I want to make a character that is based around being a grunt. Medium Armor, NCR Alignment, 2 weapons. A rifle and a pistol (I'll likely use the 45 auto pistol)

Now, what would be a good SPECIAL setup, and what would be a good primary weapon? (I dont want CB Repeaters, Trail Carbines... etc etc. I want something that fits a grunt. (Maybe even a service rifle)

i dont remember specifically what lvl but i would have to say the grunt perk fits the bill perfectly but you need the dlc's for that, i say dlc's because i dont remember off the top of my head which one gives it. also for my grunt related builds i prefer the commando perk as far as special goes end is always a plus agil affects guns in some ways and str will do well for the com knife and ability to carry your gear. early weapons should be something along the lines of service rifle and 9mm or 10mm until you get your obvious upgrades, mark carbine/assault rifle. eventually i prefer the survivalist rifle from honest hearts. also i enjoy throwing explosive skill in there for my c4 and grenades.

Survivalist rifle and Light in the Darkness for sure.

Until you get those, Service rifle and 9mm.

Well you got to tag guns, thats for sure. Sneak would probably be a pretty good one to, and probably either explosives or repair. I'd actually go with repair at first (a good soldiers got to keep his gear working properly) and then buff explosives after you get your tag skills maxed out.

Isn't This Machine considered a military 'grunt-class' weapon? If so, hard to beat that for classic gruntability. Very efficient killer, to boot.

A "grunt", that is a conscript, draftee, otherwise regular trooper would not go around using a highly customized version of an already rare rifle with non-standard issue ammunition. Using unique weapons anyhow for a "grunt" ruins the RP anyway and just makes you another Courier wearing NCR armor.

Also, if you want real military feel note that troopers rarely carry more than one weapon. Even a bayonet (combat knife) might be pushing it. Pistol is rarely carried by troopers as modern assault rifles are superior in every way even in close quarters combat. Carry a small amount of rations with you (caravan lunches are best for this!) Furthermore, do not do "hero quests" unless it involves you helping the NCR. Taking our squatters in Northern Vegas is not your duty and if you do so, I'd suggest wearing your "on leave" outfit while doing that. Speaking of leave, have some civilian clothing with you for Vegas visits and the like.

My Soldier character is lvl 13 atm and he is using the Service Rifle and 9mm with a Combat Knife backup. With the grunt perk, and 9mm AP and Hollowpoints, the 9mm can still be a beastly weapon. And It is the coolest looking pistol in the game imo. I will prolly try and get my hands on the All American (although I forget which "place" it is..)

@ Pistolero

Im pretty sure he uses the word grunt a bit loose compared to the way you see it...Im thinking he is just referring to being an NCR soldier in general, not just a "grunt"..Who ONLY uses a stock rifle..Who wants to use modless weapons and non specialized ammo?

I did not say I'd force him to use a regular Service Rifle. I was pointing out that soldiers rarely carry their own unique weapons (in the above case, a modified M1 Garand) and use ammo not issued by the military. Weapon mods are of course allowed.

Thing is, without all the military bureaucracy you will have to put emphasis on equipment in this RP. Just wearing NCR armor hardly makes you a grunt.

Well, assuming a Grunt is an average kind of guy I'd go for a Special set up of:

Str 6 (Real Infantry are too busy standing sentry, doing KP or on patrols for body building but hauling all your kit makes you a little above average.)
Per 5 (If you were more perceptive you would have been recruited for Recon.)
End 6 (Same as strength, you don't have time for marathon running.)
Cha 5 (Soldiers have to get along with the other guys in their unit or they won't last too long.)
Int 6 (You have to be a little sharper than average or they won't trust you on any solo missions.)
Agi 7 (Weapon drills and hand to hand add up.)
Luck 5 (If you were less lucky you'd already be dead. Any more lucky you'd have a soft Rear Echelon posting.)

For Tag skills Guns is a given as is Repair (soldiers learn a lot from keeping busted crap running). For the third skill you could make a case for Survival, Medicine or Explosives.

For Traits I'd say Skilled then either Trigger Discipline (if you lke to run and gun at Full Auto) or Fast Shot (if you figure you're more the Designated Marksman kind of guy)

As far as weapon combos go Rifle and Pistol seems more of a SWAT/MP kind of load out. I'd suggest Service Rifle and either a 9mm SMG or Grenade Rifle when you're starting out then upgrade to a Marksman Carbine and Riot Shotgun as you level up.

If you're planning to do a dedicated Grunt character using just the weapons named in the Perk your main weakness is you don't have a high damage heavy hitter for high DT critters and npcs. Best way around that is to get Explosives up early on and get the three ranks of Demolition Expert. This gives a serious boost to Frag Grenade and Grenade Rifle/Launcher damage.

I plan to use a service rifle for the majority of the gameplay 1-10. I'll probably end up doing Honest Hearts to get the survivalist rifles. I have weapon mods expanded so I will be able to modify the survivalist rifle aswell.

I'll always carry a side-arm. Part of the RP feel. That, and if for whatever reason my weapon is in low condition, or I'm out of ammo I'll be more than happy to pull out a .45 AP! :thumbsup:


I will use NCR armor, but I will probably use a mod version of it because earlier in the game I don't need all their enemies shooting at me on sight.

Just remeber that troopers and regular soldiers don't use sniper rifles.

Survivalist Rifle is a must if you have HH, if not, This Machine is the weapon of choice (with JSP rounds is deadly).
Also remember to carry some grenades, they pack quite a puch with the Grunt perk even if your explosives skill is low.

As for armor, you can get your hands on a Combat armor regular and reinforced pretty easy at the beginning, I think it's better than using NCR armor, but it's your choice.

"Grunt" can be used pretty loosely. Recon Marines are not special forces, there somewhere in between special forces and grunts. They can use any rifle they request, if a Recon Marine wants a sniper rifle, he gets it, if he wants an AK-47, he gets it.

Im pretty sure Marine Recon IS special forces...(I could be mistaken but that is what ive heard.) But I do agree with you that "grunt" can be used loosely. If im playing a "grunt"/NCR character im not going to just do guard duty and Kitchen Patrol...Im gonna go out and do missions..So I guess my character is more Special Forces than "grunt".

But what we must realize is that most if not all higher up ranks than private (unless you went to an officer's acadey) were at one point "grunts"


I hate the vanilla NCR armor so I use the "NCR Rearmament" mod which replaces the NCR armor with one that is way cooler looking imo...there is also a lore friendly version that makes the color not black but more the color of the original armors...Just thot Id point this out if anyone else feels the same way about the "grunt" NCR armor..

Edit: Oh yeah and my char is lvl 13 and im STILL using the Service Rifle...lol guess I should upgrade soon?

It's very gray. Some say that the entire Marine Corps is special forces. I say Marine Recon is in between cause their primary mission is to scout the enemy, combat is not their first priority.

maybe not, but the training is more intense, and they are better equipped.

but yeah they do seem like a bit ofboth

I have a character like this, who is also being played Dead-is-Dead.

He's a Heavy Weapons Specialist who wears the standard green Combat Armor+Helmet and carries a LMG+ and Grenade Launcher (LMG is primary) with A Light Shining in Darkness as backup. I almost stuck with the standard .45 instead, but one constant for soldiers throughout the ages is looting 'souvenirs' from opposition troops so it still fit despite being gotten out of the crate at the entrance.

His SPECIAL (includes implants):

S: 8
P: 7
E: 10
C: 4
I: 6
A: 7
L: 5

Tags: Explosives, Guns, Survival

Perks:

Toughness x2
Grunt
Heavyweight
Pack Rat
Demo Expert x3
Jury Rigging
Hand Loader (NOTE: my game is modded such that 5.56mm AP and HP are craftable; otherwise, the sole use would be making .45Super)
Rad Resistance
Rad Absorption
Living Anatomy
Adamantium Skeleton
Strong Back
Stonewall
Splash Damage
Hit the Deck!

and a couple of others I cannot remember right now. He's currently level 43 and waiting for LR to arrive before he finishes his career.

Recon Marines falls in the S.O.C (Special Operational Forces) branch, but their role is specialized the same way a sniper battalion is.

Grunt has wide meanings, not arguing that, but taking a look on the perk description and even the image the game portraits, I think the "grunt" mentionated is the regular soldier founded in manny armies around the world.
That's why I said "no sniper rifles", usually snipers receive more specialized training than a regular trooper.

This doesn't mean a trooper has to be assigned for "kitchen duty", you have heavy troppers and regular soldiers are provided with an variety of weaponry, like carbines, grenades, C-4, grenade launchers and such.
Even in NV a trooper armed with All-American/Marksman Carbine, Combat Armor reinforced II, some frag grenades and a side-pistol is not what I call "weak" in combat.

Nice build! Love the Grunt type build! I like how you made him a tough Survialist type character with the Rad perks. A true Grunt on the battle field would want those perks. One perk I would add to that is Solar Powered. Stonewall is a little suprising - do you run heavy melee as well? Even though, personally I have stopped taking Jury Rigging. It makes money too easy to come by. Feels like a cheat when I fully repair a almost broke sawed off shotgun with a Gun Runners 9mm pistol.

The Grunt weapons rock. 9MM SMG, 45 SMG, LMG, Service Rifle, Vance's 9mm SMG, Grenade Rifle, and Frag Grenades! Too much fun. The LMG with AP and HP is unstoppable. 40MM Grenades are nasty. Whoever said earlier that the Gunt Perks do not give you a good Deathclaw killing weapon is smokin' crack. LMG + AP will massacre Deathclaws. The LMG will massacre anything. Vance 9mm will massacre anything with no DT.

I love seeing Legion Assains coming over the ridge - Drop a couple of Grenades on them for easy kills.

I really like your logic behind the SPECIAL stats, but just for your last point - the Assault Carbine loaded with 5mm AP rounds negates 25 DT on enemies. The only foe you are likely to face with higher are people in Power Armour who have 29-31 DT so it shouldn't be too much of a problem regardless!

Even though I've never really understood why it has this inherent piercing effect - in real life the M4 Carbine is infamous for its questionable stopping power due to the combination of a short barrel resulting in low muzzle velocity and the inherent weakness of the 5.56x45 round.

Im not quite sure that the Assault Carbine is based on the M4. I think the gun that is most like the M4 would be a marksman carbine.

This Machine arguments aside, it's worth pointing out that that weapon is not included in the Grunt perk.

Meh. That's too bad. There is no 'gruntier' weapon on earth, then the ol' Garand M1 rifle (which it is). It was only used by tens of millions of U.S. GI's and national guardsmen from the 30's all the way into the 60's.

Stonewall is there for a few reasons:

1) Splash Damage vastly increases the radii of explosions
2) Deathclaws (chance for KB on their swipe attacks)
3) He's being played Dead-is-Dead, so anything that helps him keep fighting is essential
4) NPCs using weapons that do knockback
5) He keeps a Combat Knife on hand for RP reasons, and tends to use it on minor opponents.

I skipped Solar Powered because he often ends up fighting at night when it doesn't work. Had I decided to do the day/night separation routine I probably would have taken it, though. He doesn't sell for caps, so Jury-Rigging's money-making ability never comes into play. If anything it's working against him at this point, as he no longer needs anything other than crafting supplies which makes it a pain to sell off the high-ticket items.

I'd be tempted to agree with you seeing as they both use 5.56mm, but it's hard to argue with the cosmetic similarities:

Assault Carbine w/ extended mags:
http://fallout.wikia.com/index.php?title=Assault_carbine&image=FNVAssaultCarbine_extended_mag-png

M4 Carbine:
http://www.google.cz/imgres?q=m4+carbine&hl=cs&biw=1280&bih=709&tbm=isch&tbnid=dqYRLSKoZK8gjM:&imgrefurl=http://residentevil.wikia.com/M4_Carbine&docid=vlc79_E9ftkLRM&w=3992&h=1434&ei=XeBiTvGWA4-t8QPbpfijCg&zoom=1&iact=rc&dur=550&page=1&tbnh=86&tbnw=243&start=0&ndsp=23&ved=1t:429,r:14,s:0&tx=102&ty=28

complete with telescopic stock and everything. And correct me if I'm wrong but isn't the M4 generally used for CQC in full auto mode in real life? Also:-

http://www.formspring.me/JESawyer/q/218456981386588159

Both Assault and Marksman are pretty cool weapons though.