[Love iz not]

I find the removal of hand-to-hand combat totally unjustifiable -- like spears. I can only hope that, like spears, hand-to-hand will be returning a rather untraditional sense.

Well in which one?
Spears return in form of polearms like bardiche or naginata so relay more on slashes then on thrusting, so hand to hand can return in form of kicks with legs rather then punches with hands?
Why we cant have both?

[Brandon Wilson]

I think unarmed combat might be a type of two weapon fighting, having it's own perk tree in the one hand or two hand weapons skills.

I can't really see not being able to strike a blow with your body, it should be a weapon that everyone has that gets better with use.

I won't miss it much since I seldom use it. Things could be different if we couldn't access our inventories in combat or hot key more than one weapon. If I lose the weapon in hand I just equip the next one in line to finish things off.

I don't plan on using a melee weapon in combat anyway. I expect it'll be kind of hard to knock a spell loose.

[evelina c]

I love that they keep taking more things out, and people just keep going "It's for the best."


Come two months after release, I look forward to seeing whether opinions change,

[anna ley]

Well in Daggerfall it also uses legs

Thats is what will be if actor without of weapons?
He must defend self with bare hands.
If H2H now belong to one of two weapon skills, what will be if you train opposite one?
How thats can be if you swing with heavy one hand mace all time and cannot defend self with bare hands?
Most logical if hand to hand belong to more skills it one time since it features is hard to bind just only for one skill, but best if Hand to Hand become separate skill, in such cases it will blown with full glory.


If used as separate skill it can allow use legs in combat as well and give many new movements also, how many peoples does not use legs in combat they are longer and hit harder, and I see ridicules crush power attack form Oblivion when tiny Bosmer try land so powerful strike with his weak hands, better if he use round house kick.

Uhh what?

[Flesh Tunnel]

Well in which one?
Spears return in form of polearms like bardiche or naginata so relay more on slashes then on thrusting, so hand to hand can return in form of kicks with legs rather then punches with hands?
Why we cant have both?

I meant as in the sense that it wouldn't be a skill per se, but it would still be possible -- maybe with its own perks?

[Adriana Lenzo]

In case I'm not the 20'th person who pointed this out:

HtH has been replaced by perks, just like every other weapon skill.
It's nothing we didn't knew already.

Now we have one handed and two handed, each with a perk-tree branching out in several specialties.

It's something along the lines of:

-one handed: weapon, shield, dual wielding
-two handed: weapon, bow, hand-to-hand

Why in oblivion would Hand to Hand be part of two-handed? Unless you fuse your hands together (Like Oblivion's [censored] standing power attack), it operates more as a one-handed thing. Even if you use both hands empty, it's then a form of dual-wielding.

One-handed is Swords, Axes, Maces, Daedric Cresent Blades, Fists,
Two handed is for Two-handed Swords, Hammers, Axes, and whatever polearms and spears get into the game.

Bows are part of the Archery skill, not Two-handed weapon skill

Argument for hand-to-hand being a one-handed weapon: How many fists does it take to throw a single punch?

[Rachel Tyson]

Because

Why would I be equally proficient in swing an axe(one hander) when I use a sword (one hander) you do not swing an axe like a sword you do not fight with an axe and act like it's a sword..

you won't.


unless you take perks for both.

[Noely Ulloa]

I love that they keep taking more things out, and people just keep going "It's for the best."


Come two months after release, I look forward to seeing whether opinions change,

They took the skill out because they changed the character progression system. It is perk based instead of spreadsheet based.

They removed blade but I am confident we will get to use swords....

[XPidgex Jefferson]

There is a ton to read, so I'll just ask and see what happens.... What if hand-to-hand COMBAT isn't GONE, but moved to new categories like Mysticism was? Two-Handed category, anyone??? Think about it. Was this already mentioned, or is it a fresh perspective on the matter?

If that's not possible, I had hoped they'd revamp the close-combat system, not scrap it. Less like boxing, more like Jason Bourne, eh? Snapping necks, breaking joints and bones, leverage locks, etc. Thoughts?

[priscillaaa]

Okay, nvm. A bit of reading showed me this has already been brought up..... My bad. Hopefully, though, that's how it'll be.

[Raymond J. Ramirez]

I hope h2h does more damage now, which would be nice to have it merged into another skill. It'll raise with others.

[JeSsy ArEllano]

I'm not quite sure what to think about this. I admit that the only time I really used hand to hand was when faced by some odd, weak enemy that I didn't want to waste any charges on (such as the wolves and mudcrabs), but it was nice to know it was there.

It seems like just about everything is getting tossed into one or two handed. I'm not really sure how you can have perk trees with so many different styles of weapon thrown into the same group. Now we have hand to hand as well. Either we are going to end up with perk bushes (or maybe perk seedlings) or some skills are going to end up with an insane number of perks compared to other skills.

There seems to be a several groups of skills/things that don't really seem to have a good home among the skills that we know about. And now it seems at least one of the skills that quite a few people were expecting is not going to be there. Where are improvements to running speed and sprinting going to go? How about some way to boost jumping height/reduce fall damage? Now hand to hand lacks a home as well. It really makes me wonder if some of the people suggesting some sort of general fitness (I don't know what it would be actually called) skill are onto something. True they don't all get along, but then again different types of swords can have different techniques (think blade in Oblivion) and now all one handed weapons are housed in a single skill. If grouping these loosly related items together is a problem, then we might need to start up another thread to discuss how horrible merging all the one (or two) handed weapons together is.

As much as I hate to say it, at this point we don't really know enough. Hopefully E3 in a couple of days will reveal some things, or at least trigger an increase in the amount of information released.

[Brandon Wilson]

Technically speaking....it is a two handed weapon .

LOL, indeed it is my friend. :intergalactic:

[Brentleah Jeffs]

So will Hand-to-Hand combat be viable? Or will my Chuck Norris character completely svck? lol

[Gemma Flanagan]

So will Hand-to-Hand combat be viable? Or will my Chuck Norris character completely svck? lol

The more you run through it and think about it, them more you realize that some form of fighting with your hands MUST be in. However, the way the "unarmed" system will work is something we have no idea about. All that was confirmed was the SKILL of hand-to-hand being removed. That's it.

[Ross Zombie]

According to the Skyrim wiki at planet elderscrolls, H2H is in the game as one of the six stealth skills. Any truth to that? They didn't list any source page.

http://planetelderscrolls.ign.com/wiki/Stealth

Edit: After seeing the line "The Elder Scrolls encyclopedia that everyone can edit", a light got turned on in my head. You're still free to discuss it of course.

[Lil Miss]

The skill itself is out, already confirmed, BUT..... I like the idea. It's much more stealth oriented than combat oriented.

Snapping necks in the shadows, takedowns like Jason Bourne, ALLL VERY STEALTH ORIENTED....

[Tom]

According to the Skyrim wiki at planet elderscrolls, H2H is in the game as one of the six stealth skills. Any truth to that? They didn't list any source page.

http://planetelderscrolls.ign.com/wiki/Stealth

Edit: After seeing the line "The Elder Scrolls encyclopedia that everyone can edit", a light got turned on in my head. You're still free to discuss it of course.

IT HAS NO SENSE
As sealth skills i found this:
"hand to hand, unarmored, security, sneak, speechcraft, alchemy "
Before i watched the info i had i light of hope in my hearth, but it loks like so false. They didn't include archery in the list.
Light armor doesnt matter, because it could be merged with H armor.

[Sakura Haruno]

Armor itself should be a skill, then you perk it out for light or heavy specialization.

Or leave it the way it is. IDC.