10, 20, 30 minutes of introduction with all the unhappy implications that a male-female hetero mono relationship bring...

... compared to hundreds of hours of you being whoever you want.

Hmm.

You know an interesting idea is that the entire beginning was in fact, the simulation itself. Maybe he/she never got married and had a kid.

I mean has no one found it strange that the Vaut-Tec employee literally signed him up MINUTES before the bombs fell and was neverous through the whole thing? Not to mention they didn't make it into the vault in the end and was caught in the blast.

Think of it this way. In Vault 112 most of them had no idea that they were in a simulation or that a war had even happened.

What if after 200 hundred years the simulation constructed a life for you and the rest of the dwellers as the "Vault" experiment. Each person had their own versions of a good life and in your version you are happily married with a kid. For what ever reason though the vault started to fail and all the Dwellers begin to die.

As a last ditch effort to save you, the computer fail safe decided for you to relive the bombs falling in order to end the simulation without having you realize that your life was a simulation in the first place. The computer tried getting you to the vault as quick as possible but you were not quick enough and didn't make it into the virtual stasis pod. Instead you were caught in the blast but the computer was unable to prevent you from waking up anyway.

Only real thing that would contradict this is the fact Codsworth is a reality but for all we know is that you actually did have him before entering the real vault but Codsworth has absolutely no knowledge of you ever being married or having a kid because that was only in the simulation.


Lol I know this is unlikely but if the marriage was fake then I feel people would have less to worry about.

Guys are way over thinking this whole fantasy game story. Just let it release, enjoy. I'm sure the game will be mod-able after a while, and then you can mod it how ever you want it and play the way you want it.

The premiss of the Fallout Universe is based on a future as envisioned by the people in the 1950's.

To get the full picture, you need to get into your Wayback machine and travel back to the 1950's. Start interviewing people about what they think the world will be like in 120 years. The picture of the future they paint will, of course, have a 1950's theme because that is their frame of reference. The Fallout Universe is BASED on this picture that has been painted, it is NOT the picture. This gives the developers (and us) a hell of a lot of wiggle room.

If you want to know how they think race relations would go, just look at human-ghoul relations in-game.

Maybe not in October 2077, but consider.

A white racist and a black racist meet in the wasteland. The come under attack by a nest of radscorpions. It they are incapable of putting aside their differences or fail to recognize the fact that they need each other to survive, they become lunch. It is not going to take 200 years to cull the bigot herds.

If you want to believe this nonsense, fine, but don't try to distort the fallout world, which is proven to be based in 1950's culture and aesthetics time and time again, to shove this kind of ideology on it.

Want proof?

The idea that gender is a social construct has been debunked by Harald Eia. Do some research on "The gender equality paradox" to see what you find out.

Ok, this thread is going to be ended soon, so I am going to make a statement.

This thread (and some others like it) are both premature and tardy.

It is tardy because of the state of development and scheduled release are such that it is too late to change things now without impacting the release date. Considering we know almost nothing of the story of Fallout 4, we cannot judge how much of an impact any change would have.

It is premature because we do not know the full extent of customization available. There were two sections of the character customization menu we were never shown. The first was BODY, but the most interesting is the menu selection, EXTRAS. THAT can be almost anything, up to and including creating a Fallout Equestria character {shudder}. Basically, many of the concerns people have voiced may have been dealt with.

The... comedian?

Yes, the comedian.

This in and of itself is meaningless, though.

He is a proponent of one theory that is in competition with other theories. All of which debunk the others.

Right.

Well I read his theory got a lot of criticism before and after he shared it and so using the word 'debunked' when referring to his work on why gender isn't a social construct seems a bit... premature.

The point is that the game allows you to play as both sixes.

The problem is that some people are throwing a fit because the player character is married and has a kid, which means they can't roleplay a "gay" person. I doubt the people complaining about such a small and pointless thing are real Fallout fans, since some are saying they won't play the game because of such a small and meaningless detail.

That's all i'm saying.

Actually when you claim something it is perfectly reasonable for someone to ask you to cite your source telling them to go look it up on their own only serves to show that there is a high change you are making up 'facts.' When you write any paper in school you can't cite a fack by saying hey teach go look it up on the internet. This is true in any reasoned debate. It is on you to prove you position not for other people to prove it for you.

I think it will be a fairly simple mod to trick the engine in swapping out the male/female textures and voice for their opposite.

Probably need one for each gender ... So in essence the game will still see male/female ... and you see a predetermined 2 males , or 2 females by which mod you installed.

And as long as they can still carry their implied gender tag that the game reacts to. Then that should make for some more diversity.

A manly male , feminine male , feminine female , manly female. With the game responding to what you picked per mod.

And all we need is some way to tell which is which from the creation screen. (or just leave the voice)

How the baby was made ... really shouldn't matter at this point should it?

I remember in Baldurs gate 2 you could just swap your gender after creation ... making gay relationship dialogue possible with different group members.

Really? So if a fan doesn't share you exact sensabilities on a given subject they are not real fans? Does this mean that there is only one set of true fans with no room for disagreement about fallout? Cuz i am pretty sure there is a group of fans who are not okay with the Bethesda style of Fallout games and another set of fans that are okay with them and have played the older games and still another set of fans who have only played FO3 and FONV. I am not so arragant to claim any of these three groups not true fans.

''Pander to my views or face my forum wrath!''

The was the whole point of things. They created a dynamic where race relations with humans were good. Racism between humans were pretty much gone but they transfered them to Ghouls to make a commentary. Pretty much a classic Science fiction trope. To make this work humans in your setting actually can't have a problem with race and skin colour. Otherwise the spotlight gets diffused and doesn't work as a commentary.

Lol? Bethesda style?

All the previous games, even NV to an extent, have a protagonist with a set background. Maybe if they cut the character creation, or Fallout became an FPS with a 5 hour long CoD campaign, these would be reasons to rant about the game and not buying it. But ranting that a married protagonist offends people because they want to roleplay a gay character, then complaining that the said protagonist's background should be removed is unreasonable, and not something i believe true fans would care so much, yes.

If there is a Bethesda style worth pointing out ... I'd say it's definitely mod ability.

So swapping the wife or husband for the other gender shouldn't be to hard. Heck maybe the file structure , and function options are set up in a way , so that it will be as simple as entering a cheat code.

Unless of course people want to argue that the coding behind the scenes isn't politically correct enough.

I'm [censored] entitled as a long-time fan.

What if the protagonist was gay and that couldn't be changed at all. Do you know how many people who claim that "it doesn't matter" for what we're given now would lash out? Same scenario.

Probably quite a few, but not all of them. Shocking I know, but every once in a while you run into the occasional oddball who actually means what he/she says.

The two scenarios really aren't fair to compare (that rhymed!). A straight person being forced to play a gay person would have to do so like once in a thousand times, then they can emerge and jump in the endless pool of hetero media representation. The gay person though? Nooooooot so much. It's basically the inverse. So when straight people say "I wouldn't care if I had to play a gay person, sixuality doesn't matter!" I believe them. But it isn't much of a sacrifice to forgo a cup of water if you have a spring fed reservoir at home now innit?

Actually, if you had read a bit further, rather than just jumping in here, you would have noticed that I did indeed provide my proof, which was poo-poohed by the naysayers.

Fallout universe is based on 1950's society. Yes, all the superficial stuff, and more as well. Women in combat (operation anchorage) was released by beth, and in all reality, violated canon. But then, beth is notorious for that kind of behavior. (Cyrodiil a tropical rain forest anyone?)

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout_world_FAQ one reference that agrees with me.

And there are others.

Hmm ... in FO2 I didn't want to start the game as a tribal, but I did and got over it. In FO3 I didn't want to start the game as a kid, but I did and got over it. In FONV I didn't want to start the game with a bullet in my head, but I did and got over it. If in FO4 I have to start as part of a married couple (man and woman) with a child, I will and I'll get over it.

What I never did is feel so privileged that I had to start threads and make posts about how unfair it was. It's the start of the game. It's the start of Bethesda's game. It will pass and then you can go on and complain about why NPC X isn't gay. Just look at what you have to look forward to.

I hope that the 'sixuality' perks are included, just because it felt good seeing that kind of option in F:NV. That said, I assume the game will deliver in content even if they are omitted. The response to this as an issue is kind of unnerving, take a look at other forums and the homophobia Geiger counter goes all vault 87. I would like the option to choose much in the same way people would like the option to not choose a play style they dislike for personal preference. It wont ruin the game for me but it would be nice.

Still... it's Bethesda... we're in good hands... right?