Looking again at the archery kills in the cave during the demo.

http://i51.tinypic.com/14u7x4p.jpg

One thing that has been bothering me is the action (or lack thereof) of the male victim. I understand that the player is hidden, that the male victim can not see them. However, putting myself in his place I’m not sure that pulling my weapon and then standing perfectly still after seeing my partner wasted by an arrow would be my first choice. I might stand for a second at the shock of seeing my partner go down, but in this vid the male pulled his weapon right away so he knew an attack was happening immediately. And then he just stands there perfectly still. I would have ran to the shadows, or ran away or to the area the arrow came from.

What also concerns me with AI like this is what if there were 20 bandits in this cave and I had 20 arrows. Would they have all stood perfectly still like statues as I sniped off each one? What if I am on a rooftop in village? Could I kill everyone in the whole village as long as I remained hidden because the villagers would just freeze, waiting for me to kill them?

Discuss?

Its a bit iffy, but fairly standard sadly, especially for RPGs.

I'd like to see better because I'm a bit of a svcker for good AI, but I suspect it will be reasonable, though nothing special.

Todd had a VERY high sneak level. Todd had the slow time archery perk.

Hence, what seems in the video to be a few seconds, is really barely any time at all. So no, it's not bad AI, Todd was just OP. If he had been Level 1, no perks, the NPC would have reacted much quicker.

What was he supposed to do, Todd was in Toddmode, in stealth mode, at a 100 sneak with 2 perks picked. It's actually a big upgrade that he reacted at all.

Just because you are a master of the shadows and can remain unseen by the mortal eye, I believe people still would run for cover if their friend suddenly got dropped

You are invisible.

The dead guy is not

Dead guy's reliative sees dead guy

Relative: ''OH SHIZZ!''

I think in the finish product it will be better and if not maybe after a patch, worse comes to worse and its not, it wont bother me too much its still better than other TES games.

In a way, the NPC's reaction is acceptable in that he doesn't turn immediately and "zone" in on the hidden PC.

NPC's shouldn't be able to instantly "know" where an attack from the shadows is coming.

But I understand your concern.

Perhaps this sort of thing gets worked out with the sneak perks. :shrug:

:batman:

Do you have proof about that? Imo it's just bad AI and nothing else, I hope they will improve it but I'm not so optimistic.

Wishful thinking. From what has been showed so far ( and I admit it's not enough to have a strong opinion) the AI is weak, like in Oblivion.

Meh, by this time all should know what AI bethesda is capable of,

Stuff on the videos look just like standard bethesda work

My partner in crime crumples to the ground. I don't know what happened. I pull my sword and freeze, listening for any disturbance as I peer into the shadows. BAM. I'm dead.

or

My partner falls to the ground- there's an arrow sticking out of her back! I pull my sword and prepare to run- but to WHERE? They could be anywhere!! I frantically search the darkness when BAM.


Maybe you think everyone in the world has superhuman reaction skills, but that was a pretty realistic 'frozen in fear' moment to me.

AI in Skyrim will be 90-95% that we saw in Oblivion. Small changes include things like "Not always being 100% aggressive", but I'm sure you won't see any new routines like "flanking" or ambushing and the like.

In fact, in the demo video, when Dovahkiin was fighting the Draugs, one of them with an Axe brought up his weapon in the "ready to strike" position and then just sat there not even animating for like 2 seconds before the video faded to a new scene.

It's an early build, and chances are they fixed that, but as far as AI, don't expect anything even remotely impressive.

I doubt this , the really annoying thing is how fans of this game pull things apart as soon as they see a misunderstanding.
1. If people complained surely Bethesda have a customer review department where they fix technical hitches spotted by fans and the public.
2. Todd is in more or less complete darkness in the video , crouched down , sticking to the shadows and blending in with the area.
3. You mentioned what you would do if your friend got killed in front of you but are you that character ? No , so everyone will react differently.
4. People are moaning at all sorts of topics from the demo but come on seriously ! would Bethesda really let people down after all the other great games , they know what there doing , I mean would Skyrim
be a really bad game , Of course not.

This is an early version of the game, from before January. Just hope they have used the time wisely to fix things like that.

The AI seems to be good, but it's still too early to tell at this point. :wink_smile:

We haven't played the game yet so we can't make assumptions, just speculate. Unless you've played at the conventions, all we can do is rely on these videos which pretty much are from E3.

AI act like soldiers in metal gear solid apparently there is
othere than set skills for npc

some AI examples to expect ~
script : bandit will follow a quest scenario
faction condition : bandit will react acording to hidden faction flags
fence : bandit will buy stolen goods
merchant : bandit will buy and sell an asigned catagory of items
service's : bandit will offer service asigned such as smithing , cooking , magic item recharge ect
sleep : bandit will seek bed and sleep
free roam : bandit will wonder around and look for things to pick up
idle : bandit will pick nose
rage : bandit will attack every thing
fear : bandit will run and hide
rally : bandit will lure victim to there gang before returning into combat mode
companion : bandit will become your drone while under illusion spell
alert : bandit will see friend killed and look around room , may even walk to wards sounds !
detected /combat mode : bandit will try and kill you
dual/brawler : bandit wants a good ld fashioned fist fight ,unconscious fighter lose
unconscious : bandit got knocked the frak out
deactivated : bandit becomes statue
dead : bandit for rip
removed : bandit erased

im sure i missed somthing

What's everyone on about :flamethrower: I like it.

Something I posted in another thread:

The problem is that when a company wishes to promote a game, it invariably chooses footage that it believes will impress the audience and cast a positive light on its product. The fact that Bethesda keeps using that piece of footage is troubling because it suggests the people at Bethesda actually think what happens there is good. If the developers and PR team shared the opinion of many on this forum -- that the AI exhibited there is atrocious -- it likely wouldn't be using such footage to promote its game, as said footage will naturally lead many potential customers to think poorly of its AI and stealth mechanics.

The bandit sniping footage was originally shown at E3, correct? Of all the footage Bethesda has taken or could have taken since then, it still chose to include that particular scene in its big HD video release Monday. It apparently still thinks that footage casts a positive light on its game. THAT is what's troubling about the scene.

If the AI is in fact better than what that scene suggests, then by all means, Bethesda should have omitted that footage from Monday's video, or even better, included some footage in which an NPC reacts more realistically to the sudden death of its companion. While one cannot conclude that the presence of that scene means players will encounter that sort of AI when playing the game, I certainly won't expect any better in the final version, since Bethesda apparently likes whats happens there enough to keep showing it to promote its game.

Hi, thanks for your input! We appreciate the fact that you have not read or considered any other opinion contributed to this thread. We wholeheartedly believe that true communication is only found when ignoring all others in our quest to push forward opinions based purely on conjecture and baseless assumption. You truly are a member of this forum now.

Get over yourself. What I posted was highly relevant. Much of the discussion in this thread is about whether anything has changed since the demo, and I posted a reason why I'm not expecting the AI to be different than what we see in the bandit snipe footage.

What you posted was a massive hyperbole. Almost everything you said was an assumption, made up by you. And yes, you completely ignored other posts suggesting logical reasons for the AI behavior in the clip.

If you completely disregard others in your rush to heft up your lofty opinion, you will be treated this way. Enjoy!

As usual Morgueanna, you give enciteful, intelligent answers on this forum.

Wait.

Since when do you need to do something to make an assumption about it? Assumptions and speculations are pretty much all any of us have.

Morgueanna, you gotta love it.

In-Topic: It's precipitate to take conclusions from a less-than-a-minute Video about the subject.