked out the Treasure Hunt series and with my actual LO I played with both the older character and the newly created. After quite some testing (new char at LVL 9 now) I came to the following conclusion: Since with the old character I still had CTDs about four or five times per hour and a maximum of two CTDs per hour with the new character (although once I played for two and a half hours straight without crash, unthinkable with the old character), it might be some savegame corruption going WAY back for that old character so I stopped playing him.

New LO is like this now:

Fallout3.esm
PointLookout.esm
Anchorage.esm
ThePitt.esm
BrokenSteel.esm
Zeta.esm
CALIBR.esm
CRAFT.esm
FO3 Wanderers Edition - Main File.esm
Mart's Mutant Mod.esm
Enhanced Weather - Rain and Snow.esm
CRAFT - Activation Perk.esp
RobCo Universal Battery Charger Kit.esp
DN_RecyclingMachine.esp
Directional PipLight.esp
SniperZooming.esp
DCInteriors_Georgtown.esp
DCInteriors_SewardSq.esp
DCInteriors_Mason.esp
DCInteriors_LEnfntPl.esp
FO3 Wanderers Edition - Main File.esp
FO3 Wanderers Edition - DLC Anchorage.esp
FO3 Wanderers Edition - DLC Broken Steel.esp
FO3 Wanderers Edition - DLC Mothership Zeta.esp
FO3 Wanderers Edition - DLC Point Lookout.esp
FO3 Wanderers Edition - DLC The Pitt.esp
FO3 Wanderers Edition - Alternate Travel.esp
FO3 Wanderers Edition - Lvl 30 Balance.esp
FO3 Wanderers Edition - Followers Enhanced (BrokenSteel).esp
FO3 Wanderers Edition - Optional VATS Halftime.esp
FO3 Wanderers Edition - Optional Harsher Wasteland.esp
FO3 Wanderers Edition - No Drug Visuals.esp
WeaponModKits.esp
WeaponModKits - FWE Master Release.esp
WeaponModKits - OperationAnchorage.esp
WeaponModKits - ThePitt.esp
WeaponModKits - BrokenSteel.esp
WeaponModKits - PointLookout.esp
WeaponModKits - Zeta.esp
CALIBR Ammo Schematics - CRAFT.esp
Wasteland Whisperer.esp
RobCo Certified.esp
Mart's Mutant Mod.esp
Mart's Mutant Mod - DLC Anchorage.esp
Mart's Mutant Mod - DLC Broken Steel.esp
Mart's Mutant Mod - DLC Point Lookout.esp
Mart's Mutant Mod - DLC Zeta.esp
Mart's Mutant Mod - No Ghoul Raise.esp
Mart's Mutant Mod - Hunting & Looting.esp
Mart's Mutant Mod - Reduced Wasteland Spawns.esp
Mart's Mutant Mod - FWE Master Release.esp
KH_FWE Fixes.esp
Enhanced Weather - Rain and Snow in Fallout.esp
Enhanced Weather - Weather Sounds in Interiors.esp
Enhanced Weather - Sneak Bonus during Storms.esp
Fellout-Full.esp
BlackWolf Backpack.esp
TenpennyGhoulsAtPeace.esp
Owned!.esp
1Animated Nightvision goggles.esp
Treasure Maps_A Fist Full of Caps.esp
Treasure Maps_Secrets of the Wasteland.esp
Treasure Maps_Underground.esp
auto_merged_patch.esp

Total active plugins: 64
Total plugins: 97


In case anyone wants to know why I put the Animated NV goggles below FWE: they conflict, and when they load before FWE files, one cannot use them with helmets on. Similar with the Backpacks: once I had them below FWE, they appeared at the vendors alright, so I thought it safe to put Treasure Maps below FWE as well because FO3Edit showed some worldspace conflicts with FWE.

Well, haven't gotten my hands on a suit of Hellfire Armour yet, but as soon as I do, I'll check if I can fit it to my body in the new game.

Still, I have not banished CTDs for good, but at least some improvement is to observe thanks to the useful tips given in this thread.

Have fun,

tourist

That's really cool then because it raises the value of having a silenced weapon considerably. I like that.
I guess at that point it comes down to performing an instant sneak attack kill.

Hi,

I am unfortunately seeing very frequent crashes.
While I don't know if this mod is at fault, maybe you guys could still help me getting this sorted?

Here's my load order:

Mod load order report
! Warning: current load order template contains 13 duplicate entries

Fallout3.esm

PointLookout.esm

Anchorage.esm

ThePitt.esm

BrokenSteel.esm

Zeta.esm

CRAFT.esm

CALIBR.esm

FO3 Wanderers Edition - Main File.esm

CRAFT - Activation Perk.esp

CALIBRxMerchant.esp

UPP - Pack 1.esp

UPP - Pack 2.esp

UPP - Experience Perks.esp

DCInteriors_Georgtown.esp

DCInteriors_SewardSq.esp

DCInteriors_Mason.esp

DCInteriors_LEnfntPl.esp

FO3 Wanderers Edition - Main File.esp

Greenerworld.esp
* This mod does not exist in the current template

ClearSkies_v2.esp
* This mod does not exist in the current template

FO3 Wanderers Edition - DLC Anchorage.esp

FO3 Wanderers Edition - DLC Broken Steel.esp

FO3 Wanderers Edition - DLC Mothership Zeta.esp

FO3 Wanderers Edition - DLC Point Lookout.esp

FO3 Wanderers Edition - DLC The Pitt.esp

EVE.esp

EVE Operation Anchorage.esp
Requires Anchorage.ESM

Slower Degradation (-50%).esp
* This mod does not exist in the current template

Owned!.esp

FWE increases the amount of creatures in each spawn am I right? Atleast that's how it has been since I installed the mod (and I've been playing for 4+ ingame days and big spawns still exist. Not using any Increased Spawns MMM plugins).
The thing is, for a First-Person Shooter noob like me it's just plain annoying. Not challenging, not immersive, just plain [censored] annoying. Having to fight 12 supermutants everywhere they happen to spawn forces me to rely on stealth, and avoiding buildings, cutting me out of places like Chrysylus building (where I just tried and failed).
This is mainly due to the fact that the increased spawns kills my FPS. The reason I moved to FWE in the first place that I couldn't increase spawns with MMM because of my PC being obsolete and slow so I wanted to have few but strong enemies. Now I have a crapload of superstrong enemies. My character is level 18 and is wearing leather armor and using SAKO RK-95 assault rifle with stats matched with FWE's Wanda AR.
Especially with followers this is extremely frustrating. I got Clover and she always gets decimated in less than four seconds. Not to mention the apparent increased intelligence of enemies, as one shot draws all the muties from within a mile to the location. It's pretty annoying, too. If I win a fight, then I can be certain that I just killed every single enemy in the building.

Just my two cents.. I really like this mod but this just drives me insane.. If I'm doing something wrong, tell me.

The FWE MMM FOIP patch includes Increased spawns built in.
Simply open the ESP in FO3Edit and set MMMzIncreasedSpawnsMax to 1 (default is 3).

Also I'll point you towards my http://fallout3nexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=10273, it decreases FWE weapon damage by about 37.5%, among a few other things. Should result in less insta death for you and your followers

Thank you Kai Horito. :thumbsup:

I was wondering about this myself in the next version FO3A.
Why not allow the actual difficulty setting itself modify the value for increased spawns? I have toyed with the idea of setting up a dynamic difficulty option but it would be allot of work to balance something like that. Dynamic difficulty algorithm when in action, and properly done, always keeps you at a point where you are just barely surviving no matter what your skill level is...

Does FOSE have a way to check what your current difficulty is so you can adjust increased spawns?

Don't know if anyone played Morrowind, but i really liked the idea of rest being able to be disturbed; this could work well for FWE. AHEM Imagine this...
Your charcter NEEDS sleep, instead of risking it outside at the chance of your rest being distrubed by any number of things, friendly or other wise, you seek shelter, clear out a house; and sleep knowing that if you choose to take shelter there is a far less likely chance of being found. Also if you are in a house i doubt very much a pack of dogs or any manner of creatures could open the door, if your rest was to be distrubed then it would single out the creatures.
This would add some nice choices to you adventure, risk it outside, or going through teh trouble of clearing out a building to have a much safer rest. Also perception could come into play; perecption of 10 you will be awoken when said npc or group of npc's (friendly or otherwise) is say 100m away, perception of 1 they are 10m away when you wake up. with a helpful message box stating "Your rest has been disturbed...". this would also be an insentive to set up traps around your slumbering self. I would imagine the mine field place would make for an adiquote home as if npc's came close the mines would blow up when they appeared.
Just the other day i remeberd this neat little function from morrowind and how it did make you seek shelter because those damn worms kept waking you up and trying to eat you.

Oh and while I'm ranting on, could nuka cola have a caffeine side affect that prolongs the need for sleep, maybe one day even a caffeine implementation for coffe etc. It could even fit into the whole camping thing with a kettle on the stove to make fresh coffe whcih is better than cold coffe? water bottle to hold teh coffe you made, hot flasks to keep coffe fresh and hot? and it would increase thirst, caffeine is dehydrating cause it makes you pee! i dunno it just seems like something that would be theer, and of course it would be slightly addictive in some way, and maybe provide a slight speed boost, make you more accurate because you are now more focused? MEH, just throwing some ideas out in the open. Your teh one with the coding skills i do not know if any of these things are feasible!