See, I'm not I have preconceived notions about almost everything, these books included. It would be nice, to enter a reading about a fantasy world that I'm kinda close to, without having preconceived notions, but, based on (what I know as) the plot, I find this especially impossible. I'm not being pretentious, just honest.

Well, you are right about that. It is always reffered to as the Numidium golum in the game, if I recall. "Giant stompy robot" is just a lore forum joke.

Although, it being dwemer in origin, it would be easy to imagine it as a giant robot, just as most of their other constructs are robots.

So if an acclaimed fantasy author and the devs of the game world in question agreed that this would make for a good plot, then it seems pretty obvious that this synopsis of a floating city that slaughters people and then raises them from the dead as undead soldiers isn't the entire truth of what's going on. It might seems that way to the citizens of Tamriel, and perhaps this summary is the general rumour spreading amongst the collapsed empire, but that's even more of a reason to assume that things are almost certainly not what they seem.

The excerpt from the book seemed a little dissapointing, but this interview does indicate that we could be in for a good story. I especially like this quote: "Finally, there is Colin, a young recruit in the Penitus Oculatus, which is the Emperor's espionage/black ops organization. He fiercely wants to do the right thing, but finds his moral compass severely compromised. He's also thrust into the very dangerous secret politics of the court, perhaps before he is ready to deal with them."
It's politics that were missing from Oblivion. So if Keyes can throw some decent political struggles into his books, then i'll be very impressed. Some of the characters do seem incredibly bland and cliche, but i'm certainly going to give him the chance to prove that he can mold them into memorable actors of an amazing script.

They refer to it once as a golem, and that was just a rumor. The other two rumors was that it was a gargantuan creature, or a giant. You don't get these rumors till 13/14ths of the way through the main quest. They don't really say what it is elsewhere, and though you can see it in the ending, it doesn't look like a robot. And they don't address the dwarves in Daggerfall, so it wasn't mentioned. Unless you can find another one, I think it was only called a golem/automaton once by one person who wasn't your only source on the issue. So you pursue info on this situation for the last 1/14 of the game.

That's why Dagger and Morrowind were so ba, because there wasn't a Martin Septim for all your questions' answers. Even the majority could be wrong.

Martin was continously presented as the heir to Tamriel, and so its that much harder to find creedance with Mankar's claim, that Martin and his gods have whitewashed mortals' treachery against the god Lorkhan and his sibling Daedra, and Dagon is the rightful heir. Present Dagon in a more human light, and I'll give lend him an ear. Give me the choice of which master to serve, so I'm not at the whim of the game's judgement. Not that you the player couldn't form your own opinion, but throughout the main quest, your character was forced into the mold of a bastard heir's henchman.

Morrowind is destroyed. I don't know whether to laugh or cry. It doesn't matter, I have my own private lore canon. Maybe the b*stard usurper Helseth got his too!

I've only read the first two books in "The Kingdoms of Thorn and Bone", and have started "Newton's Cannon", but Keyes was a good choice for TES. The character Virginia Dare in "The Briar King" is written as similar to Alessia, and that was way before Keyes was chosen for the Elder Scrolls novelizations. He also takes cliches like rangers, willful princesses, naive scholar/mages, and paladins and makes them live in his books; the novels are hard to put down.

You're right about that. Daggerfall doesn't give a clear picture of what he is. Only until Morrowind (with books like the http://www.imperial-library.info/mwbooks/arcturian.shtml and http://www.imperial-library.info/mwbooks/progress_truth.shtml) that we learn it was of Dwemer construction, although no true nature of the construct is ever given. Some call it a golem, others a construct, and even others an atronach. However, with Dagoth Ur's creation of Anumidium, which was meant to be a copy of Numidium, we can probably get a good idea of what it looked like.


Now, the nature of Landfall (As Keyes sees it) hasn't been discussed. It did say "Morrowind has been destroyed", but so was the Soviet Union when it collapsed. Maybe Morrowind is still around, but it just went through a lot of changes, or maybe it had a huge geographical change with the crashing of Baar Dau. Perhaps it refers to a political revolution that effectively demolished Morrowind as a nation. The most obvious interpretation isn't necessarily the correct one.

I agree, I really liked that. I also know several people who likely clawed their eyes out.

Also, we don't know what part of Oblivion Sul was stuck in.


I see a whole 'nother problem with a certain hilariously loud all-but-unpleasable minority chunk of the fanbase: let's say the novels use the lore, but mostly the political stuff, or at least the direct stuff (you know, the stuff characters that aren't Vivec know and talk about) then that certain group will scream that there isn't enough esoteric cryptospeak. Then if there was a ton of esoteric cryptospeak, CHIM-gibberish and Vivec crap, they'd say he was trying to invade MKs territory. Do the math, the only way to satisfy that particular group is to have MK write the book.


Point A: Yes. They were fleshed out in Morrowind, and then talked to death afterwards.
Point B: Used to be. Then there was that whole thing where suddenly word of god was the order of the day and so all the fun concepts to debate simply became multitudinous thread of "what's conxept X? Insert quoted MK post Y." Now it's just tedious and I'm waiting for new lore on Nords or soemthing else that hasn't been beaten to death.

And let's face it, what's funnier than watching people ferociously argue over just about anything you tell them is lore? It almost seems like it's become something along the lines of throwing chum into a shark tank.

Normally I'd agree and you know it, but the debate tends to get derailed when we try to pin down whether word of god is valid for TES or, since it has so many writers both in the real world and in the games, it's a case of "death of the author."

I think that is something for another thread in another time and place though. Too risky, we're close to a release so tensions are high and not everyone is quite as reasonable as you and I.

Haha, not ashamed of our great reason, are we?

Why can't politics and cryptic speak be fused into a halfway decent rpg?
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I checked my library, to see if they had his book ordered, but no dice. I'm curious how much of the world as I know it will be overhauled, if Morrowind essesntially blew up. Which is funny, because the volcano errupted only a few thousand years earlier and did all that damage to Vvardenfell. Cheers to Argonia :foodndrink:

Morrowind did do that. I think it had the best balance of those things. As for the destruction of Morrowind I guess we won't know until the book comes out.

"Destruction of Morrowind" seems pretty self-explanatory to me.

Honestly, I don't believe that we would ever return to Morrowind after TES III. Sure it was a nice place to visit, but in order to keep moving forward with the series (and not falsify anyone's playthrough of TES III) the area had to be cleansed with destruction and the earth salted. They, technically did the same thing at the end of Daggerfall. After the dragonbreak, the Illiac Bay area has completely changed and has become independant of the Imperial Agent's actions. Thus, the same should be done for Morrowind. Looking at the Umbriel idea now, it is a very clever way, on Keyes' part to make Cyrodiil/Morrowind independant and different from previous accounts. Sure northeastern Tamriel has potentially become a barren hellscape, but I'm sure that it will add new and interesting regions, characters, and cultures to the lore. (While also adding to the "lost civilization" list in Tamriel)Sure Morrowind was great, but that's the only province that Beth has done a spotlight on. The others are as equally in-depth and rivetting. (I admit Cyrodiil in Oblivion was a bit dull and over-lighted, but I want to think of Tamriel as a fiction as well as a game. ) Yes it was a loss that hurt me, but it also makes me happy that I got to enjoy the land while it was there.

You can return at any time, I don't know what all the complaining's about.
Other than being a pointless apocalypse, the destruction of Morrowind doesn't affect much. What's there to destroy?

Destruction of Morrowind as a place? Obliterated? Destruction as a country? Economical distruction? Political destruction? What kind of destruction.

Pick one.

Obviously the cataclysmic event was so epic in scale that the Dragon broke and they all happened at once.

Destruction of Morrowind!!! :ahhh:

If we take the Love-letter from the 5th era into Consideration, perhaps the Culture of Morrowind somehow does still survive? It mentions banners of 'vehk and vehk' along with a 'House Sul' (A Great House?).

I don't know, I really have no Idea on this, the Love-letter is confusing as hell and scary to read. Could someone perhaps enlighten me on this?

I keep hearing Morrowind being referred to as "Shatterlands." I think someone said that description came from a bigger sample than what I've read but that word doesn't sound good.

The Way I see it, it's like this;

1)Morrowind becomes the Capital Wasteland.
2)It's totally obliterated by Baar Dau's crashing.
3)The landscape in general is somewhat intact, but the culture and politics are radically changed forever (If not ruined)
4)All of the Above (Dragon brake 2!11!!)

Rather obvious really.

If they destroyed MW, then maybe they really are cleaning the slate for TES5. They killed off CHewbacca in Star Wars, why not dump MW? At the very least it will put an end to the "Why not have TES 5 revisit MW?" and "Make MW 2" threads. I'm sure Daggerfall will be next.

It sounds like all kinds of destruction.