Oh for [censored] sake. Why should they? This is the story they thought appropriate for Fallout 4, this is what we get. Your character has to be a husband/wife and a daddy/mommy. It may not click in with people who aren't married or those that are but never had a baby, it won't click in with heterosixuals, homosixuals, zoophiliacs et cetera. But this is how it is. So why do they need to write a story YOU want? What makes you so damn entitled?

I'm not a married man, don't intend to get married. Does it bother me that I'm playing a married man/woman? Does it bother me that I'm going to play as a parent despite me never desiring to be one? No. No, not at all. It's their story, they can do what they want. A line has to be drawn somewhere between player freedom and the story Bethesda wants to tell.

No signs of segregation
No signs of racism
Military allowed female combatants
Military was multi-racial
No sign that it is based on 1950'S society

Show anywhere from sources that the pre-war is based on 1950's society and not just the culture. You can't because it's not the 1950's, it's NOT based on 1950's society BUT on 1950's culture in a retrofuturistic setting.

Segregation was a big deal in the 1950's, racism was a big deal in the 1950's and not just in the south, nation wide yet we saw nothing to suggest that either were practiced or institutionalized in the pre-war unlike how it was in the actual 1950's. As far as we see it the 1950's happened in fallout but the culture stayed that way instead of advancing past that.

Culture =/= social norms. You can have 1950's culture but no sight of it's social norms, which MEANS it isn't based on 1950's society but JUST the culture.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallout_(series)#Series_overview

Never played the original games did you? Please don't try and convince me of something that there is evidence contradicting your position all over the internet. Even in some Todd Howard interviews for FO:3.

Ok then post the interviews, post whatever source you can use but until then I'm not going to believe you.

Denial. Not just a river in Egypt.......

You obviously have internet, do your own research.

and thus your argument is now null and void because of that. I don't write an essay from school and tell the teacher "You have the internet go look it up" instead of showing my citation. I don't write an article for a publication and tell the reader to "go look it up" instead of showing my citation. You are the one making the claim, you do your own damn research and post the results

This is how debating works, you want to prove me wrong? DO IT WITH SOURCES YOU POST.

Very well then, turnabout is fair play. PROVE TO ME that fallout is NOT based on 1950's society, with references. Your opinion/justification/observation is only your opinion.

My proof is lack of segregation, lack of pre-war racism, multi-racial armed force, women serving as combatants in the armed forces, interracial relationships.

Good luck with that. Next maybe prove that water isn't wet.

Your opin

Your opinion/observation. Pretty much worthless for this particular argument. So, let's try this. You want to be spoon-fed,http://lmgtfy.com/?q=fallout+based+on+1950%27s+society ya go.

You realize that proved absolutely nothing right?

You know something I noticed on these topics is that things simply go in circles. I have not read one oost that hadn't been discussed in an ealier one.

Any rational person would become tired of this.

So far the themes seem to be

Definition of roleplaying
People telling others it really isn't and issue
THIS is isn't skyrim
Whether or not the lgbt people should play a 50s closet case is appropriate.
People saying that there isn't a big deal or that it is and they are furious.

I do know who is here from the last conversation or whether or not I am guilty as well but has anyone noticed that when one point is discussed here, it is quicky forgotten and discussed once again after couple pages?

The burden of proof is on *you* to prove that Fallout's 1950s was an exact carbon-copy of our 1950s. Cider! has already presented proof backing up his/her claims, now it's your turn. Give us evidence to refute Cider!'s claims.

@ Retro- You are correct about that. Absolutely correct.

What? You can't read? Follow some of the links. The first five support my position, NONE of them contradict it. You think I am wrong? Then show me some FACTS. Not supposition, or innuendo, or opinion. I have presented facts. If you chose not to believe them, that is YOUR problem, not mine.

1. Way to be insulting
2. Your "source" brought nothing up so good job with that.


Again, if you're going to debate actually do it properly. It's not my opinion, it's because there are no signs of it being anything like 1950s society but solely it's cultural influences in a retro-futuristic style. I can't post any source when a source doesn't exist because there is nothing to back up your own claim.

In short no segregation, no racism, interracial couples are normal and no reason to believe homosixual couples would be ostracized.

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout_world_FAQ

This is the only thing that brings up society or values and even then it could be wrong because, well, it doesn't have citation.

Nature of internet debates. Often because people don't read through previous posts/ignore them/bring up a similar but slightly different PoV and the same point have to be made again. And again. And again. But! Occasionally you actually convince someone or someone brings up a new/interesting point and that makes the whole thing worth it to me.

You really don't know how to have a debate, do you?

Here are some links:

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Timeline

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout_world

Here is a quote from the 'Timeline' link: "Note that the Fallout world is not our own, but rather one that has diverged from ours soon after World War II. So, while it takes place in the future, it is not our future, but a future as imagined in traditional 1950s style science fiction."

Basically, we're playing in a universe based off of the 1950s understanding of science and nuclear war/radiation. This is not set in our real-world timeline if nuclear war happened in our 1950s. It does not address the socio aspects of the 1950s, both ours and in the Fallout universe.

Debating social aspects of Fallout despite the fact society is nothing but a shell of what it was due to a nuclear holocaust. Does this really matter at all to the concept of Fallout as a game? It was never an issue in the past. No matter what side is being presented; all of it is pointless as we play after the society we debate has been put to rest via nuclear hellfire.

I agree. If there were any racist/homophobic attitudes, I think it was all destroyed on October 2077.

Kay:

Female American soldiers - Operation Anchorage, unlike the actual 1950s.

Interracial couple living openly together in white suburbia - Fallout 4 E3 presentation, unlike the actual 1950's.

Female head of department with snekky military ties - Old World Blues.

But!

I can't and won't deny that the Fallout world is based on the 1950's culture, cuz it is. I will object to the idea that they are exactly alike in every single way.

Oh yeah, I'm not denying that it's based off of 1950s American culture, it's not a literal carbon-copy of America in the 1950s.

Right, so, we should ignore pushing two decades of Fallout cannon, because it doesn't fit some peoples view of how the world should be. Right.

I would also like to point out that NOWHERE did I state that Fallout society was EXACTLY LIKE 1950's, each and every time I have brought that up, I have said "Based On".

So, observations from in-game count? Well, how about these then?

Architecture.

Fashion.

Vehicle body styles.

Hair styles.

Art Deco furniture.

Juke Boxes.

Even the Refrigerators are circa 1950's designs.

Given time, I could expand that list dramatically, but, I have to go to work now.

So basically all the superficial stuff was like the 50's but attitudes and stereotypes and biases might not have been?

They're talking about the pre-war society.