Isn't there still a significant amount still on XP/DX9 compared to Win7/DX11?

I remember reading a article recently that most PC gamers are on Windows 7 these days, XP is pretty much nearing it's death. Even Microsoft has stated they will be ceasing to support it pretty soon.

No, I'm calling them near worthless because they're near worthless, I don't doubt that both PS3 and 360 figures are larger than PC figures - but using sales figures only from those who disclose it tells you only who bought it from those who disclose it, which many, even most, do not. Steam is some company or retailer who do not disclose sales figures, and by current guesses (because without sales figures they are guesses) 50% of all sales come from digital distribution, of which steam is the major player.

So yes, there are large companies on every side who do not disclose figures, you cannot get an accurate measurement.

And, of course, if forum polls are worth anything, it shows that of the dedicated fanbase, PC gaming is still predominant.

Maybe if the games were good on PC and not completely consolified pirates would stop and buy the games, would you buy a game you dont like? And FYI, Xbox can pirate games, maybe not as easily as PC, but they can. (Ps3 can now too am I right? after the hacks?)

Alot of my friends got very, very disapointed when they heard Beth might not take time to put in DX11 for PC versions BECAUSE of the consoles and they have very high end PC's. Piracy is kind of a rebellion imo, consoles are destroying games for PC due to all the lame ports and UI crap they weird movements and stuff. PC gamers probably feel that they cant get out enough juice from console ports that they normally would if it was a PC exclusive.

I personally often take time to read reviews and watch trailers before I decide to buy a game or not, maybe play a demo if there is one out but its rare for PC to have.

Well, I suggest you go look at some actual torrent sites, then, because not only are 360 games pirated, they're *heavily* pirated. As pirated, sometimes more pirated than, the PC copies. Publishers like consoles because they have absolute control of them and give you no freedom at all, piracy is an issue - but it's a cross platform issue. If it were truly piracy driving people away, the PS3 would be getting the vast majority of publisher support, as prior to the security being utterly demolished it was pretty much unpiratable, and even now, downloading 50GB ISOs isn't on many people's agenda.

I feel that the discussion is getting rather off topic fellas, lets try and keep it on topic lest it be locked.

Remember, Directx 11 on PC is the topic

then let me re-phrase maybe if people wouldn't pirate GAMES, devolepers would put a little more effort in some of it's aspect, I can't really blame them though, and I don't look at torrent sites or pirate sites, so I didn't know you could in fact, download xbox games, I'm still not going to do it..If I don't like a game I bought, shame on me for not checking more revieuws or learning more about it, it is no reason to start illigealy downloading game after game.
sorry for off topic btw.

True, and... Dx11 on PC would make PC gamers much, much happier. Im not sure what reason Beth would have not to include it, because if anything, it would increase PC sales.

A very dumb move not to include DX11..

No, ability to pirate games does not make it right, but that doesn't change the fact that 360 games are heavily pirated.

All medums have suffered from some sort of piracy, whether it be recording songs off the radio or sneaking into a theatre, it's never going to not happen.

Poor Denmelsan, getting flamed by angry PC gamers.. nah just kidding...

I think that is another reason people say "ooooh pc just have pirates" and stuff like that, because console gamers doesnt actually KNOW that you can pirate games for consoles. All they read and hear is "PC pirates hits again!!!". But, back on topic.

I've said it before... DX11... yes thank you.

well, now that I think about it, I kinda do it myself to, not with music or w/e, or games, but with skateboards, I buy blank decks, so with no company involvend, for less then half the price, so that makes me an arseface to I geuss.

No, piracy is nothing like that, that's a perfectly moral (and sensible) thing to do. There's not really an anologue to piracy in the non-digital world, because you're not removing the original copy. It'd be like you buying a blank skateboard and printing off a perfect copy of whatever patterns would go on there, and then perfectly placing them on the board, to make it identical to what you would have bought. Sort of. I'm really not that knowledgable about skateboards.

and I'm not knowledgable about games or pc in general..this is also ( besides skate 1,2,3) the ONLY game I can enjoy, weird he?

Most likely because as I have said, Todd(From what I've seen/heard of him) doesn't think the PC shouldn't be any better than the console versions should be besides slightly better looking textures, though I do think we are getting a better UI for the PC this time around compared to Oblivion where it was completely console style? For that I thank him..

But yes, I really don't see any good reason they wouldn't include it rather than just not being bothered and not thinking it essential(Which it isn't to everyone.. but it is to alot of us! PC gamers would be so, so happy if they added it for us..)

Does anyone know just how hard it would be for them to code in Direct X 11 for the PC? I mean it couldn't take more than a few days work could it? Or maybe it does?

Aye, I dont know why companies try so hard to stop this... I mean... the best way to do it is to MAKE A GOOD GAME!

Take Magicka for example... its like 5 people making it, a very small studio called arrowhead. And it hits 150k sales now, its a very simple small game but its FUN and GOOD. People buy fun and good games.

Or... minecraft anyone?

Now this is a anti piracy trailer... http://www.gametrailers.com/video/infomercial-trailer-magicka/709855

Question is though... if you walk up to a fruitstore and look at a apple, and you are somehow making an exact copy of that apple in your hand and walk away, is that piracy?

"DX11" doesn't magically give you anything, it basically lets you talk to the graphics card in a certain way. Certain features can be added very easily if your resources are set up to use them, which often means that using them isn't more work per-se, it's just something that has to be decided at first, and some things can be added in later.

Indeed, when companies actually cater to what the PC can do they make so much more money (Minecraft and Magicka for example, both of them would be verrryyy hard to bring to a console(With minecraft it would be impossible because of RAM issues) because of the complexity of them both)

Yes, it would make PC gamers feel loved for once!

Skyrim development begins 2007 + DX11 releases 2009 + Beth dev cycle half over at release of DX11 = No DX11 for Skyrim.

TES offers the gaming industry something that no other game on the market can compete with and since it will blow Oblivion away it doesn't need DX11. It just doesn't.

Here's some visual comparisons of DX 10 to DX 11 for you to look at:

http://tech-mania.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/call-ofpripyat1.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_3oLB6Otdlcs/TKc1CNt6xuI/AAAAAAAAIc4/XLGQRRsii6Q/s1600/dx10-vs-dx11.jpg

http://i45.tinypic.com/14mh0cl.jpg
http://i50.tinypic.com/2n691c8.jpg

http://i45.tinypic.com/21jpyfm.jpg
http://i50.tinypic.com/2luwe90.jpg

Imo, tessellation looks wicked. Although it can also be too much on a few rocks...
Still, awesome




New DX support can be added at any time, no need for it to be added at the beginning, in case you didn't know. That's what Timeslip did for Morrowind.

DX 11 isn't needed, but there really is no reason not to include it. It's not like it's the biggest task in the world.
DX 11 helps a whole lot with performance and adds many many new graphical possibities. Why wouldn't you want DX11, tell me please?
The technology can be added without too much fuss, and the technology is a lot better than before. Not to use it would kinda be like cutting yourself in the ancle, causing you to slowly slowly bleed to death.

Todd said in his last interview that optimising graphical stuff is left to the end of the development cycle. Therefore everyone who wants to see Skyrim future-proofed and attain an even higher level of beauty should continue canvassing for DX11 inclusion.

What about Directx 10 then? Or are we stuck with Directx 9?

I can't remember if the Fallout games had Directx 10.. I think yes? or maybe no.. I can't remember

Anyone know?

My favourite part of Oblivion was the large open world that you could see. Tessellation support in particular would remove the jarring transition between distant and local land. It would significantly improve the experience.

DX 9. One of the reasons the Fallout games look really dated. The other one Gamebryo.

Now with a new engine, haha, why wouldn't they want to use DX 11?

Already accomplished with the FO3 engine and according to Beth, the Skyrim engine is even more optimized than FO3 so again Skyrim doesn't need DX11 to be sucessful. Think about it from a development stand point. Since the game doesn't need it to be sucessful then adding it would be overkill and overkill doesn't increase sales enough to justify the effort. Besides why not save it for the next game which will likely see a new console and the ability to use the DX11 across all platforms.