Great idea, would require a lot of titles though to make up for the various possibilites.
And maybe after looking over it one might go "Wow... I'm a mugger? It actually makes a lot of sense now." instead of "Oh, I'm the saint of the wastes... I just killed a town..."

Nice idea, but I don't quite get what A?al?fssl?f is

I think it also helps by looking at different characters in movies, series, comics etc and try to place them in Fallout and see what karma they would have. Malcolm Reynolds from Firefly/Serenity for example, what kind of karma would he have with the system we propose for Fallout? He is a good man but a pirate, right? And he do jobs if it means getting paid. Sometimes he don't want to get involved in a situation because it's none of his business, and he wants to leave. He doesn't want to risk his life or his whereabouts to Alliance if it's not a job he's paid for, and sometimes even then he can be hesitant, risking his life I mean. But like in the second episode, when they do the train job and find out that the goods they just stole was medicine heading for a town with a lot of sick people, he gives up the loot even though his employer is a homicidal maniac and will kill him if he breaks contract. So, what karma would Mal have? Also bring up other characters that are too hard to define with Fallouts "Good, Bad, Neutral", you know to brainstorm this idea and help coming up with a good system.

Yeah... I ssay every 5% is a different title





He'd probably have the title of "Soft Hearted Pirate"

As it was a quick draft I didn't really want to spend time thinking of different "karma elements" so I just typed something on my keyboard.

Yeah, I got that, just made a joke about it I should said something like "you spelt it wrong, it should be A?al?wfssl?wfen, unless it's past tense"

But I'd be boring either way

Put a smile on my face, and that is not a feat many are capable of.

Yay, I'm so awesome, making people smile over the intrawebz!

Oh yes returning a slave should be worth good karma.

In any event Karma and Reputation are two very different things, but both belong in fallout.
Karma will go about the same time as the SPECIAL system.

I think it needs fixed. You kill a raider get good karma and take his stuff and get bad karma. How does that work?

I agree it needs alot of adjusting,

ex: Your are Idolized by the NCR and Vilified by Caesar's Legion but you still lose Karma for killing them or stealing from them?

I say how your karma is lost or gained depends on your reputation with the group... It's ridicules any other way.

So let's say that you are at your best friend's place at a party, and you notice he has dropped his wallet. You pick it up and you have two choices. The good friend you are you find him and give it back. Or the gready bastard you are, you empty it of cash, $35 in total, and put it back where you found it.

What option adds and what option subtracts Karma? You have really Good Reputation with this guy, since he's your best friend and all.

Let's say that it wasn't your best friend's wallet you found, but the wallet of the stuck-up guy who stole your girlfriend, and who you've been fighting with since even before that happened, who is also at that party. You think, either I can be the better man and give it back. Or I'll have a bit of revenge on this [censored], and empty the wallet of cash and throw it back on the floor. You also take his ID and burn it.

What option adds and what option subtracts Karma? You have really Bad Reputation with this guy, being your nemesis and all.

Karma isn't something that should make a huge impact in the game world, it's mostly for your benefit. It's a "true gauge" of your deeds. The reputation system is where the big impact on other would come from. Karma would give small bonus or penalties depending on how different your karma is to theirs. Like a gut feeling others have about you but can't prove.

Indeed. A gutfeeling. Good people be like "I have a feeling something's not right in your head" or "I feel like I can trust you, must be those honest eyes." That is what it should do... aswell as some dialogue options imo, if you are evil you could say something really evil (and mean it) that you wouldn't had said if you were a goodie, and vice versa. Could also work in your favor, like impressing some raider boss, showing that you really are souless, or if you have good karma, impressing some follower of the apocalypse, showing you really would help the poor and not getting paid, and give you bonuses that way.

That would be nice too. I always like stuff that gives you more dialogue options. I also think that Karma should be "invisible" so you never get any Karma notifications. you can just see your tally. That way you'll "play normally" and it would be a truer judge of your deeds.

Indeed. I love everything that can give a different result in a dialogue tree (I love dialogues) and I also agree that karma gain/loss should be invisible, not showing up every damn time "lost Karma" and you're like "oh noez, but I'mma good guy! I don't think what I just did was bad".

It has a place in Fallout but it needs more thoughtful implementation.

I took my badass evil character from New Vegas and killed my way into Vault 3 and I suddenly went form Devil to Messiah.

Slaughtering everyone I can find (McCarren, Westside, Novac, Primm, etc) nets me no negative Karma but killing a few junkies turns me into Saint Courier?

Stealing crap had almost no impact on Karma and given that you could pick sides it didn't make sense that it wasn't basically considered spoils of war when taken from people trying to kill you.

Just because I said that returning the slave shouldn't return you bad karma, doesn't mean that I wanted it to return good karma. Please, the sarcasm isn't really helping at all.
If you actually paid attention (which I'm assuming you did), you would have realized that I wanted karma gone completely.

And saying that "Karma will go about the same time as the SPECIAL system" because they "both belong in fallout" is not a good argument. Fallout can evolve and fix some of it's broken mechanics and still remain "Fallout".

If the SPECIAL system is removed.... oh boy, what big mistake, the SPECIAL system was created since that Interplay lost the right to use GURPS

what should be removed is the VATS system


Personally, Fallout its not gonna be the same without karma, every game has their own stuff, karma, SPECIAL and reputation for every town/faction is the stuff of Fallout.

Aim should be brought back.
It wouldn't "stop" time but rather slow it down by 40% while you can place your shots. (If the game is not turn-based.)

Agree, AIM must be brought back again

I'd prefer slow-motion over aiming at body parts... It brings you so much more into the game...

Well it's not that I like slow-mo at all, I think that after Max Payne it was an over used gimmick.
But how is AIM or VATS going to work without stopping time or slowing time down yknow?
Would not use the feature if it was in real-time.
Besides, 40% slow-mo isn't a lot really.

True but 40% will be helpful to people with slow reflexes and is more than enough time for me!

If I hear that a group of Raiders, murderers, rapists, scumbags all, are holed up in some building and I go and clear that building, I should not receive a single shred of negative karma. I should also be able to 'steal' their armor, stimpacks, guns, and ammunition without karma loss- dead men don't have property, and their severe crimes prompted my actions.

I like karma, but the 'stealing' needs to be toned down. Same with owned beds- if I kill all the Legion members of a camp, the beds are no longer owned. Maybe you can make more literal arguments- I am stealing these items, I am sleeping in a bed not my own- but I sure as hell shouldn't receive negative karma for ir.

If there is an option to talk with the raiders and slavers and deal with them peacefully and they have done nothing to you, you should get bad karma if you just go in killing. New Vegas is set up so you decide who is bad or good. The Legion are not the bad guys its pretty much up to you to decided that. Stealing is still stealing does not matter who you are stealing from.