We gonna trust E3 this time?

Post » Thu May 19, 2011 5:05 am

anyway this whole argument is crazy. You cant really say that beth didn't over hype and mislead about radient AI, lets face it, they did. and other aspects too. But since then they've deffinatly calmed down (fallout) so no need to worry. Right?
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Lisa
 
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Post » Thu May 19, 2011 12:37 am

Bethesda talked a hell of a lot about Oblivion back in the day, compared to Oblivion of which time of announcement to release Oblivion and Skyrim are the same BUT this time around Betheda isnt tooting as much, not too long after announcements there was information EVERYWHERE -quality- information not like now where everyone one and their grandmother is copy pasting information and then putting their two cents in it, no back then the articles were very diverse. Im glad beth isnt talking as much now below are things they've said Prior to Oblivions release.

Spoiler
"All screenshots we've released are 100% in game showing stuff we've already got implemented. We haven't done any special poses or anything like that, with the exception of magazine covers."------ http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_rn-IWIiuLOU/R_l-iZ0aEvI/AAAAAAAAAHc/tXNTp1TyxCs/s320/oblivion-horseback2.jpg the Skyrim trailer I believe is far more effective at stating whats in game atm, even if it is subject to change

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "I'm sorry, but what part of "without losing our broiler rpg fans" don't you understand?"-----didnt lose me :shrug:

[Slateman] "Each of the faction lines in this game have plots and quests to much greater depth over MW. Quality, not quantity."---- going strictly by Faction questlines, I have to disagree theres very little information about factions in Skyrim BUT it stated they dont ignore each other this time around :thumbsup:

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "I know you don't want to hear it, but you're just going to have to trust us that the dialogue is better than Morrowind's."---------] ehhh, Im a bit iffy there

[Todd] "As you play, you start to figure out what you can do with these NPCs, and how you can influence their behavior, and when doing a quest, it really comes into play. A simple 'get the diamond from that guy...' quest can be done in hundreds of ways now."----------- the Orum gangs behavior probably the most sensible to alter did not change in the least, if the leader was slain, the runner still runs, of the runner was slain, a new one isnt made, if the runners contacts are slain, she still makes the trip :shrug: Radiant story is definently going to remedy this it seems

to aid players in battle, more than 700 pieces of armor and weaponry will be scattered throughout the game. An item that resurrects defeated opponents into slaves and vampirism are two other tools that can be utilized, and if players are clever they can also use their surroundings to their advantage as well. Dungeons, for instance, will be full of traps that can be triggered by characters and enemies alike. --- all of that sounds awesome until you see the excecution, then it becomes a worthless gimmick, and 700 armor peices? pffft


[VSXX] "We have everything from mice to moles to crickets. The most fearsome you have ever seen even! You thought sleeping at night with a singing cricket outside your window was bad. You wait till you meet the one that plays a 14 piece drum set outside your window." I can't point this to anything other than Sarcasm you can't even hear whats going on outside....not even weather...but with ambient fish in Skyrim, im hopeful <3

[Pete] "Honestly, and this is just my opinion, I think the broiler RPG guys are going to love what we have in store for them in Oblivion. The depth, the level of polish...it crushes Morrowind. That doesn't mean that other people won't want to buy it and play it because it's a beautiful game that has fun combat and cool quests. We'll make enough copies for everyone."------- and in my opinion.....lol only the second half is true but from whats been heard so far, Skyrim will prove true to this statement

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "You'll be reading LOTS of stuff. All of the quest lines are much more in depth, challenging and interesting. And there's a heck of a lot more to the game than just the guilds and the main quest. Lots and lots of other things to do that haven't been mentioned. Stats play a huge, huge role. Class actually has meaning this time. The game is better balanced. You have more rewards for advancement besides just getting better at things. The dungeons are better designed, the NPCs are more interesting, the dialogue is better written

If you think this is a simple, dumbed down hack & slash, you couldn't be more wrong."--------- thats arguable

[BlueDev] "For Oblivion, there's a very concious effort to avoid too much random information spewing by NPCs. Fear not--there's still the same amount of info to be found in the game. In fact, the NPCs probably have more than ever to say; it just makes more sense for them to say it."
--------I met a mudcrab the other day......

[[MrSmileyFaceDude] "Oblivion is infinitely superior to Morrowind in every conceivable way."-------- Hype

[MattRyan] "So for all of you thinking that it would be neat to steal something, and then take off on your horse....guess what? An NPC can do the same pepper paste trick to you as well. " -----no not really...not ever in fact, but Skyrim should be much different :D



Spoiler
[Todd] "The clothing you wear does affect certain NPC's, but not in a big way, it’s subtle."--------- while I believe this may be true for Skyrim following NV (yes I know beth did not make NV) this definently not the case for oblivion unless an item was enchanted :/

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "Broken shields and weapons are automatically dropped and they clatter to the ground using Havok physics. Broken armor stays on, but is ineffective and you'll know if you're wearing broken armor or not."--------- the game doesnt tell you out right if your armor is broken though, you have to check the inventory, if you notice your taking more damage sure

[Slateman] "While I cannot go into detail, rest assured that even players who max out a bunch of skills will discover challenges in this game. We didn't leave you guys out "------ no, no you didnt lol not one soul was left out.

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "Just because you can attempt to bribe someone does not mean they'll automatically accept it."------- never encountered an NPC that didnt take a bribe, can't say how this will be handeled in Skyrim since speechcraft is handled differently now.

[MattRyan] "We are gamers. We have given tons of time toward the balance of gameplay. Asside from the designers, artists, programmers, and producers.... our staff of QA testers are extremely good at exploiting our game systems and looking for loopholes in gameplay, or shortfalls in fun vs. realism.

In conclusion, to completely cut out any adjustment to difficulty in enemies would not be fun, just as making all creatures off-set to your level would not be fun."----- no arguments there but they do exactly that in Oblivion

[Slateman] "Yep. To second MSFD, we don't auto-level exactly to your level. We have all sorts of adjustments available. If we didn't the game would be boring "

[MattRyan] "If everything was leveled then you'd have no fear of anything in the game ('I can beat everything!') We plan on scaring the heck out of the player by higher level creatures."--------- yeah so much for that really


Spoiler
[MrSmileyFaceDude] "You're walking through a seedy part of a town in Western Cyrodiil. People mill about, some engaged in conversation, others minding their own business, out on their own errands. Suddenly, an ugly man decides he doesn't like you. Maybe he's drunk, maybe he's just a bully, maybe he's just showing off in front of his friends -- but for whatever reason, he has taken your measure and decided he can best you.

He comes charging at you, with a nasty looking mace in his hand and a look of hatred on his face. Onlookers move back to make room for what should be an entertaining fight.

Quickly drawing your sword and shield, you wheel around to face him. He's upon you pretty quickly though, and you barely have time to raise your shield (hold right mouse button) before his first blow thunders down upon you.

But you block well, and as he recoils from the collision, you quickly perform left & right slashes with your sword (left click, pause, left click). The bully realizes this isn't going to be easy.

He backs off a bit, and starts dodging around you. First to the left, then to the right. You maneuver to keep him in view, looking for an opening. Suddenly he steps back, raises his mace in both hands, and steps forward, bringing the mace towards your head in a crushing blow!

But you're quick -- you step to the side as he attacks. As he passes by, you execute a spinning maneuver and slash him in the side (hold left mouse button and left maneuver key). The hit is solid, and your foe staggers from the blow.

But it's not over yet. The bully swings his mace wildly -- his first swing misses, but the next one connects for a blow that sends you staggering. Pressing his advantage, the bully bears down on you with a power attack of his own. OUCH. This isn't going well. You take a glance at your health meter, it's getting a bit low. You quickly back up out of the bully's reach and raise your shield (hold right mouse button).

He's hurting, too. You circle each other for a time, looking for an opening, trying to recover some fatigue. Finally the bully charges forward with a devastating overhead blow, perhaps hoping to break your shield. But the shield holds and the recoil send him staggering back. This is your chance! You perform
a mighty forward power attack (hold the left mouse button, press forward) and connect solidly. The blow staggers your foe once again, and you perform 3 slashing attacks in rapid succession (left mouse button, pause, left mouse button, pause, left mouse button), and finally the bully collapses to the ground, defeated.

The crowd disperses, going back to their own business."


Spoiler
[MrSmileyFaceDude] "We happen to think that console gamers are smarter than that, and the success of Morrowind on Xbox proves that console gamers actually ARE interested in games with MORE depth and complexity than some pe ople seem to think they are."-------- Proved true for morrowind, Oblivion, :thumbsup: and will for Skyrim... when Bethesda advertises their games they flaunt the open world aspect more than anything, and that draws people in, I've no doub't about that.


[MrSmileyFaceDude] "You can only use the map-based fast travel to go to places you've already been. So you'll HAVE to walk to each possible location AT LEAST once."---- except for cities, In Skyrim however I speculate the Carriage will be needed to get to other cities initially should the player choose and then FT or not from there

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "We could make traditional creatures that looked like every other depiction of those creatures you've seen in books, food network, or other games, but then where's the originality in that?"--------- :shrug: arguable for Oblivion, havent seen anything in Skyrim yet...EXCEPT HOARKERS <3 (I hate hoarkers)

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "NPCs would have to be told to go into your house via Radiant AI. And even if they WERE, you could always lock your door..."------- he was replying to a question about RAI's tenacity and what you can do, the locking door thing however, no.

[Slateman] "Trust me, you're going to get lost if you wander in these forests and don't use the compass or map."----- until I fine the IC in the distance <3 Skyrim has no such convience looks promising there

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "you can enter every interior."----- I don't think this has been a concern...ever


[[Pete] "There isn't a magazine on the planet that hasn't gotten information if they've asked for it."------- which is the point of this post, look how much info they let go? they are doing a better job this time around I feel.

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "Resurrected NPCs are not themselves. They're basically mindless automata who will follow you around and fight for you."----- for 30 secs :D lol

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "Oblivion is an extremely rich, complex game with a tremendous amount of depth, compelling quest lines, interesting NPC characters, a huge variety of player character types and intricate character progression set in a huge, varied game world. combat, magic, and AI have all been dramatically improved to enhance gameplay while still providing a balance between player skill and character skill, because after all, Oblivion is a role playing game. Yes, some things that were present in Morrowind are not in Oblivion -- but a lot more has been added than removed, and the goal has always been to make a game that is both more accessible to first-time RPG players, and is also challenging and rewarding for more experienced players." ------only half of that proved true :shrug:

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "I absolutely guarantee that they'll be able to make mods that will completely blow away anything we saw for Morrowind, using the new Construction Set."

[Pete] "We will continue to support the mod community as best we can and let them do the great things they do, just as we did with Morrowind.------- and So true, and will continue for Skyrim <3


Spoiler
[Sentinel] "The sad fact is that many development studios can't afford to bankroll their own game development. So they rely on publishers to give them the money to create these games. The problem with this is that the publisher then feels they should have input into the game since they are spending the money. Hence Atari and EA have such a big influence on a game they publish
Just glad here at Bethesda we are our own publisher and developer and have delicious reign to make what we want

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "We're NOT going to slap in features that don't work well just to say we have them.".".------- this still holds true today as pete stated in a Vid interview, that they don't want the devs making a particular feature because they the plublishers "expect it"



[Pete] "Holidays this year'-------- this was as set in stone and repeated as 11.11.11 is this day, but they had to delay it to Feb 06, do you feel they are solid now?

[Pete] "You know if you have a 360 it will look as good as it can possibly look. If you have the latest, greatest PC with the best recipe card, etc., it will probably look the same as the Xbox 360 version."

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "The compass, the quest marker and compass icons, are NOT the hand-holding, dumbing down babysitter some folks paint them out to be."------------ I'd disagree in my opinion

[Hayt] "We're around on a daily basis, and we're reading. When we're ready to comment on things, you'll all know."
still holds true no?



anyone else glad they aren't talking as much?
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Bethany Watkin
 
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Post » Thu May 19, 2011 2:14 am

There. Thankyou MK- this is the point I was trying to make in the OP, but yours is FAR better reserched than mine. You mind if I link back to your post the next time someone pulls the Betheseda can't lie trick? :P Thats just a massive wall of 100% evidence that they do. (though you where a little harsh at times... just your opinion though :))
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Robert Jackson
 
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Post » Wed May 18, 2011 11:00 pm

(...)



Someone's ears are burning right now
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KRistina Karlsson
 
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Post » Thu May 19, 2011 4:59 am

I don't think Bethesda would have given us 20 minutes worth of video 10 months prior to release.
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Mylizards Dot com
 
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Post » Thu May 19, 2011 9:14 am

yes but-

wait a minute, your not the skyrimer I was talking to last time :<

I don't think Bethesda would have given us 20 minutes worth of video 10 months prior to release.


Good to see that you are taking into account all information and not just dogmatically sticking to same outdated point you made last time.

Look.

Up.

This.

Page.

You only covered HALF of the small point I made, and NONE of the EPICLY HUGE GROWING CEREAL EATING point that MK made.
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Makenna Nomad
 
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Post » Thu May 19, 2011 9:09 am

There. Thankyou MK- this is the point I was trying to make in the OP, but yours is FAR better reserched than mine. You mind if I link back to your post the next time someone pulls the Betheseda can't lie trick? :P Thats just a massive wall of 100% evidence that they do. (though you where a little harsh at times... just your opinion though :))


The Oblivion Incident was a very unfortunate happening.
This is the stuff thtat bestows a bad reputation on Developers .

It's very hard to wipe out.

Since then Bethesda has sent Fallout 3 out to the World on impecable terms.
Still that stain lingers to this day.
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Shannon Lockwood
 
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Post » Thu May 19, 2011 10:29 am

There. Thankyou MK- this is the point I was trying to make in the OP, but yours is FAR better reserched than mine. You mind if I link back to your post the next time someone pulls the Betheseda can't lie trick? :P Thats just a massive wall of 100% evidence that they do. (though you where a little harsh at times... just your opinion though :))



never forget that and Harmony will ensue, quite frank I am expecting someone to make an excus :shrug: and I was very clear that Skyrim is a different time different BEth :shrug: but someone WILL turn this into Idiocy
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Katey Meyer
 
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Post » Thu May 19, 2011 10:36 am

never forget that and Harmony will ensue, quite frank I am expecting someone to make an excus :shrug: and I was very clear that Skyrim is a different time different BEth :shrug: but someone WILL turn this into Idiocy



Yeaa, oh well. At some point it becomes less a matter of putting your view point in convosation, and then less a matter of pointing out flaws in logic, and then less a matter of actually talking in words and more a case of getting so frustrated with people that your there shouting READ THESE WORDS READ THESE WORDS NOW. I guess the all important skill, as with all things, is knowing when to stop caring :P
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Darren Chandler
 
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Post » Wed May 18, 2011 10:35 pm

yes but-

wait a minute, your not the skyrimer I was talking to last time :<



Good to see that you are taking into account all information and not just dogmatically sticking to same outdated point you made last time.

Look.

Up.

This.

Page.

You only covered HALF of the small point I made, and NONE of the EPICLY HUGE GROWING CEREAL EATING point that MK made.


I stand by my statement. It's 5 months prior to the release of Skyrim and all we've gotten so far is a trailer. Bethesda would never release 20 minutes of footage to the public 10 months from release showing an incomplete game with unconfirmed features. The leak happened people saw it. Too late.
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Queen Bitch
 
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Post » Thu May 19, 2011 5:09 am

I stand by my statement. It's 5 months prior to the release of Skyrim and all we've gotten so far is a trailer. Bethesda would never release 20 minutes of footage to the public 10 months from release showing an incomplete game with unconfirmed features. The leak happened people saw it. Too late.


YES! THIS IS TRUE! WE KNOW THIS! HOWEVER:

...

...



....





.....

:verymad:
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pinar
 
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Post » Thu May 19, 2011 2:42 am

The Oblivion E3 footage was never meant to be seen by the public. Only the press and retailers.

MrSmileyFaceDude, a Bethesda developer:
"Well, it's from a DVD that was sent to retailers and press. Someone (or multiple people) who received it ripped the DVD & started posting the video online. So it wasn't SUPPOSED to get out -- we prefer to release stuff like that ourselves, so we can be sure to have high quality versions -- but it's awful hard to get the cat back into the bag once it's out"

So any complaints about things not being in the final game are invalid. You were never supposed to see the demo.


This is absurd.

Let's deconstruct this outrageous claim:

1. So Bethesda sent the DVD to a selected few. Its content was meant to be representative of the actual game. It was perceived as representative of the actual game.

2. People, whether watching the DVD footage first hand or reading about it from those selected few, took it as representative. They most naturally drew their conclusions.

Bottom line:
Doesn't really matter if it was Misleading & Misrepresenative just to a selected bunch or to the whole wide world.
It was misleading & misrepresentative. Period.
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Alexander Lee
 
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Post » Thu May 19, 2011 5:17 am

I love these forums. I come for Skyrim, but I stay for the drama.
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SamanthaLove
 
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Post » Thu May 19, 2011 1:59 am

This is absurd.

Let's deconstruct this outrageous claim:

1. So Bethesda sent the DVD to a selected few. Its content was meant to be representative of the actual game. It was perceived as representative of the actual game.

2. People, whether watching the DVD footage first hand or reading about it from those selected few, took it as representative. They most naturally drew their conclusions.

Bottom line:
Doesn't really matter if it was Misleading & Misrepresenative just to a selected bunch or to the whole wide world.
It was misleading & misrepresentative. Period..



!!! :blink:


Wait no, your the other, saner one. Ok, gotcha.

You talk alot of sense! :D Thats basicly what I was gonna say before, but decided theres no point as Mark Hammil here can't actually read things that don't support bethesda. It's like a weird kind of dyslexia, I think.
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Craig Martin
 
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Post » Thu May 19, 2011 6:52 am

well fallout 3s is pretty much spot on even though its only 5 minutes so id say ya theyve learned
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Manuel rivera
 
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Post » Thu May 19, 2011 8:58 am

well fallout 3s is pretty much spot on even though its only 5 minutes so id say ya theyve learned


Yeahhh :) Makes me look forward to... 2 hours from now!!! :D
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maria Dwyer
 
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Post » Thu May 19, 2011 5:42 am

Game fans have selective memories. Have you forgot that Beth has had another game presentation between now and the Oblivion launch (aka fallout 3)!?! What did you think of that? That's what you should expect now.

As I remember it, the "misleading" trailer was shown behind closed doors but later leaked online. So much so that Beth eventually officially put it up for public consumption but then gamers have the audacity to say they were mislead....seeing something never meant for them.

Besides Beth put out several great gameplay trailers soon after that that were derivative of the game we actually got.
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Darren
 
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Post » Thu May 19, 2011 2:48 am

Aye let us not forget the biggest heartbreaker from OB's demo: the Dunmer voice :cryvaultboy:
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Eilidh Brian
 
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Post » Wed May 18, 2011 9:38 pm

Game fans have selective memories. Have you forgot that Beth has had another game presentation between now and the Oblivion launch (aka fallout 3)!?! What did you think of that? That's what you should expect now.

As I remember it, the "misleading" trailer was shown behind closed doors but later leaked online. So much so that Beth eventually officially put it up for public consumption but then gamers have the audacity to say they were mislead....seeing something never meant for them.

Besides Beth put out several great gameplay trailers soon after that that were derivative of the game we actually got.


It's preposterous to claim that just because it was shown behind closed doors it was not misleading.
That has nothing to do with its authenticity.
Those are just circumstances. Nothing but the scenery.

The moral issue remains the same, as it is plainly obvious.

As for Fallout demo, I have already mentioned it (see my previous posts on this thread) as being immaculate.
It's just that stains last longer.
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Floor Punch
 
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Post » Thu May 19, 2011 12:38 pm

I've yet to notice anyone say


FALLOUT 3 DOESNT MATTER BETH IS LIARS

I'm pretty sure everyone is aware that pre fallout 3 and what resulted after wasnt as much of a wtfx as pre Oblivion, I don't see anyone ignoring that, its just folly to believe Hype and game touted = not exaggerated
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carrie roche
 
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Post » Thu May 19, 2011 11:51 am

From what we've seen, Skyrim looks no better than Oblivion.
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Charity Hughes
 
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Post » Thu May 19, 2011 1:00 am

Aye let us not forget the biggest heartbreaker from OB's demo: the Dunmer voice :cryvaultboy:


YES. :(

Game fans have selective memories. Have you forgot that Beth has had another game presentation between now and the Oblivion launch (aka fallout 3)!?! What did you think of that? That's what you should expect now.

As I remember it, the "misleading" trailer was shown behind closed doors but later leaked online. So much so that Beth eventually officially put it up for public consumption but then gamers have the audacity to say they were mislead....seeing something never meant for them.

Besides Beth put out several great gameplay trailers soon after that that were derivative of the game we actually got.


Links? And its hardly selective: I've said myself 100% honesty about FO3, but enough examples have been given of lies. I cant find these that you speak about by youtube search, though.. when DID they come out?
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Brentleah Jeffs
 
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Post » Thu May 19, 2011 10:49 am

From what we've seen, Skyrim looks no better than Oblivion.


what you mean? 0_o
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Alada Vaginah
 
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Post » Wed May 18, 2011 9:02 pm

Links? And its hardly selective: I've said myself 100% honesty about FO3, but enough examples have been given of lies. I cant find these that you speak about by youtube search, though.. when DID they come out?


This is the Fallout 5 minute demo: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OOX1XUXsvAM

I expect something similar to that for Skyrim. Either that or the same section that we've read about a billion times in all the gaming articles lately.
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Travis
 
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Post » Thu May 19, 2011 7:03 am

This is the Fallout 5 minute demo: http://www.youtube.c...h?v=OOX1XUXsvAM

I expect something similar to that for Skyrim. Either that or the same section that we've read about a billion times in all the gaming articles lately.


Yeah I posted that earlier :P I ment links to the hhonset oblivion articals.

Either way, cant wait!
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Auguste Bartholdi
 
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