So, you look at the mohave wasteland (Look http://planetfallout.gamespy.com/maps/3/Fallout-New-Vegas
Now, this has been mentioned numberous times by people, but I'll say it again, given that the western border, southeastern and northeastern borders are completely unreachable and empty, it only seems logical that those places should be filled in with mod content. I took a freecam zoom around New Vegas and saw that, although empty, many locations have huge potential for being filled in. (About a third of the game world)
I think that sometime in the future, (Not too soon as most are still playing the game through the first time) modders should divide up the land, mod it as they see fit, and release it as one huge pack with open borders. I'd be willing to help too, I've been using mods since Oblivion and really feel like I should get into modding more myself.
The way I would see it work is it would be done in a similar fashion to Oblivion's Unique landscapes mods, where everyone pitches in in a small area of land, and then releases them as a group. Pretty straightforward really.
I'm wondering what the modding community is gonna be like for this game, It already has dozens of mods, which is good, but many are ports from fallout 3 mods. My question is, is there a significant amount of people interested in doing something like this?

I've done a couple of personal mods concerning those areas, but having explored the barriers, it's very likely these will be opened up in future DLC, one is the canyon wreckage, it looks like they prepared it for a pass into that region, the area south mojave outpost gate also suggest the same since the gate requires a key that's not available, but I suspect the key will show up in a DLC, it's a practice I'm not overly happy with, I mean having to pay to get to other parts of a map that already exist.

You can unlock the map and use it just fine. What you're paying for is the content that goes in it.

Though seriously, I don't understand the concept that you deserve everything made during the game's development time. Even if content is finished by the time the game goes gold and makes it onto the disc, that doesn't mean that the prospect of DLC sales didn't pay for that content to be made.

I would be interested in something like this, it's in a list of a bunch of ideas for mods that i want to make/collaborate with other people, but what RunningBare says sounds plausible, therefore it is probably best to create new land to make the new content in, and make at the roads west where the land ends, doors that lead to the newly created land. then, if the western part of the map gets filled with DLC content, the area could easily be moved to the new west end of the map. Or the the mod area could also connect to other sides of the map too. it could work kind of like Tamriel Rebuilt, though organized better, that project takes way too long.

Wut? There isn't anything actually past the gates or other parts of the map other than the heightmap...

Thats likely because you started playing games after the "DLC" re-branding effort was largely completed.

All really good points, however, if you remember, oblivion had similar large expanses of open map terrain, and everybody thought those would be substantial expansion packs, but no, they never were developed further.
Open world DLC almost always consists of NEW areas, new worldspaces and minimal changes to the existing ones. There are exceptions however, and one can never be sure.
Somehow I doubt they'll fill in the empty areas, it dosen't seem like it would be marketable. "Look, for 800 MS points you can play in areas we previously left blank!" I don't think I've ever heard of something like that, except maybe Dragon Age...
So I say this: If new vegas isn't expanded on in the main gameworld, does anyone want to fill it in with mods? Again this is just speculative, I think something like this is best put off until therees more modder support.

Hah, hardly. I didn't start with an Atari, but I've been into gaming since the sega master system and Zork. I've also been into modeling since Quake 1 and I'm familiar with what it takes to make these games and the fact that the prices haven't changed in over twenty years ($10 hike for console games notwithstandng, but it's still a fraction of the amount that the development process has increased).

Seriously though, if two teams at Obsidian worked on Alpha Protocol and Fallout: New Vegas during the same period, you wouldn't expect to get them both for the same price. Why? Because each team is hired with the expectation of money from sales on the game they're making. If they had a DLC team it'd be the same, and it's the same if they don't and the art director tells someone to spend some extra time on an asset because it's going to be used more prominently later. Anything they make costs them money, and it's up to them how they want to package those assets into one or more final products. Thinking you 'deserve' someone's hard work is pretty selfish.

Though seriously, you're talking about a heightmap here, it's hardly a big deal.

That's a rather weak argument you've got there. I have absolutely no issues with Obsidian charging for DLC content for the same reason I didn't have an issue with Fallout 3's DLC, the game felt like it was good value for money. There's vast amounts of content in both games and the both felt complete and well rounded (if from a gameplay perspective if not a technical one) and the DLC for FO3 was good quality on the whole, Point Lookout particularly was better than some games I've paid ￡40 for.

That does not mean that all DLC content is justifiable or that no one should complain about it. DLC content is without a doubt the worst thing to happen to games industry since it's creation from a consumers point of view, for every example like Fallout 3 and Point Lookout where you get an enjoyable amount of extra content to a game you were already happy with I can give you a dozen examples where the DLC feels about the same value for money as buying a half eaten sandwich for ￡50. Here's some examples of the various types of DLC that have become the norm:

- Horse Armour style. Where you are charged 5 bucks for a ludicrously small amount of content. Dead Space had a really good one $5 bought you a DLC that made 3 of the guns fire very slightly faster..bargain.
- DLCs that add content that is blatantly inferior to the original game. Dragon Age had this by the bucketload. Witch Hunt marketed itself as the conclusion to the Morigan storyline, and then proceeded to reveal literally nothing you didn't already know from the main game.
- Games that are extremely short of content and then release a DLC a week after launch. This type can be made even worse in the case of games like Beautiful Katamari and Resident Evil 5, when the extra content is already on the disc you bought, and you are paying purely to unlock it
- Last but not least, the obvious money grab DLC. These don't even really merit the title of downloadable content, as they are neither downloaded, nor do they add content. Some nice examples being a buyable cheat in Skate 2 that unlocks all the stuff you can unlock if you just play the game and exchanging real money for in game money in Tales of Vesperia.

You seem to have misunderstood my point. I did not say that all DLCs are worth buying, but there is no reason to expect that content to be included in the original game either. Presence on the disc is also irrelevant. They could easily ommit it and make you download it, but putting it on the disc if it's done by the time the game goes gold and there is space is pretty much win-win for both them and the end-user.

We're long past the point where DLCs were last-minute considerations that the devs intended to be part of the game proper. All you have to do about bad DLCs is not buy them, but don't expect to start getting more for your initial purchase if companies did give up the model.

Edit: Also, to the comment that DLC is the worst thing to happen to gaming... See my comment on how much development prices have increased. I can go buy a modern game for the same price as I did Doom 2 back in the day, and that is nothing less than a travesty. The market has increased as well of course but many many games fail to make a sustainable profit. DLC may be the only thing keeping games you like in development. The market has proven to be resistant to price hikes, so they found a new source of revenue, that's business. The fact that mediocre DLCs pushed out for cookie-cutter 8-month-dev-cycle games (which are the ones that make money in this industry) is disappointing, but doesn't invalidate the model.

That's where us PC users are at an advantage. We pay less for the game itself, and can get free patches and improvements via the mod community.

Uh, well, they could have just made the map smaller, and you'd never know would you? Then you'd have no reason for unhappiness

You do know that no one makes you buy these DLC's right?

All details aside. We know this game will have DLC. The DLC may be good, or decent, or maybe bad. I rather Bethesda or Obsidian push out all their DLC so they can first claim any areas near Mojave. Modders are good, but what makes New Vegas a reality is that the developers have the freedom to plan these DLC to addon or not to addon near Mojave.

Best bet is just to keep your grand level mods in their own World Space.

The topic title sorta leads me to believe this is about a request for some magical New Vegas game level generator. Or maybe some program to easily click together extensions to the current Wasteland?

I will humor this topic and scroll up . brb...


...oh boy. at least i feel better that this isn't the least inspired request.

"I think that sometime in the future, (Not too soon as most are still playing the game through the first time) modders should divide up the land, mod it as they see fit, and release it as one huge pack with open borders. "

So, once all these modders create mods that some or none of us may never want to see side by side, let alone near the original Mojave, you want us to make sure they are compatible not with just each other, but somehow to your own logic.

I like idea men. I don't know your modding history, but Worldspace is the answer. Just fake a screen shot or map that looks as if this worldspace borders Mojave.

Edit: Sorry posted previous with proxy by accident.

Nobody seems to have mentioend that there's a reason its empty. Bethesda certainly wouldn't just leave it empty like that. Its Bethesda. It was probably left empty on purpose so that they can use it for DLC.

Everybody has mentioned that...
And oblivion had the same,
they might have made the world bigger than they thought...
it's 99% not for dlc.

Several people have mentioned that...it's mentioned in virtually every post in the thread.



You say that as if that's a good thing? Like the fact that they planned to chop the game up into tiny chargeable chunks from the start should make the consumer feel better about getting less and less for their money? While it's true that games have bigger production costs than they did 10 years ago, there have been equally large movements in terms of the amount of content that passes as acceptable. There was a time not so long ago when the idea of releasing a sequel to a game without updating the engine would have been absurd, charging full price for a stand-alone expansion would have met with outrage and a game that failed to clock in at less than 4 hours would have received major criticism from every publication. These things are now the norm. I mean take a look at Half Life Blue Shift, it was heavily criticised for being too short and not providing enough content, yet it came bundled with Opposing Forces and made some fairly significant modifications to the engine that made the original look better, all for expansion pack money and at the time those seemed like perfectly valid criticisms. Comparing that to what you can expect nowadays for your $60 full price game makes the Blue Shift reviews look ridiculous.



You've got a "hasty generalization" going on there. You claim that DLC is keeping companies I like afloat yet the vast majority of the time it's not the small indie companies that produce these fast buck addons, it's the giant industry leeching behemoths like EA and Blizzavision. These companies aren't clinging onto the edge of bankruptcy, they are market leaders in the highest grossing entertainment industry in the world.



And I don't, but that's irrelevant. The fact that they are available shows a lack of respect for their customers, a lack of respect that cheapens the product. Imagine if you went to buy a new car, you found the one you wanted and you particularly liked it in blue but the manufacturer had done a bit of research and found out that blue was the most popular colour so they want ￡1000 more for it. It costs them nothing, but they know people will pay that bit extra just for the right colour.

The fact that some people will pay extra doesn't make it any less cynical nor does it make it a less valid reason for resentment.

Anyway, this is WAY off topic. Not only does it not have anything to do with the thread, Bethesda's DLCs have been pretty decent on the whole excluding one or two slip-ups.

Agreed. I think we've all said what we wanted to.

Oh, one thing about the whole "the land is for DLCs" thing and Oblivion: Just because they didn't end up putting out any big DLCs to fill Elsweyr(sp?) and all doesn't mean that they didn't plan to and that those plans weren't cut.

Anyway I haven't looked beyond the borders, but if someone says it looks like it's prepared for DLC that's good enough for me. For me the absolute most important thing in modding is dynamic compatibility, and you're really not gaining anything by using the WastelandNV worldspace anyway. Either way you have to generate LOD for the area. Well, assuming you got anyone to join the project anyway. There aren't a whole lot of mods that actually require lots of land to plunk things down anyway. Land usually means "content" mods and content mods means quests and voices (unless we go north to meet the great roving bands of wandering warrior mimes) and that's a pretty high bar to set.

In Oblivion, the areas beyond the invisible borders were highly incomplete-- barren regions with simple repeating textures and large impassable voids. In Fallout: New Vegas, are the areas beyond the invisible borders more complete than they were in Oblivion?

Aren't you people aware, that the basic landscape design always gets generated with a heightmap? And the heightmap always has the same basic size, doesn't matter if you wanna use some parts or not, the heightmap gets generated there anyway. That's the reason why there is empty land, nothing else. Everybody can generate a landscape of that size in a few minutes with a proper heightmap.

How about the argument stops and we get both of you to work on something to fill in those gaps? xD



Kidding of course, though it would not hurt my feelings.


I explored the area outside the Mojave Outpost gates earlier for the first time, and oddly enough I found the vast, empty desert rather nice. It would be nice for a modder to go through and populate the area with vegetation and maybe creature spawns but I see no need to make it a metropolis.

Having some large empty nothing is something I miss a lot. Morrowind had large areas of land that were just there for the exploratory person. Oblivion had less of them, and Fallout 3/New Vegas have very little in that way. In fact, why not just make a railway along that way, a small NCR owned train station, some random traders, and call it quits? A little life and some exploration is all the Mojave outpost empty area really needs.

I think it would be fun to continue that stretch of highway a nice, sizable ways South... leaving much of the desolate desert feel intact, and doing as was suggested earlier: populating that region with some radscorpions and geckos... maybe a deathclaw nest somewhere down there, in a nice big cave... wilderness sorts of things.


Go far enough, and you wind up in Arizona... perfect for a new, wide-open worldspace.

Really this is all off topic. This is a thread to discuss modding, not DLC speculation.

Really I think Obsidian isn't gonna be supporting this game nearly as much as Fallout 3 was supported.

So, I'd like to see California in this game. THat might have to be a seperate world, but maybe not..Imagine going from Mojave Outpost to the hub, shady sands, etc. THat wouldn't be that impossible really, distances would work fairly well...

I'm pretty sure some of that unused map area is there in place for DLC. At the very least, I would not touch that area until DLC is done.

As to Oblivion, pretty sure the areas at the edge of the map were supposed to be other provinces and not intended to be populated or used as Oblivion was to be Cyrodil only, apart from the expansion, for which they went with a whole new world space.