Hand to Hand in Skyrim? : V

» Fri May 27, 2011 7:57 pm

I always like the idea of Hand to Hand in Oblivion, but it was weak and had little to no appeal in game. How do you think Hand to Hand will be different in Skyrim? Fighting Styles, Fist weapons, other, both?

This is my idea:

Spoiler

I think to remedy this, instead of including fist weapons like Fallout does, have the ability to improve your fighting styles with various martial arts. There are plenty to take inspiration from, such as Muay Thai, Tae Kwon Do, Boxing, Savate, Karate, and many other striking martial arts. As your H2H skill increases you would be able to learn more powerful martial arts if you chose, and would have to go to a trainer to switch between learned forms.

This would make H2H much more appealing, and a way to improve it without adding ridiculous fist weapons. Kick based martial arts could be slower and more powerful than fist based ones, and there could be some middle ground. With a level 100 H2H skill one should be able to pull off very extravagant and effective moves, looking like a Kung Fu movie. While it may be a little impractical like that, the PC is supposed to be way above average and a hero, so you can suspend your disbelief a little.

To me this would be the best way to improve the H2H skill, because Fist weapons would all have nearly the same animations, and become very stale, though an inclusion of both would be okay, i feel fist weapons would undermine the inclusion of fighting styles.

» Sat May 28, 2011 12:59 am

I like your idea.

I also want fist weapons, like a Katar.

» Fri May 27, 2011 11:28 pm

Unfortunately, I'm willing to bet that Hand to hand in Skyrim will be as it has been for quite a long time; nothing but punching. Since Suggestion threads began for TES:V, I wanted to revamp the Hand to Hand skill, adding kicks (or bringing them back, rather), throws and takedowns. Unfortunately, I'm willing to bet that it won't happen. For whatever reason, Bethesda seem to ignore H2H almost entirely, only doing the bare minimum to include it in the game.

» Fri May 27, 2011 7:03 pm

Here's to hoping that there will be some sort of disarm mechanic in the game that forces characters into a hand to hand melee

» Fri May 27, 2011 11:43 pm

For whatever reason, Bethesda seem to ignore H2H almost entirely, only doing the bare minimum to include it in the game.

I would agree, but the new additions in Fallout: New Vegas (special unarmed power attacks) make me think there could be greater additions to the sill in Elder Scrolls as well, especially if with the new engine they have much better animations.

» Sat May 28, 2011 12:27 am

Adding more stuff to hand to hand would be better and make it a more viable skill, because as it stands right now it's a bit underpowered.

» Sat May 28, 2011 9:13 am

Both Fighting Styles and Fist Weapons

This me want. I've tried to create characters that had some skill in this. MW's was decent, in that it'd make your enemy collapse for quite some time, but it was still pretty weak (especially at low levels).

» Fri May 27, 2011 8:21 pm

I agree that it is definitely underpowered, and even if it doesn't become on par with other weapon skills, I hope the appeal to it is much greater, and it isn't as underpowered as Oblivion.

But the least that can be done is to get rid of the horrible impractical power attacks they have, a two handed strike and spins with fists is definitely impractical, and it doesnt even look cool lol.

» Sat May 28, 2011 7:08 am

Well, awesome H2H would definitely make my Goutfang/Rawlith khaj Master more fun to play as.

» Fri May 27, 2011 7:14 pm

I especially hope they increase the potency of hand to hand because I am a console user and I don't have access to the great mods the the PC community is available to.

And who wouldn't want to go around Skyrim like an elder scrolls Bruce Lee :toughninja:

» Sat May 28, 2011 5:58 am

I think the basic solution of adding simple things like Brass Knuckles or something to the H2H formula would make using it much more viable.

I would love to see some H2H takedowns and fighting styles, but I think there may be way to many types of enemies may make that diffcult.

» Sat May 28, 2011 9:37 am

I would love to see some H2H takedowns and fighting styles, but I think there may be way to many types of enemies may make that diffcult.

Thats why I limited my ideas to the striking martial arts, grapples and throws would be much more difficult to include all the animations for.

» Sat May 28, 2011 1:32 am

I don't know about the marshal arts thing, but for the H2H weapons, great idea!

» Sat May 28, 2011 2:00 am

What type of hand to hand weapons do you guys think could be added.
A http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katara_(dagger) of course would be cool
Also the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Scissor would be a nice addition.

» Sat May 28, 2011 6:21 am

I think fighting styles would be cool, and maybe you have to learn them like in New Vegas - by talking to an expert. Except I would want something more than just special power attacks. I was just playing New Vegas today and that Ranger Takedown attack is just epically overpowered. But hand to hand without it is pretty much completely underpowered. It would be tricky to balance it. And considering a first person game, implementing fancy martial arts would be hard. But I would really like to see something new and cool in the area of hand to hand.

» Sat May 28, 2011 1:32 am

Fighting styles would be very interesting, a very cool idea. Fist weapons could be cool too, if there's more than just variations on brass knuckles.

» Fri May 27, 2011 11:34 pm

I wanna be able to throw someone off a cliff alive... .-.
simple, but would be an entertaining way to kill someone

» Sat May 28, 2011 4:04 am

Fist weapons FTW!!

I hated that the only real "fist weapons" in oblivion were gauntlets that gives you hand to hand skill +10 or something

» Fri May 27, 2011 5:42 pm

And considering a first person game, implementing fancy martial arts would be hard. But I would really like to see something new and cool in the area of hand to hand.

You should check out some H2H mods on youtube, they have some crazy third person animations. First person would just be simplified a little, it wouldn't be too hard to include some frames for a kick or elbow strike. Just something besides only punching, unless you choose a fighting style like that akin to boxing.

» Sat May 28, 2011 5:26 am

Its hard to say that H2H should be effective. Give any martial artist a knife and he could kill faster ( especially against an armored foe) however its definitely not ineffective either. I think it would be interesting if they combined H2H with other melee skills. so leveling H2H allows for things like kicking or pushing, pulling and attacks of opportunity in the midst of swordplay. Almost like having a second "fighting" skill in addition to a weapon skill. and the best way to level it would be to fight unarmed. How this would be implemented, I'm not even interested in suggesting. Use your imagination. We should all be thankful that H2H didn't go the way of the unarmored skill of Morrowind

yes I am also disappointed with how its almost ignored as a viable alternative. I've always wanted a pacifist Jujitsu user that defends and incapacitates instead of kills. but even if you knocked someone out before you killed them, they just got back up and kept fighting...

As for things like brass knuckles, i think it kind of defeats the purpose of being unarmed.

edit: I could also see merging H2H with acrobatics... which would make them both more viable, usable, and believable.

» Sat May 28, 2011 1:15 am

Metal Knuckles?
Fighting styles sounds like a marvelous idea, with multiple styles you can train in.

» Sat May 28, 2011 1:28 am

i want to break necks, kick balls and do flying kicks like chuck norris.

» Sat May 28, 2011 1:23 am

Its hard to say that H2H should be effective. Give any martial artist a knife and he could kill faster ( especially against an armored foe) however its definitely not ineffective either. I think it would be interesting if they combined H2H with other melee skills. so leveling H2H allows for things like kicking or pushing, pulling and attacks of opportunity in the midst of swordplay. Almost like having a second "fighting" skill in addition to a weapon skill. and the best way to level it would be to fight unarmed. How this would be implemented, I'm not even interested in suggesting. Use your imagination. We should all be thankful that H2H didn't go the way of the unarmored skill of Morrowind

yes I am also disappointed with how its almost ignored as a viable alternative. I've always wanted a pacifist Jujitsu user that defends and incapacitates instead of kills. but even if you knocked someone out before you killed them, they just got back up and kept fighting...

As for things like brass knuckles, i think it kind of defeats the purpose of being unarmed.

edit: I could also see merging H2H with acrobatics... which would make them both more viable, usable, and believable.

I agree that unarmed combat will always be less practical than weaponized combat, but realism isn't necessarilly the point of a video game, its about enjoyment, so for the sake of the game they could make H2H on par with Blade, Blunt, and other forms of combat. Also I think improved swordplay involving things besides the sword would still be incorporated in the weapon skill for swords, because that includes all elements of fighting with that weapon, not just the weapon itself.

H2H should only be used for fighting without a weapon, and I agree it would be pretty cool combined with acrobatics for some flashy moves, or combined with block to deliver counters.

» Sat May 28, 2011 4:39 am

How about Sherlock Holmes fighting style? I like that, it's fun.

» Sat May 28, 2011 6:35 am

H2H should NOT be effective against an armored opponent. It was really stupid in Morrowind and Oblivion when civilians would go charging at you with their fists when you were an armored death machine killing everything in sight. Maybe hand claws could increase effectiveness against armor.