In reality, Reneer's mod for OB was a god send. Thanks Reneer, you made crime fun!
Anyway, my votes go with:

• Should being in jail decrease your abilities?
  Yes. You are wasting in a cell, unless you happen to break out, then more power to you.
  
• Should guards instantly know who committed a crime?
  No, that is complete BS. Hell, I don't even think the people of Nirn have figured out a way to make a spell that detects whenever a law is broken
  
• Should either be regional bounties?
  Yes, unless your infamy is quite high, then bounty hunters could attack you at random, and other cities are alerted of your infamy.
  
• Should you be able to hide from guards?
  Most definitely! Though I wouldn't be apposed to having dogs be able to track you down.

bounties should partly stay regional but news of your bad deeds should spread to allied towns slowly or quickly depending on the crime. for instance steal from a house and you may find a few days later you are recognised in another town. however if you go on a killing spree in the tavern the news should spread quickly. bounty hunters might be an interesting add on to. you should be able to work for them and get bounties if you are "good" or just able to hide your bad deeds. maybe also you could be given a pardon if you pull of an amazing bounty, like one of a mass killer necromancer who uses a tree as a weapon ect ect.

any towns that are at war with each other for instance, you should be more liked there however.

It needs...alot of improving, I hated it when i accidentally picked up say, a bowl or an apple, next things the entire city is on alert with every guard chasing after me!

My biggest gripe with Oblivion was the "criminal-scum-sense" all the guards had. Instantaneously knowing who committed a crime and where was immersion breaking as well as incredibly annoying. The ability to hide from guards would be a welcome feature as well in my opinion.

i think when u get out of jail people should have lower morale towards you and be scared of you and guards should also watch you more maybe follow you as though ur a criminal they need to watch. that'd take the game to a whole new level

Should being in jail decrease your abilities?

Yes, what other punishment could there be that would make any sense? If your skills do not drop everyone would just go to jail no matter what the fine was, since there would be no real downside (unless you RP).

Should guards instantly know who commited a crime?

Well... no. That generally disliked (no offense Bethesda, don't kill me) in Oblivion, and was complained about accordingly.

Should either be regional bounties?

Either? Either what? Some crimes should be spread across the land quickly. For instance, if you murder a dozen guards in a rampage, word would spread fast. If you steal a cup off of a table in some dude's house, no one would really care outside the initial community, and even then people would probably forget pretty quickly. If you murdered some guy a few years ago though, I doubt anyone would remember that you did it. People tend to forget after a while.

Should you be able to hide from guards?

Yeah... much like the second question, I'm sure Bethesda has learned from their mistakes (not to suggest they can do anything wrong, of course. Please don't kill me).

Ah, the law, the first thing I made a giant essay about changing years ago.

I would prefer an evidence system. When you or an NPC does something illegal, there's a % chance (based on things like stealth and pickpocket skills) of leaving an invisible "evidence marker", which the player can't see. These gradually fade over time, and the guards don't get involved until someone reports the crime. A murder in the street is going to be public knowledge real fast, but if you steal a few things from an attic, it may be a week before anyone goes up there and notices. The guards, once alerted, investigate the scene and find any evidence markers. Each one has a certain value depending, again, on what you were doing and relevant skills. If they add up to a sufficient amount, you are pursued and confronted. If you have a known home or places of business (like factions), they look there first. If you're not found, wanted posters go up, particularly at town gates, where guards can quickly spot you. Depending on how much evidence is available against you and your own speech skills, you could convince the guard confronting you of your innocence. Small-time crimes wouldn't warrant any increase in guard patrols, but a wanted murderer on the loose would lead to many more guards.

It would provide a good scaling challenge for thieves; a novice could hit obscure locations for chump change, and much of the evidence would probably be faded by the time it's even reported. As you improve, you can take more risks on where you target and how brazen your crimes are. A master thief might target a castle, leaving scarcely any evidence thanks to their skills, but know there's still a chance for danger because the guards are going to react most aggressively to a crime there, noticing right away and needing a lower evidence score to target you. I don't want guards to automatically know where I am, but have to look. Fleeing through alleys as they chase would be fun, and having a secret room installed in my house where I hide out, hearing them rummage around outside, would be awesome. You'll have to return to town eventually and put yourself at risk, and if you stay outside of town, well...that's another way they win, basically, driving out a thief. If your crimes are bad enough, trackers and bounty hunters might look for you in the wilderness.

Theft aside, it would also make other criminal vocations more varied and interesting. An assassin would try to be genuinely subtle, firing an arrow through a window, instead of just walking into someone's house and stabbing them because it makes no difference. Other killers might try to hide the body. It would be easy enough to add generic "I heard someone was murdered" or "such and such store was robbed" type statements to NPC pvssyr, or mention the events on town bulletins that tell citizens to be careful. I would love to skillfully orchestrate a robbery that's done quickly and efficiently, leaving little evidence, and walk through town hearing people talk about my deeds. The delayed status of reporting crimes, and gradual searches, would also make it so you can't just save and load to redo something without getting seen and thus easily avoid all consequences of everything you do.

Resisting arrest should still, in most cases, be non-lethal. Can't guards carry clubs? Have them knock you out and haul you to jail instead of a ten-man team trying to murder you for touching an apple. Punishment should be, simultaneously, more and less severe I think. I've always hated the ability damage of prison, but removing it makes it a non-punishment. Most cases might involve a fine AND jailtime. Being in jail could make you fail quests or be ejected from factions, inability to pay fines could result in confiscation of items and property. Attribute damage could come in other ways; if your crimes are bad enough you might suffer from lashes or other corporal punishment, giving you things like damage to attributes or max health that has to be healed from over time. Murder should never be shrugged off as easily as a small fine. If you're a known serial killer, or have otherwise accumulated a bad enough history, then you should be considered kill on sight, forever. You chose that life, you get to pay for it. Not everyone would instantly recognize you, especially in other towns, and I would also advocate things for another thread like disguises and other stealth options so that it's not an instant block to normal gameplay, but yeah, an actual working justice system of some kind would be nice.

My head just exploded.

1) yes, because you get rusty in them.
2.3.4) I agree
5) don't agree, will tell bellow why

---

1) agree
2) hostage would be the same thing as assault, I personally don't want the player to be able to burn houses, if the censored part is having six with a person who doesn't agree with it, uuuh no.
3) what were you thinking? Death penalty? So you kill someone, and you can more or less start over because with death penalty it would mean breaking from the jail and running from guards for the rest of that campaign. Not how TES games work or should work.
4) agree to some extend, there should be only some and those should be certain NPCs that go to jail.
5) agree with helm or hood for making it longer to get detected.



Uuuh yes it is. That's the whole point, Invisibility is 100% but any action makes you visible again. Chameleon doesn't wear off, but it varies from 1-100%.



In case you haven't noticed this already happens

And I agree with majority of Rhekarid's post, that would be interesting.

Bethesda really needs to improve the crime system. But I am more than sure that they are planing on doing that.

untrue if you stole something petty like an 8 ball they would just say "Hey give that back" and remove it from your inventory.

I would expand the crime system and tweak it.

1st if you commit a murder and no other person sees you then its not a Crime but after you kill a person and they discover the body then its a 1000 gold fine. I would have more guards on the road even more then there were in Oblivion.

2nd being in jail should lower your abilities I mean you do lose access to your sword. Now does that mean you can abuse that to get to 255 if the level systems the same then sure but why would you do that to me thats a waste of time.

3rd bring back the thing from Morrowind where if you get a high enough bounty they send guard squads after you or something like that.

Skyrim is part of the imperial province, and is thus under imperial law and most likley will have forts like in morrowind. I dont see how regional bounties could work seeming its one region anyway. Maybe a bounty system for tribal towns without imperial rule and a secone one for imperial settlements would work.

It Irretated me that when im 5 Miles away and i Kill someone, EVERYBODY knows its Me with Guards coming at me on full paste.

What is the Point in Invisible Stuff when Everybody is looking right at me.

Why not put on a Bright Costume that says I DID IT for a Thief and Kill Someone, yet every place i go to point their finger at me.

For big nasty crimes such as murder or perhaps stealing from a high status NPC such as a noble, then word should spread out from that point in all directions, at an alertful (that even a word??) pace, afterall all news would be delivered on horseback at the fastest. Obviously this is assuming that you were even seen commiting the crime, so they can pass on your description. If you weren't seen commiting the crime, then word spreading would be a little slower as there isn't a man hunt going on, but if your seen with the stolen items etc then your description would then be passed on to the local law enforcement of where you are at the time. As for not knowing your description of a murder, perhaps they could bring you in for interigation and you can use your shiny speechcraft skills to get you out of it (nice mini game there perhaps). I like the idea of fleeing from a man hunt, always trying to stay one step ahead of the law, not being able to stay in one place for long enough.

When you kill someone, if there are witnesses, they should run to tell guards, and only once they reach them within earshot should they chase you, or if you kill them first, you should be okay. Also, if you're seen weapon drawn near a recently dead body, they should draw the conclusion that you killed them.

I'm fine with my skills going down if I go to jail
I don't think guards should be psychic. If someone sees you commit a crime you should have a few moments to "silence" them before they raise the alarm.
You should definitely be able to hide from guards, and your bounty should be regional unless it's high enough. In which case bounty hunters should come after you.

Yeah I hated the psychic guards in OB. What...do they have some magic CCTV that can tell whats going on anywhere. I don't think so. I hope that is resolved. I am a big criminal in these games. :flamethrower::flame:

I also hope if you are an infamous criminal, bounty hunters should be sent after you.

From http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gI5-GZkKBDQ&feature=related you can see a concept of an executioner with an axe polearm and a head in his hand. So maybe this means that execution is a punishment in Skyrim. Maybe you can see other criminals executed aswell as yourself. That would be cool.

Yes
No
Yes
Yes

Would make crime more realistic.

I always saw paying gold for murders as kind of being like the ancient custom of "wergeld" in some northern cultures in real life. You killed some one, you paid a price in coin based on the importance of the person you killed. And then there was the possibility of bloodfeud, which sounds like Beth might have added this time!

Reminds me when I was at the "katana temple" I was best friends with everyone there when we had to go on horse (There were three horses), I got up on my horse and suddenly everyone starts attacking me (Including my BFF NPC), that's when I realize I mounted the WRONG HORSE, and they refused to listen to me and just tried to kill me endlessly. Had to load from my last saved point.

They seriously needs to tone down guard reactions accordingly.

Best Crime and Detection system I've ever read. I really wish to see that "evidence marker" in TES. Really.

Is that censored thing up there what i think it is? o.O

I think a great fix to this problem would be for Beth to download Reneer's guard overhaul and examine the changes he made, because thats the only guard mod I use and I have no complaints with OB guards anymore.

Capy-Paste from Assassin's Creed :tongue:

Honestly, I want to see the ability to hide from guards, in bushes or behind walls, etc. Also, regional bounties but after a while word spreads if you're bad enough and every guard wants to arrest you. Death sentences from Morrowind for a really high bounty was nice.
Finally, from Daggerfall, I liked the ability to go to court and try to persuade the judges that you are innocent. This will give players another reason to study Speechcraft. That was a really nice feature the first time that I played Daggerfall (after playing Morrowind and Oblivion first).