Yeah, for a laugh I went to go look at the Tesnexus fallout 4 mods... but, oh no...wow, I felt like crying not laughing. There are a LOT of dangerous mods now. I am surprised the guys at TesNexus do not put more warnings up about this even if they do want to allow them.

I would LOVE to mod the weapons in my game so that all actors (including myself) die from only a few shots. At this time I am going around in no armor and setting the game to "easy" so that both my opponents and myself are not bullet sponges. But playing on "easy" is hurting my pride. I have never played on "easy" in my 30 plus years of playing shooters.

So I am just chomping at the bit waiting for Bethesda's new Geck.

HOWEVER....

Once the proper tools come out to make safe mods HOW would I and others separate them from the bad ones?

HOW are we going to be sure a mod was not originally made at this time and then later edited with the proper geck?

I will make my own mods for combat but I do like to use a few mods made by others such as crafting mods.

I wish there was a list of mod authors that are waiting to do it right.

It use to be common that all the tools used to make a mod was listed in the read me. But that is not happening these days.

zilav: Thanks for posting factual information about why they are bad.

Yes and simple people are going to use it, as Zilav said, nexus will be awash with the damned things again

( PS have you removed those Snipped AOS patches which are no longer necessary anymore, or are you still allowing gullible trusting users to download them when AOS has new patches now included which were correctly created with TES5Edit ? )

Mostly you cant, authors dont exactly fess up to using inappropriate tools because their rep would decline fast, thats the trouble with them, even after the Creation Kit came out for Skyrim and TES5Edit was developed to recognise the games plugins 100% - Still authors used Snip because it was easy to do what they needed.

Heres one that survives today, which is no longer necessary because AOS now has patches made by Keithinhanoi ( While updating those at least one of these plugins was found to have the trademark problems that Snip causes ) http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/44541/?

I had to start a new game after using those blasted things.

I was using a couple simple .esp mods before I read this thread. Killshot Perk Fix was made with FalloutSnip, Faster Terminal Displays was made with FO3Edit (just a game setting change with the master removed). While the latter is much more likely to be safer, I'm not sure I want to trust .esp mods until FO4Edit comes out.

I think the biggest evidence that the *Snip programs are troublesome is by looking at Settlement Supplies Expanded, found here: http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/1145/

The creator had been using TESVEdit, but switched over to FalloutSnip because it let him use custom categories. The TESVEdit version was 1.2. The FalloutSnip version is 1.8. Now look at the bugs section. It has exploded with so many game-breaking bugs, all labeled 1.8.

Something is clearly wrong with FalloutSnip.

Is that the Test version of FO4Edit?

I'd love to get my hands on it so I can see if Faster Terminal Displays and Killshot Perk Fix could've possibly broken anything.

Message sent to Robin. Maybe a warning could be posted? Not sure what his stance is.

Well, that actually doesnt mean that falloutSnip does wrong thing automatically :

If the guy used Tes5edit at first, this is the beginning of the mess, because tes5edit (for skyrim) removes unknown data from the records.

I didnt tried falloutSnip yet, so I dont know exactly what it is capable of, but trashing it just based on this is wrong.

Except no one reported any issues with the version of the mod that used TES5Edit.

I just tried FalloutSnip 1.0b2

Copying record is conservative, nothing is lost.

But modifying record directly in the tool actually removes data too. (even on basic notcompressed record) The tool is clearly not ready yet.

I don't think it will ever be ready. As other have posted Snip has a bad history.

From my experience programs that are inherently buggy need a 100% rework in-order to solve the issues, you can't just slap a few things together to make it work for the next game version.

I am just glad I ran across this thread before using snip.

The fact that a third-party tool was developed to clean plugins created with the official tool is pretty telling, don't you think?

Then again, that wouldn't fit your narrative here. So please, continue blowing everything out of proportion, as per usual.

well, the CK is a clean tool, by definition, but Papyrus is very unsafe if it's not used properly because this can lead to some very bad strikes with savegames memory leak and instabilities.

I am pretty sure that the user of CK is more to blame then CK itself.

ITM errors are a wholly different issue and cannot be compared to corruption.
The important difference here is that while plugins created with the official tools can contain ITMs(*), those plugins themselves have been saved correctly and contain no corruption issues. Period.

http://www.creationkit.com/TES5Edit_Cleaning_Guide_-_TES5Edit

So that's a lie to get people to use TES5Edit or you're lying to help Arthmoor's argument?

Arthmoor isn't lying. He was a major supporter of TESVSnip back in the day and he gave it every benefit of the doubt. I had assumed when FalloutSnip mods started appearing that those old problems had gotten fixed, but having learned that they are not, nor was any attempt even made at fixing them, I think he's right about the problems this program can cause.

'Dirty edits' are not corruption. In fact they are no problem at all - unless two mods 'dirty' the same record and make a conflict.

And I'm saying that any program can cause problems. It isn't limited to just xSnip. The link I posted earlier states that even the official tool can cause problems because it's bugged.

Bethesda can make decent games, but most people buy it for the PC to mod it. You're effectively telling people to not use plugins until next year. That isn't going to happen.

Yeah, yeah, xSnip isn't safe. Well, no tool is safe. End of story. There's no need to try and start up a campaign against xSnip here.

Did you even read the page or did you just look and see that it listed more then ITMs?

ITM issues are not caused by Bethesda's tool saving data incorrectly. They're caused the CK, while saving, including additional data the modder didn't intend to include in the mod. But while the modder didn't intend to include that data, CK still saved it properly.

The article you've linked and quoted does not contradict me.

I don't get what you're trying to say.

We're not supposed to use xSnip because it's not working properly and causing issues like missing content, broken quests, and crashing to desktop. We should wait for the official tool instead.. even though the last one didn't work properly and caused issues like missing content, broken quests, and crashing to desktop?

Why are you downplaying this? It's not a minor issue. This is a major, known issue that causes significant problems for both modders and their users, and there is no fix in the works.

Until the Fallout 4 Creation Kit is out and we have a reliable metric to compare tools against, it's correct we can't rule any editing program safe.

But you do realize there's a big difference between FO4Edit being potentially unsafe and FalloutSnip being provenly unsafe right?