Hey,

Mez are you out there? Are you planning on putting together an FWE for NV?

It's hard for me to play NV without that holistic revamp!

Thanks,
Michi

The FWE team have been a bit unclear about this (the last time I checked at least), neither denying or admitting they plan on working on such a mod but some of them own a game-copy from what I understood.

I'm speculating here but I think they started working on it or at least plan to but are keeping quiet. The game still needs some crucial utilities like NVSE and for some utilities to get out of their alpha/beta stages. I'm confident they'll work on it. Don't ask why, I have no idea XD

The FO3 version of FWE required CRAFT, CALIBR, and FOSE being the biggest one . Once FOSE finally gets released then some of the best mods will start coming in, hopefully FWE too.

I haven't checked the NV GECK extensively but is CRAFT necessary now with the new vanilla crafting mechanics?

FWE will not be ported to FNV. You play the Courier, not the Wanderer, Wanderer's Edition wouldn't make sense
I'm kidding, that's of course not the real reason, but we really aren't planning on bringing FWE to NV.

Take a look at the features from FWE that are included in New Vegas anyways:

Food/Drink/Sleep - Check (hardcoe)Crippled limbs can only be healed via certain items or doctor visit - Check (hardcoe)Half Int as skill bonus - CheckOverall amount of skill points reduced - CheckVATS rebalanced - CheckNew weapons and armor, returning weapons from classic Fallout games - CheckHeavily rebalanced weapons system - CheckCross Repair - Check (via perk)Melee knockdown - Check (via perk)Rebalanced perks to be viable at almost all levels - CheckImproved AI reactions - CheckMore Crafting - CheckAmmo crafting and disassembling - CheckEnhanced Followers - CheckMore detailed weapon stats - CheckTracers removed from singleshot weapons and added to automatic weapons - Check (I lol'ed when I noticed they even had exact this change)

I could go on and on, but you see where I'm getting at. There are still of course many big differences, but many major features are already included in the vanilla game.

So no, no "FWE" for NV. I've also stated that I don't think it's a good idea to treat New Vegas exactly like Fallout3, because gameplay, setting and the feel of the game are very different.

But that of course doesn't mean we aren't working on something... :ninja:

Call the mod what you like (NVCE - New Vegas Courier Edition? FCE - Fallout Courier Edition?) but you guys proved that you can make a mod that can enhance gameplay greatly. For me NV has superior gameplay when compared to FO3 but it still misses that bit of brilliance that FWE had. Apart from the main features FWE added it had something great and that is the fact that the whole package was greater than the sum of it's parts, great balancing that made the game harder, more interesting, and infinitely more enjoyable.... and the whole thing was customizable.

My point is that you don't owe us nothing and we're all grateful for the great work you did on FWE (it's not a coincidence that NV includes so many similar features) but I think that a lot of people would be curious (to say the least) to see what you guys can do with this.





Did it work?
(j/k)

If anything gets done, I vote "V.I.C.E" (Vegas Intense Courier Edition) as the name. xD


I'm amazed to see how little I needed to mod Vegas right away. All my major wants from FWE are here. I remember running oblivion with 250 mods. Fallout 3 had a stable list of about 75. And Vegas has a grand total of...1. Seriously - I'm running Arwens to add a little extra kick. And that's all I've needed thus far (I'm about to download a bedroll mod soon, though. Hope to see a portable duffel bag soon.).

What made FWE so good was the team identified what the problems with FO3 were, decided what would make it better, and produced a really well thought through mod. It's going to take more than one week to identify what in NV needs improvement.

As far as I understand theese are all mods that have been inccoperated into FWE, either through merging the mods into FWE or by copying already existing ideas. So I don't think that all the credits for NV goes to FWE-Team, but to the modders that initially created or had the idea for the mods, right? I also think I don't have to credit FWE for NV, because NV is a stable game where on the opposite FWE was nothing but a crash-fest. I think I have to give Obsidian credits for implementing all the ideas that came with the FO3 mods, because basically that makes "big overhauls" like FWE and FOOK completely unnecessary...to be honest I already thought that with FO3... :rolleyes:

Hell man, I bet Kai Hohiro thinks he alone build NV... :facepalm:

Nice tone man

1. You understand absolutly incorrectly. Yes when FWE first was released (almost two years ago), it was a compilation of a few mods, along with many hand written features made by Mez. As the mod progressed all major new features were created by FWE team members themselves and anything that was previously incorporated was completely rewritten
2. NOBODY said ANY credit goes to the FWE team for NVs features. I stated that NV simply already has many features that we already had in FWE(which in return was inspired by Fallout 1&2), don't go around inventing BS statements that no one ever made.
3. I'm rather surprised at our download numbers and endorsemants and our ranking on Nexus if it's such an unplayable crash-fest
4. Alotta people enjoyed what FOOK and FWE added, and months worth of work went into those mods, simply for the enjoyment of other players. Whatever did You do for the community that lets you belittle the work of others so readily?
5. Yes, go facepalm yourself, as hard as possible.

Smells like jealousy to me.

FWE was nothing but a crash-fest

Honestly most of the issues with New Vegas are not in any way similar to the issues in FO3. A great deal of the major things that need to be adjusted can be done within minutes with very minor patches. All of my changes for FO3A will be done in a week or two and the original took me months and months and was never fully finished lol....

From what I can tell, this time around maybe more actual quests, factions, locations, content might be a larger focus?
Aside from picking up dynamic difficulty I have little desire to change the game beyond small tweaks right now....

If you experienced something like this, IMO it's more correct to blame the touchy nature of fallout3.exe than the mod. In most things I'd be inclined not to come up with something like that, but, I know from Phalanx that, if you push that .exe, it tends to blow sky high. Things you do which SHOULDNT blow the game up, and WON'T like 20 times in a row, may blow it up the 21st time, or time # 2. It is kinda not fair at all.



That sounds about right. In my own experiences so far, all things considered, there is almost nothing for me to do with followers as compared with Fallout 3. Plus. there is so much already there with these followers that I have to be careful not to break what they did. I'm still learning what to even pay attention to - - - it is not like Fallout 3, seriously. Any modder who edits NV should watch what they are doing, there are .exe tricks at work and such.

FWE a crash-fest? Maybe you should learn to use it appropriately... does MasterUpdate ring any bells? My last FO3 character ended her playthrough at 200+ hours with a mod setup that consisted of FWM+WMK+EVE+ProjectBeauty as a base and around 75-90 other mods and it ran fine.

Hey man this is uncalled for and not a good attitude for the community.
A lot of the inspirations for features came from FWE and fallout 1/2. Even if all of FWE was directly copied this is exactly the kind of thing that modern development houses should be doing. The original inventor of capture the flag in quake 1 is not credited for CTF mode in call of duty or Halo either. These kinds of advancements are a part of the evolution of game design and I would actually be more upset if Obsidian ignored the community entirely.

You should be praising these guys for helping produce the next evolution of fallout not face palming. This is where the real advancements come from and it is a great thing that it was allowed to happen.

This is a good example of a cranky wet towel post. It's easy to see that a lot of work was put into FWE.

It's no wonder modders leave the scene if they have to deal with [censored] like that.

Anyway, as i've said i refuse to play Fallout 3 without FWE, and i hope something similar comes along for New Vegas too. It is a MUCH better thought out game out of the box, but in my humble opinion could still use tweaking that i don't see official patches including... The casual hardcoe mode and Energy Weapons, for example

This attitude is really promising. I can't say I like everything you guys did with FWE, but I still can't wait to see what you'll do with.. whatever the title will be

wow, looks like they took quite a bit of inspiration from your mod then. or maybe you both took from the same source of inspiration...

nothing wrong with taking some lessons from the mod community too... i highly doubt that they didn't.

i must say that's complete bull. even combining the big mods with FOIP i have almost no crashes.

I think SirDrinkAlot has been, well . . . drinking a lot!

Effective troll there. I played FO3 on Xbox, enjoyed it but wanted more. Got the PC version, played it on a Macbook Pro through bootcamp with FWE, MMM, EVE, WMK and enough others that I was running 75+ mods. Stable as a rock and I couldn't play FO3 without FWE.

inb4 locked.


FWE was fun. I enjoyed it. I also enjoyed FOOK2 as well. They were both great overhauls. I was thinking the first thing that Kai said though, most FWE features were already implemented into New Vegas.

Hope the team does some sort of work for NV though, I'm sure it would turn out nicely, whatever you guys do.

Wow. Didn't mean to start a flamewar... thought it was a pretty innocuous post.

I concur with the majority of the posters in that FWE+EVE+WMK+MMM was as solid as any other game I have ever played.

And while I agree with Kai that many things in FWE were assimilated into FONV, many things were not... Bullet Time with related perks, way more equipment, all well balanced, etc. etc

As someone sle mentioned, the whole was much larger than the sum of it's parts.

Looking forward to whatever stealth project y'all have going on.

First let me say I am very thankful to the FWE team for making such a spectacular mod in Fallout 3 and completely respect their decision if they think it's unnecessary for FNV. FWE is the reason why I probably will still play Fallout 3 many years from now. As for FNV, I'm probably going to wait to play through it again until an overhaul mod along the scope of FWE comes along, or maybe use Arwen's when it's more updated.

But having played Fallout 3 FWE for the first time only a month before FNV came out, I have to say that I disagree that FNV adequately implemented many of FWE's features. I'll go by the ones Kai listed:

Food/Drink/Sleep - Vanilla rates are ridiculously low, and there's enough atomic cocktails to never need a bed or a bedroll, and no shortage of sinks and toilets to drink from to reduce 200 H20 per drink. No matter how much your needs are modified, these two things break the hardcoe challenge. Remove bathrooms? no, but a mod that would reduce the intake from those sources would be a welcome change.

Crippled limbs can only be healed via certain items or doctor visit - Problem with this is one, Doctor's Bags are only one item you need carry along and require no medicine skill, two, Hydra is everywhere in the game, even can be purchased at vendors that refresh or found in generic refrigerators. I didn't put one skillpoint in medicine in FNV, yet I could accomplish everything that 40-60 medicine skill required in FWE - and with one item, sometimes affecting more than one crippled limb, with the recovery being instant rather than gradual. In FWE, if I had 3 or 4 crippled body parts, sometimes that just meant "tough [censored]."

Half Int as skill bonus - No argument here

Overall amount of skill points reduced - Again no argument here.

VATS rebalanced - Perception doesn't affect VATS accuracy or any weapon accuracy. Very, very disappointing from Obsidian.

New weapons and armor, returning weapons from classic Fallout games - Only a couple..the plasma caster and That Gun. FWE has a huge collection. There almost isn't a single weapon from the old fallouts that you can't find in there, as of version 6.03 anyways. Many of the weapons become meaningless too early as well.

Heavily rebalanced weapons system - Not sure what you mean here. There's more weapons, yeah, but that is mostly relative to the player. There are no 'OMG' moments in FNV unless you're fighting a deathclaw. In FWE, a Fallen Brother or a Raider with a heavy machine gun was actually a threat to you. The fiends have energy weapons and flamers and such, but they still aren't a threat like FWE's raiders. And I'd say that applies whether you played FWE with MMMF3 enabled or not. FWE was the only fallout 3 playthrough I had where despite having high weapons skills and powerful weapons, I could still get killed by (non-enclave) humanoid enemies by level 10. As for mutants, there is like 3 spots in the entire game of FNV where super mutants are, and they're just bullet sponges with weak weaponry. The only way to balance NPC damage seems to be to put it on Very Hard, and not only does that reduce your damage by 50%, DT is not balanced for difficulty higher than Normal, leading to all the bullet sponge complaints about vanilla FNV.

Cross Repair - No argument here, although scrap metal to repair would be nice.

Melee knockdown - No argument here

Rebalanced perks to be viable at almost all levels - We aren't sure yet if a lot of the perks in FNV such as Gunslinger, sniper, the torso dmg one (cant remember the name) actually work. I'm always skeptical of perks like that and that's why I rarely took them in my FNV playthrough.

Improved AI reactions - I disagree. AI shooting doesn't respond to skill and perception checks, they just go wild and spray and pray in FNV. There's a huge difference to how an NPC fights in FWE and how one fights in FNV, sometimes its gamebreaking because in FNV so much ammo is used by followers due to these mechanics that it's often pointless to bring one along.

More Crafting - I had survival tagged on my FNV char and barely used it. Sure it replenishes more h20, fod, and slp, but as far as the recipes go it is a really meaningless skill. Same problem with cripples and hydra - food can be found everywhere. I literally walk around with none because I'm sure that whatever I'm about to explore next has a refrigerator with Cram/instamash or whatever, and a sink which depletes 200 H20 per use. Also, stimpaks are a problem. They take 70 Science to craft, but why even bother when every vendor has 5 you can buy for 40 caps? 70 science is way too high for a normal stimpak, too.

Ammo crafting and disassembling - FNV does a good job with this but energy is underpowered right now lacking -DT ammo.

Enhanced Followers - See AI reactions. Also, I felt that I needed to have two followers when I played MMM+FWE. No other difficulty mod has ever done that. Two followers in FNV is overkill, kind of like vanilla FO3.

More detailed weapon stats - Agreed.

Tracers removed from singleshot weapons and added to automatic weapons - I guess - I never really saw the big deal over tracers being in or out.

To add to this though, I'd say the biggest difference between FWE fallout 3 and FNV is your sense of vulnerability. In FWE I can't take more than 3-4 shots before my limbs are crippled. I can't get ambushed by NPCs with the Wasteland Patrols mod and feel safe in the duration of the ensuing combat due to the globals damage (and I only use 1.5x too, not the FWE default). In FWE radiation actually matters and loot isn't everywhere to be found, both giving me an incentive to collect animal meat and cook it, caps are still important, and ammo you don't use can't be carted around like it's a separate currency.

Heh, I think the only time I ever got crippled in a 70 hour FNV playthrough was when I stepped on mines or at the end battle when I got hit by an enemy using a .50 cal rifle.

IMO, to say that FNV implemented FWE features is to severely understate how much FWE changed gameplay in Fallout 3. If there were to be a FWE for FNV, the overhaul wouldn't need to be as big - true. But FNV is a game that needs a balance overhaul nonetheless.

Just my two cents.