How intelligent are giants, and how advanced is their interaction with the other races?

Do we have any information on giants other than the 6th Fight?

A snippet from the text - "[Giants] were a bit different than we Nords remembered, or perhaps we had forgotten much, but they would not speak to us anymore-- they would only smile in their lazy way, stomp over, and take our stuff. If we fought them, they roared louder than the Tongues of High Hrothgar, and brave steads would be blasted whole into so much paste, [chickens and all (?)]... [and] eventually we learned that if we left stuff out for the Giants, and painted this stuff brightly and with swirls (they love swirls) and stuck big signs up pointing to it all, they would simply take THAT stuff and not anything else and no fighting would be have to be done..."

In-game, giants in Daggerfall are a typical aggressive enemy, although there is the option to to learn Giantish (however it's also possible to learn the language of many other enemies). In Skyrim they're territorial - won't usually attack unless the player encroaches on their land.

This query is really motivated by my involvement in the "Skyrim Immersive Creatures" mod for Skyrim. The main author of the mod has given some giants the ability to wield iron weapons and helmets - how plausible is this? I can imagine giants carving wood and bone into clubs, but metal weaponry initially struck me as beyond their skill level - or could I be wrong on this?

My first instinct was that giants wouldn't need helmets at all, as there is nothing else that size so they wouldn't need head protection - but then there's the possibility of them fighting amongst themselves (over mammoth herds or territory in general). It's also quite possible that they would need head protection from arrows - as many of the locals have realised that getting close to their clubs would be a bad idea!

Could this armor (and weaponry) be made by the giants in recent years, or would they be left over from when giants were (possibly) culturally more advanced? Or would it be possible that they could have minimal interaction with the local population - Nord blacksmiths provide armor for them as an alternative to offerings of painted cows? Is there any evidence to suggest levels of society - ie. is there anything to suggest that there are more intelligent giants anywhere who could be trading with the tribal giants?

The author of the mod has stated that he is leaving the giant helmets in the mod, so I'm looking into writing an in-game book to provide an explanation for this, keeping as close to lore as possible - any ideas and suggestions would be appreciated.

There as intelligent, if not more, then the Falmer.

They have there own language, culture, food supply, herding, weaponry and clothing.

They trade with the local Nords. Mentioned http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Official_warning. There's also the part of Sanguine's quest where you sell a goat to one while drunk.

Well skyrim had clearly intended them to be interactable. You'll notice that in the preview gameplay, while Todd's cursor driffted over the Giant it came up with Press button to Talk.

I imagine the Giants would be considered semi-sentient, if not fully-sentient (though slow)

There was also a scrapped quest line for the civil war which involved trying to get one to fight for whichever side you're on. I'm sure a third party could outfit a giant in some makeshift armor like Gunmar did for those trolls. I'm not sure if they have any skill in metalworking however.

Interesting - I've never seen that before.

Yeah, but under daedric influence anything could happen...

This, combined with the giantish language from Daggerfall suggests that they may well be capable of more advanced interactions with the rest of the population.

I didn't know that.

So, basically the evidence suggests that it's quite possible for them to wear iron armor and wield iron axes if they find or barter them. Maybe I'll add a new note to the game along the lines of the "Official Warning" note that describes a blacksmith trying to sell some giant-sized armor to a giant in exhange for leaving his settlement alone.

Personally I don't see Giants wearing armor - metallurgy doesn't seem to be their thing. Most weapons, I suspect, are made of wood or bone. And really - do Giants who one-shot almost everything really need armor or better weapons? Really?

In addition to what has already been said, giants also have the knowledge to make cheese, turn mammoth ivory into powder (and I believe they're the only ones that know how to do that), and raise mammoths.

This is totally speculation, as I've not read into Giants yet, but I consider their intelligence to be similar to that of the Trolls in the Hobbit. Though perhaps with better table manners.

Despite their demonstrable intelligence, culture, and so on, I doubt that (modern) Giants have any advanced armor, as intelligence does not necessarily lead to heavy armors; a good in-game example of that is the Forsworn. I'm also curious about the scale such a forge would have to be, though that qualm may be irrelevant, what with the apparent existence of dragon smiths ("Thieves tell tales about [Goldbrand's] golden make and how it was actually forged by ancient dragons of the North.").

I'm simply not convinced that modern Giants would or could forge heavy armors. They surely have craftsmen, but smiths? However, I'm more than willing to support the idea that the giants (dubbed karstaag-men) who came to Skyrim with Ysgramor wore armor. After all, the North is where the dragon forge(s) is/are, and the Giants back then were so closely bound to the Nords that they surely had armor forged for them for battle. And then some of the Giants of today could have continued inheriting said armor, forged thousands of years ago yet still workable, having been reinforced by a conjunction of Nordic steel and Thu'um-in-smithing. Seeing a Giant decked out in Ancient Nord armor would certainly be interesting.

I'm assuming that the iron weapons and helmets are of modern make, though? Meh.

(Note: I'm not entirely sure whether the karstaag-men were vanilla Giants or Frost Giants--Frost Giants may be more likely, considering that Karstaag himself was a Frost Giant--but it is irrelevant, as the Giants could be toned down Frost Giants, or they could have stolen one set of armor at a time from the Frost Giants and started the line of inheritance from there.)

Speaking about Goldbrand... An akaviri shaped weapon forged by the Dragons ? It's just like Nords would try to forge Thalmor's equipment.

Akavir has dragons. The Atmoran dragons and the Akaviri dragons probably swapped ideas. Maybe the Tsaesci even stole the style from the Akaviri dragons, rather than the Akaviri dragons stealing the style from the Tsaesci.

I have a feeling that they have become considerably dumber since Daggerfall.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't Atmoran dragons the same ones that fleed from Tsaesci in Akavir ?

After swearing an oath to protect Auri-El and all of his children from threats within and without, Trinimac was given a golden blade, imbued with Auri-El's fire, to reflect his station as guardian and champion. After Trinimac was "ruined" by Prince Boethiah, the once-proud warrior discarded the blade in shame and anger. Boethiah then took the blade as a battle-trophy, proving to all that it was she who defeated the mighty Trinimac.

There are rumors that Emperor Titus Mede II wielded the Goldbrand during the Great War against the Dominion's armies. Ironic, isn't it? The blade that once served the guardian of Auri-El's children, now cuts them down in droves.

/speculation

As per the original topic on giants, I'm curious about whether or not they were desecrating Malacath's shrine in "The Cursed Tribe." The statue was completely unharmed, and they had it adorned with the skulls of mammoths. It brings into question their religous beliefs.

Akavir and Atmora are connected. It makes sense

In my mind, the dragons had forged it for Pelinal during his stint as Hans the Fox, but yours actually explains why Boethiah has claimed it. I like it.

Though it is of the dragons of the North.

Could be a vague reference to Auri-El's rule of Altmora.

Just to add, their clubs appear to be enough to kill most enemies (barring dragons and other giants) with just a single blow. They don't have appear natural enemies aside from hired mercs, and I really can't see anyone in most armors surviving a direct blow for one of those things. Maybe in areas where giants are causing a bit more havoc on the locals and need to defend themselves, their current weapons seem fine for what they do.

Damn Black-Brior mead.....

Intelligent enough to mind their own damn business, which is better than I could say for most people I've met.

Wasn't there a Giant king in Atmora mentioned somewhere?

A drawing by MK, attached to one of the Seven Fights.