I love hand to hand in oblivion as it requires no maintainance and no recoil in general. What bugged me was that there was not really much dedication to this skill. The only NPC that used Hand to Hand as a general combat skill was that Khagiit in that Brotherhood quest. The only usefull things were the The Bands of Kwang Lao(Yes I robbed the whole freakin Imperial city ). But still. I would like to see some Hand to Hand based weapons. I mean Marksman based weapons are bows, Blade weapons swords and Blunt weapons clubs and stuff. So why not Hand to Hand weapons like metal knuckles? Such as Steel, Elven, Glass, Ebony, ect. I would like this implemented for Hand to Hand because bashing with my fists is quite fun.

Sounds interesting and owning people with fists fun :slap:

Be kinda hard to kill a dragon with your fists.

The problem with hand to hand in previous tes games was that it was a boring skill.You didnt had weapons for hand to hand so by using it you lost half of the fun of the game.In order to make hand to hand more interesting you must have more usefull "weapons"(like the bands of Kwang Lao)that fit with this skill

Bethesda did a great job (IMO) with unarmed combat in fallout 3, i'm sure they learned a lot about how they want it to be in skyrim from that experience.

This

Yeah, but just think how epic it would be if you pulled it off.

My Morrowind character could kill all of Morrowind with his fists. So I'm sure a dragon would be manageable.

Anyone else imagining finishing moves by choking them?

Ok so I can beat a bloodthristy Daedroth in 3 hits but not a dragon? k

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Crtu--GkS_I 1:09

I find it rather amazing that people can find killing a dragon with magic to be more realistic than killing one with your bare hands. Wha? First off, its a dragon. The laws of physics are now officially out the window. Second, killing anything with your fists is going to be more realistic than killing something with magic, simply because we can kill with our fists, but not magic. Least, I can't use magic. Maybe that's just me. And third, we're talking about TES here. The lore specificly talks about hand to hand combat being very versital and deadly.

It doesn't need to be realistic, it needs to be believable. And it is very beleivable to kill a dragon with mystical gauntlets you recieved froma daedric god. Very very believable

First thing I'm trying.

I always used HtoH in OB, first skill to be mastered, gave a great sense of achievement, first time you kill a troll with bare hands, first time you kill a brown bear etc. etc. Not to fussed on knuckle dusters and so on, but really hope there are a few tasty perks to liven things up, HtoH finishing moves would make me very happ

Pro Tip: Go for the eyes and groin.

To gain an easy neck snap on the dragon you must have higher ground and a firm powerful kick. First make sure the dragon is looking the other way unaware of you and you are facing the back side. Measure your jump and make the right movement and use all your momentum to go forward with your preferred legg sticking out while keeping at an 85 degree angle of direction on the neck.(Hopefully the dragon is still teething on some old peasent Dunmer to notice you. Hurl your foot with it pointing outright with your other legg tucked near your buttocks so that your jack knife jumping stance is headed just below the crown of horns and 5 inches from the left of the cervical vertebrae. While the flesh of the ignorant Dunmer is still in the neck, the impact will cause its Uvula to be disturbed causing a gagging reflex and spitting the flesh of the Dunmer out even further thus creating more weight on oneside to create a fulcrum and the neck snapping under the force of your powerful kick and from the built up gelatinous Dunmer waste inside. Thus causing instant fatality.

-Dragon Slaying for Nords.

Yeah I want to strangle a Dragon to death while wearing my Gauntlets of Might :toughninja:
Like the scene from "Knight of the Black Rose" where Lord Soth throttles a young Dragon, even though it tears into his undead arm :mohawk:

I think I heard from Todd or an article that each and every weapon has a finishing move for every enemy, so the hand to hand finishing moves for dragons must be incredibly badass.

Yeah I can`t wait to see them all! Thats a good point though, will there be a finishing move for a hand to hand kill with a Dragon? or has Beth deemed it a no chance scenario..

i want to do http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsJ5s6CKmog to my enemies.

Beth could use any of those for finishing moves

Brilliant fight scene - if Skyrim could pack in a tenth of that kind of variation and fighting style I'd definitely be dedicating my character to hand to hand combat.

Gauntlets shoud affect H2H damage too. Heavy armour should do more damage.
EDIT: And the the ability to preform kicks (like Seth's Hand-to-Hand Anims for Oblivion).

That kind of logic doesn't really make much sense. Magic can't kill people in real life because we can't use magic in real life, but in a world where it's possible for people to shoot fireballs out of their hands, it's easy to imagine such spells killing powerful enemies like dragons. It's slightly harder to imagine it for hand to hand combat, but that's beside the point. This is a game we're talking about here, it doesn't necessarily need to be realistic, as long as it keeps players entertained. And in the case of the Elder Scrolls, the series is advertised as allowing players to be whoever they want, and you can't really do that if certain types of characters just don't work at all because they can't defeat dragon.

But I'd definitely say hand to hand should get more attention in Skyrim, if done well, I could see hand to hand being quite fun to play. but past games I think didn't handle it well enough. Part of the problem with it is the lack of variety with hand to hand, I think. Other combat skills give players the oportunity to get different weapons in order to keep things changing, yet for hand to hand players, it gets monotonous after a while since you can't get better weapons. Fallout was able to avoid this somewhat due to the presence of unarmed weapons (It sounds pretty strange when you put it like that, I know. But I mean punching weapons like brass knuckles and power fists, which are governed by the unarmed skill.), but Morrowind and Oblivion didn't have that. And there wasn't even any variety in combat style to help aliaviate the monotomy, if we could actually see some of those martial arts that exist in the lore yet aren't demostrated in the game, maybe hand to hand combat would be less repetitive, so maybe in Skyrim will be able to learn certain special hand to hand moves, these could be done as perks, it seems like the most logical way to do perks for hand to hand with the way perks work. I'd also agree that gauntlets should effect hand to hand damage, aside from being logical (If you wear a heavy metal gauntlet on you're hand, I'd imagine getting hit by it would hurt more than if you're hand was bare, not that have personal experience in the matter.) it would allow hand to hand players a way to increase their combat damage by choosing equipment, something players who use weapon skills can do but hand to hand characters couldn't in the past.

No, at least no to part with knuckles.
Well, not a total no at least since I think that there should be a way for us to be able to own with H2H and not use any kind of weapons, not even knuckles or gauntlets.
One way is to be able to find clothes that will improve our unarmored and unarmed abilities (for example, it will give you bonuses to H2H, strength, agility, speed and such or some stuff equal to that since I've heard that we won't be seeing attributes anymore), they will be rare and hard to get so those that depend on weapons and armor don't feel like idiots because they have to search for their stuff.
Also, there could be scrolls/tomes all over the Skyrim (more powerful ones will be more rare) witch will contain techniques of martial arts witch will basically improve your unarmored and unarmed fighting style.
You could equip them just like a weapon and will take up two slots (only one teaching at the time ), but they won't be visible on the character (maybe will only carry around the waist it or something like that) and will give you bonuses.
Also, those scrolls/tomes could also contain some secrets to arcane martial arts instead of just improving existing ones.
By that, I mean that your fists and legs would also be enchanted by fire, ice, shock and other effects that could go well with martial arts.
That way martial artists could also be a powerful sort, but still demand some gear searching.

And yeah, killing dragons with fists is PERFECTLY NORMAL FOR A FANTASY GAME!
Martial artists in real life preform feats that others can't even think of, so it would be actually much easier for them to kill one in a fantasy world.

That won't stop Chuck Norris.


Oh, and
http://www.dorkly.com/comic/11618/awkward-zombie-impediment
:rofl:

I hope gauntlets and armoured gloves or vambraces will also affect are unarmed damage.

this sounds like serial killer status