It's not just about DRM. Convenience comes to mind when being able to install your games without discs anywhere and anytime.

This! Steam is nice as an option, especially older games that are hard to get from stores. But as the REQUIREMENT for even playing the game... BIG, BAD NO-NO!!! That's what's so great about Oblivion and Fallout 3, you don't need anything to play it. Just install and you're good to go.

I highly doubt Skyrim will require either of the two.

I have bought Morrowind 7 times and Oblivion 2 times due to losing the discs. (True story)

If Steam is required to play Skyrim I won't even buy 1.

If you often lose your discs, you should be happy to be able to use Steam for it

Well, for starters, you can't drive your car into a CD/DVD burner and make 500 copies of it.

Just to let you know, Steam fixed the issue with OBSE and now it works fine. That's how awesome Steam is.

I don't care what any dumbnuts propagate about Steam being awesome, I have SEEN MYSELF that buying games through Steam is a terrible idea. If you move to a different contintent, the game will be inaccessible. If you're offline for more than X days, the Steam client will eventually require a log-in to play, requiring an internet connection (and DON'T [censored] TELL ME IT'S WRONG, because it's not)

I frequently lose my internet for days, and many games, like Civilization 5 (my final straw with Steam) has been completely untouchable after a point in time.

No. Steam definitely, 100%, without a doubt, will make me not buy it if it's part of the package.

"Some times you only need a little less gun"

man, the GFWL have country block too...
but GFWL dont reembolse (reeward// ahhh i forget the word. -.) you if your game is blocked by country block, but steam yes, i give all my money back when he blocks GTA IV for BR!

I don't think you understand. Any game you buy on Steam from, say Europe, will not be playable from the US/Asia/South America.

Except that you don't own the game you buy. It would be like leasing a car and then believing you have the right to sell that car. Federal court made a ruling on this just this past fall:
http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2010/09/the-end-of-used-major-ruling-upholds-tough-software-licenses.ars

And along with that comes the responsibility for the owner of that IP to protect it to the best of their ability (doesn't mean they can stop it but it means they must make a good will effort to protect it). They can do this by either trying to do so themselves with some sort of DRM or they can contract with a company which is set up to do just that for them. The later of course allows them to leave it to someone else so they can concentrate on developing and publishing. Never the less, they are required to do something to show they are trying to protect their owned IP.

While we know that regardless of what is done there will be those who will pirate games, that does not remove a companies responsibility to protect their IP. So all we can hope for ever is that they use something which we can live with.

For me, I prefer Steam to GFWL or SecuROM. We all have our "rathers" but something must be legally used to protect the company's right to call it their own.
http://www.allbestarticles.com/legal-informations/trademarks/trademark-laws-protect-small-businesses.html

My Steam account and all games on it (more than 50 back then) worked perfectly fine in Japan. A Canadian friend of mine plays against me from two blocks away here in Berlin.

Just log in with a european proxy.

In my opinion Steam isn't that bad.
I never experienced problems in offline mode, I like the auto-update, I like the in-game clock and ingame internet browser, I like the new screenshot manager and I will like the upcoming video recording feature.

But of course thats my opinion! I had only good experices with Steam until now and I can understand that people with other experiences worry about Steam!

About the offline mode problem:
Has anyone of you ever tried to ask Steam Support why you have to reconnect every now and then even if you're in offline mode?
Tell them that you don't have a stable internet connection.
I'm sure they have a solution for you!

Playing offline is pretty well spelled out here:
https://support.steampowered.com/kb_article.php?ref=3160-AGCB-2555

I have many friends who live in the bush with no internet connection at all. They bring their PC out, download from steam, go offline following those instructions exactly then go back to the woods and play their game for a long period of time without problems offline.

^This. Steam--or any online DRM for a single-player game--would be a deal-breaker for me.

not quite true, It's anywhere & anytime you have a high-speed connection (which not everyone has) & without High-Speed internet it's a very inconvenient system especially when Steam forces the first patching on installation.

Nice to hear that even the Masai are enjoying the advent of computerized civilization

Steam doesn't force you to update.
Just right click the game -> properties->updates and choose "Do not automatically update this game" and done.
Discount_Flunky did a good thread about that here: http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1178171-clearing-up-misconceptions-about-steam/

If you buy a steam game retail you don't have to download it. You have to download Steam, though (I dunno if its included with the retail game).
Then you can make a game backup via Steam (very good compression, a 8GB game can easily be compressed to 4GB) and save it on your hdd.

I have all my games saved in one big Steam Backup file. I just double click it, then I choose which game I want to install and 5 minutes later I can play it.
It's easy and I don't have to install a game for half an hour because of the slow DVD drive or whatever the reason is.

:unsure: And I thought they were just homesteaders.

@AliTheLord: Thank you so much mate =D I'll start downloading it right away. Here I was thinking that giving my disk away for the Steam version would be a regrettable decision forever >D

@Walex: Wonderful points, and makes me way more confident on a Steam release. As you've said, Steam may have some inconveniences here and there, but they are all, in 90% of the instances, easily solved. I remember back in the day, in 2004/2008, I would have LOADS of trouble with it in a regular basis. Gladly, the system has improved a lot, and I believe most of those left with a sour taste in their mouths would come off with a huge grin, or at least indifference, if they gave it another shot nowadays.

that only comes into effect after the initial patching that's the way New Vegas installs. Please check posts #11 on in http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1173435-nevermind-the-game-it-wont-even-install/
& yes I am familiar with DF's thread.

when I gave Steam a chance it took 5 hours of downloading just for Steam itself when I installed from a retail disc (Front mission evolved) this past year.

Oh yeah, I can remember those days ^^. I had a lot of trouble with it too and I hated Steam.
But they improved a lot since then and 2008 I guess I tried it again and it worked. It just worked.


@ Rusty Gunn:
Ok, thats a good point you have there and I fully understand you.
I never thought of that.
You should write Steam support your problem, maybe there is a workaround or they know something that might help you.
If you do pls keep us updated .

This, but if i had to choose, i would choose steam.

I'd vote gfwl. It gave me less trouble then steam. I also don't recall it ever screwing with fose. Ideal solution would to have neither. Dear god I hate those online vendors.

I think you may be mixed up, FOSE will not work with GFWL. You either use FOSE or you log into GFWL, you cannot do both at the same time. FOSE actually disables GFWL when you launch it.

which would be fine with me

time for a mod to come