wheres the greenpact mentioned ?

I don't like mark and recall there is no point.

Lies

you must be one of those people who avoid epicly deep dungeons and caves that go on and on with almost no end ... and then once you reach the end what do you do in Morrowind Recall to the start point in Oblivion spend another hour in the cave or dungeon looking for the way it was entered ...

Not being able to do something in Oblivion isn't a valid argument for not being able to do it in Skyrim. You couldn't cut wood in Oblivion, so do that mean woodcutting doesn't make sense in Skrim?

Mark and recall are useful so you dont have to backtrack through long winding dugeons.
To fast travel to places that have no fast travel marker on the map.
To instantly be at your storage place, instead of having to 1) exit cave. 2) fast travel to city 3) walk to your house 4) enter house.
One step instead of four. Thats nifty and quite pointy.

OK. but just because you asked nicely.

That's a good point. What's the point of even having the grab button? Is it there just so that we can interact with the game world? They should actually have a reason, as in something to use it with, like carrying dead bodies.

How is decomposition too gory? Decomposition is the most important part of the cycle of life. Without decomposition (or more specifically, without bacteria) we would not exist. Compare this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6sFP_7Vezg and this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c0En-_BVbGc.

What's the difference between fruits, a rabbit, and a human decomposing? Nothing, except your sheltered outlook on the real world.

EDIT: You played Oblivion right? Have you seen the Necromancers and their servants? :facepalm:

Careful, you'll be accused of wanting cheesy over the top death animations.

True that. The only thing is, most of Oblivion's dungeons were cyclical anyways. You go all the way to the end and SURPRISE! Door to hidden room right by the entrance. With FT and Cyclical dungeons they simply removed all the usefulness of the spell. That being said they could at least remove cyclical dungeons (hopefully a diverse dungeon team means they did) and give us this back.


No but saying that you can't altar the state of something without a life force is a valid argument, which is what the person was getting at. Weapons can only be enchanted because of Soul Gems containing the life force (soul) of a fallen creature. No Soul Gem, no life force, no magic. That simple. As for Sigil stones we have no idea how they worked, but unless it is some kind of magic too advanced for mere mortals then it is probably life force at work again.


Honestly, watching the rabbit decompose made me squirm and I have seen someone blow his own hand up. That was probably only because it was really sped up though. And with that you have to realize that a rabbit is tiny and covered in fur. Humans are much bigger and usually not as fuzzy. Therefore you get to see the stomach become distended, eyes leak and then pop, skin rupture, organs spilling out. It's a lot more gruesome than you think. That being said I wouldn't mind decomposition in a game as it would be far toned down. Besides, the body is going to lay there until the cell resets anyways, might as well spend a day or two making it look good. Also, the grab button is for moving other objects in addition to bodies, but I would like to see it have a more useful function.

Except you can alter the state of dead bodies in Oblivion. You could raise the dead. Unless there is established lore beyond "we haven't seen it yet", then the argument doesn't work.

Technically, if mages can teleport others, then they'd most likely be able to teleport dead ones. To whoever said this isn't a stealth game, Id disagree. you can easily play a TES game like a stealth game. Of course we need spell deletion, although Im against teleporting dead bodies, even though I think it could be done lore wise.


There's plenty of magic that effects inanimate, lifeless objects. Not to mention magic that effects and alters the dead.

Yeah, I wasn't necessarily advocating for the teleporting bodies (though now that I think about it it could actually be quite humorous), just throwing some ideas on how it could fit in a lore friendly way.

I'll say right now we aren't going to agree on this. Ever. I've seen your posts for as long as I have been in the Skyrim forums and know you don't back down from your point. I personally assume that using necromancy they manage to re-instill the life force in a creature, but only in a limited amount (which is why necromantic creatures are basically stupid, mindless drones). But until we get actual lore on this there is no way to determine whether or not you could turn a corpse invisible, you are correct there.

Edit: @Xarnac: I suppose there is open and telekinesis, I wasn't thinking on those. I don't know of any that let you alter the actual physical state of an object though, just ones that only move the object itself. Also, something I missed earlier about how you can cast invisibility on others. You can but it wears off. I wouldn't mind being able to turn bodies invisible like that in a finite way. It would be cool to hide a corpse from a guard or something like that, at least long enough for you to escape.

Actually now that I think about it, I think you can put magical effects on dead bodies, at least in Oblivion, if I remember correctly. I distinctly remember casting invisibility and other things on dead horses and such. too lazy to try this. anyone wanna fire up Oblivion and test this out?

EDIT: After further consideration, Id say yes, teleporting a dead body would be possible. If you can teleport inanimate objects, then you could do so with a dead body.

Since invisibility is an illusion spell, it does not affect the target of the cast, but rather the minds of those perceiving the target, to the effect that their senses do not register them.
I dont think that lore wise there is any objection to making a dead or inanimate object invisible, but I cannot recall any example of such a spell effect appearing in lore.

Well, I'm all for valid points. Invalid ones, not so much.

Conjuring weapons and armor from thin air is one.

Id go back to my previous edit though and point out that teleporting inanimate objects has already taken place.

I saw your previous post, but I thought that conjuring weapons and armor wasn't actually making them just appear, but it was actually calling them from the plane of Oblivion, just like it is with the creatures. Idk for sure though, there isn't any set in stone rule on it (as in an in game book or in a manual)

Wouldn't that be teleporting an inanimate, lifeless object? even if its not, when you teleported in Morrowind, you didnt end up on the other side naked, with no loot ala Terminator. You had all of your inanimate, lifeless gear with you. So there is most definitely precedent here, in one way or another.

True. I never played much Morrowind myself, mainly because I hate diceroll combat. I think the excuse for daedric equipment is that it is from another plane and somehow magical but you still got me on teleporting. Damn I would kill for a morrowind travel system again.