It's a shame Only enforces my decision not to buy it at launch.

As for some people who say "not many would use it", they have to accept that what if they don't like something, that doesn't mean they majority doesn't as well.

Many polls have been made here and like 80% would play a hardcoe mode.

80% of the forum users do not make a statistically large enough group in the overall player base on which to make a design decision.

It can be statistically large enough; the problem is that it's a self-selected sub-sample. Forum users are not representative of the average consumer.

No but they are a statistically large enough group to stop posters saying nonsense like "none would like it" etc, how about that.

FFS guys. Let it to rest. Some people want a "hardcoe" mode. Theres a "survival" difficulty. same thing.

Some people don't want hardcoe mode there's not one.

Why cant we all just get along and not argue about how many and who likes what...

Good, now we won't have 500 hundred threads at launch complaining about how Bethesda's hardcoe mode svcks and is a step back from Obsidian's.

Maybe i missed something, but by whom and when was this confirmed? By that spanish leak?

Wait, are we talking about the same thing? When I say hardcoe mode I mean realistic injuries, human needs etc, their "survival" difficulty has nothing to do with survival aspects.

If we all got along then the forums would be dreadfully boring!

We will, because it is.

Obsidian's mode was actually about survival.

How do you know that survival mode does not include some if not all of your above mentioned qualities? You dont. Because the game hasn't released yet. Leaks say there's no labeled "hardcoe" mode so that upsets superficial players who think they're "hardcoe". Because now they cant go to their friends and say "I only play hardcoe mode" "because im hardcoe like that". No. Just no. I pitty you and those who have complained about hardcoe. I'm sorry if your lives svck so bad.

We know that it doesn't include those things because people who have played the game have confirmed that it does not.

I don't know if you are having some kind of stroke of something but I'd suggest you would relax. I want a hardcoe mode because I enjoy playing with survival elements, scrounging for food etc, not being a bullet sponge, not having limbs magically healed etc.... can you understand that? I also don't know if your friends brag and enrage you but I do not belong to that age group. People don't actually do that.

Lol, this thread is becoming hilarious. ^^

I don't think anyone said no one would like a hard core. I played "hard core" as well as jsawyer. I liked it will enough.

Argue that you liked mode and want it back for the reasons you enjoyed. Do not appeal to some imaginary majority in order to support your preference.

here is the main problem with "hardcoe" or "survivalist" mode

It was (lets be blunt) half arsed in New Vegas, and more or less just cluttered the hell out of your inventory with all the crafting crap. between the food items and stimpacks it was all to easy to cheese a "hard" fight by simply stuffing your face just before you pulled the trigger beforehand and then just blitzing it. and since you did that to heal, you usealy did not need to eat or drink... ever.

there was no difficulty or challenge added beyond needing to cherry pick your loot, which you end up doing anyway hardcoe or not.

now lets continue to be blunt. I would love to see a survival mode that would be a bit more useful, and not so Fracking broken

For example Food/water would negate hunger/thirst over time, and maybe provide a slight boost to normal healing,but would be restricted, no more stuffing your face with 2-3 drink items, and enough food to make the 72 Oz challeng over at Big Texan look like an appetizer plate for a baby feild mouse for example.

Unfortunately, developing a hardcoe mode that is not half assed takes work. it takes time to create the game code, and time to test and balance the game code so it does not end up being basically useless while still providing some kind of actual benefit.

I suspect they realized they had a choice to make.

Spend time developing a Proper hardcoe mode with Weapon degridation.

Spend time Developing a full blown mod System that covered everything weponsisable.

if that was the choice, Im kind of glad they made the right one here.

Well I am a bit disappointed. I also do not think Obsidian's survival mode was half-arsed. Yeah it was not that thoroughly thought out, a bit more time would have been good. I still think that adjustments in loot gain (less caps, less ammo) would have been great, as well as the player needing to eat, drink and rest at towns. Dirty water might get you through a day, but at some time you just want that special treat like the Deathclawcake to fully satisfy your needs. Those things improve pacing as well, I feel we rush through games like Fallout way too fast.

Also what I do not get, is that they build up mechanics like weapon mods and settlement management, a ton of micromanagement that could well be used to satisfy people's wants for a survival aspect to a post-apocalyptic game.

Instead we again get bullet sponges as enemies and more "legendary" mobs, that drop generic weapons like in Diablo and Borderlands. They might have scrapped the whole idea of unique weapons for that, too. Of course we do not yet know all aspects of the difficulty settings but it seems that there is not much more to it. Quite unexciting.

Everyone will have access to mods now. You will have multiple options to get the best hardcoe mode, that no game dev could have achieved. It will be interesting to see what kind of hardcoe mods console audience will favor.

Isn't this whole thread bare speculation? Where has it been, or not been confirmed there's no, however fashioned, hardcoe style?

They are using consoles already...that's hardcoe...

It has been leaked, it's 99% valid.

Bit disapointing if this is true.

NV's may not have been perfect, but it was quite enjoyable. It didn't need that much of work, and was already quite a serviceable system. Add some more complexity. Some may call it an inconvenience, but others such as myself liked that there was an element of planning involved. Not to go out on a big wandering tour without stocking up on some water and feed, and leaving well rested.

Making stock of your inventory, leave junk behind. Ammo had a weight, limbs wouldn't restore with stimpacks so you needed some doctorbags. Stimpacks healing over time made the moments you got low on health all the more tense, but that might be back anyway. However if it's just in some Nightmare-mode i might not like it as that difficulty setting comes with the added effect of potentially making enemies very bullet spongey. Which i hate.

Ammo (and food/water) could've certainly been a bit more uncommon. But in general i found it enjoyable.

Not this is certainly not the end of the world, i have no doubt some very talented modders will make a hardcoe-mode and i'll just have to wait untill that happens. Honestly i wasn't planning on going hardcoe as a first playthrough anyway.

Just wait for mods

True. I feel like FO4 will create the same experience for me as Skyrim. Play it 300-400 hours vanilla state, then start modding and trying to create the "perfect" game. Problem is, with Skyrim I haven't set up the perfect game up until today...

Yeah, but the best part of a game is when it's all new. I probably won't do the hundreds of playthroughs that some people do with these games.

Waiting for and searching through mods to find one I like isn't all that appealing.

I liked some things about NV hardcoe. Would have been nice to have the option again from the beginning.

This news greatly saddens me. FONV "hardcoe mode" was never about making the game more difficult, but about adding slight nuances to game mechanics. FONV did this just about right, and it was very well integrated into the game. It fit perfectly with what was already there.

Unlike mods, it didn't feel excessive or try to go over the top. You activated it on start and it just worked. My only regret is not activating it on the first playthrough, fearing it would make the game "too difficult" - it didn't, not by a long shot. Keeping extended script engine up to date? Oh noes, not again

Mods that fudge ammo weight by scripting invisible items into your inventory that sometimes don't get cleaned up properly?

Or add scripted effects for hunger and thirst that accidentally turn permanent?

Personally I'd like to run as few scripts as possible, they don't always work, especially if you are running a lot, and your PC is borderline. I'd rather not have to troubleshoot if a bug I've found is a game bug or a mod bug.

And it is far easier to tweak something that is already there with mods then to add it from scratch.