This is only a personal speculation.

Some of Oblivion was oversimplified...and for a fair enough reason too. It was Bethesda's chance at hooking a broader market on the elderscorlls series. Oblivion was supposed to be a next generation launch title. In order to sell the game and more importantly the console, it had to reach a broader spectrum of customers.

Now that it has done so thanks to the help of Oblivion, i'm sure Bethesda will build a much more sophisticated game with an enriched plot.

Look at Fallout 3 compared to New Vegas. People (like myself) had never played a fallout game previous to Fallout 3, so I had to learn all the games factions, and what exactly was going on. When Obsidian released Fallout New Vegas it was much more complex than Fallout 3 in terms of the storyline and the rivaling factions. If it was done the other way around, I can see how it would put off casual players.

But Oblivion had lore....it was just tucked away and relinquished of all importance, You had to look for it.

Now If Beth EXPANDED on that Idea and tucked assloads of lore in the game, but made it so those interested can Find it and those not can go about their business then fine it would have been sixier, Oblivion is a dissappointment in not that it svcks, its a good game for a time but its the fact that...it went so short on so much, there are alot of things Beth could have taken and run with already in the game as well as capitalize on lore detailed in prior games about Cyrodiil, Mehrunes, etc etc..


But they didn't.

Well now I can agree a bit more there, but that's still a bit more off from what the original post is about. The bad guy's motivations, whether in the open or not, were still there.

:lol: It seems not...

Anyway I do think the story can be much mroe deep and complex but you kind of over simplified the sotrylines of those games...

I really hope that the story arc in Skyrim isn't a railroad like it was in Oblivion. I didn't mind too terribly much when I was playing the game because I just saw it as opportunities to kill things and level up, but I'd like to sometime have a choice about which side of the story arc I want to play on. I know that regardless I will have to fight and kill dragons, but I am sure the story isn't going to be that linear, that there are different factions working to progress the story conflict. If so I would love to be able to choose which of the factions, whether the good guys or the bad guys, that I aid whilst outing the dragons. This should be pretty natural for the story they have told us so far, with the civil war going on. Once the dragon menace is eliminated, differences will still exist and so I am sure they are gonna have each of the players also vying for power whilst trying to get the last dragonborn on their side.

Uhh.....Actually......Alduin...sort of.....IS....Akatosh.......thats why when Martin fused with his spirit....he became a huge flaming dragon....Alduin... Two names for the same deity. So question is, why is this god recognized as a creator of Nirn, a god that is worshiped everywhere by nearlly everyone wiping out all life and being labeled an ancient evil?

He isn't worshiped as the creator, that's Shor/Shezarr/Lorkhan. The time god is only the head deity of the Altmer (as Aruiel) and the Nine (as Akatosh). To the nords, Shor is #1 (even though there is no official chief deity), the dunmer...I'd like to say the 3 good daedra, but I doubt they like the daedra anymore. The Bosmer hold Y'ffre as their chief, and the Redguards hold Ruptga as #1.

But...you may be confused by how Alduin is both the creator and destroyer of kalpas. To get this, think of it this way, in order for a new kalpa to happen, the old one must be destroyed. There's a beginning, middle, and end. The time god makes that possible, allowing for a perception of time, in ways.

I didnt mean THE creator I said A creator. Thats what gives him the title of Aedra right? He helped to create the world whereas Daedra didn't? He is a creator and destroyer or at least thats what nords worship him as. So what does that mean for our character. Will we just die as well as everyone else? Will a brand new world be created and the next elder scroll games be in that brand new world?

Let me see -

1. The Hobbit.

2. Beowulf

3. A Song of Ice and Fire *most depressing series of all time. Seriously, all characters with any likeability die off within three books.*

4. The Odyssey

5. The Lord of The Rings (ftw)

I disagree with this,especially on oblivion. There is more to Dagon than just destroying things. He's a very important character,and is always involved in some way. Even before he became dagon ( the leaper demon king ) he interfered with Alduin along side SEP ( Lorkhan ). He was delaying the "eating" By hiding bits of the world from alduin-thus making it take longer or fill him up sooner. I can't remember exactly,but it's along those lines. And as i've said before,i didn't mind oblivions story,and it has more importance now,because of alduins wall and skyrim.


http://www.imperial-library.info/content/fight-one-eating-birth-dagon << Great read,by the way

Well Alduin/Auri-El/Alduin are what makes time flow, he sacrificed/trapped himself, turning into an 'earth-bone' (law of nature). Mer believe, unlike man, that they are descendants from lesser aedra ( =our ancestors) who did something similar. If dragons share this belief not stated in lore (probably skyrim will get deeper into this). The problem with this is that destroying the current kalpa in order to replace it doesn't seem to be a good way to get out.

Of course it may be parallel with the repeating battle of sheogorath and yiggalag, sheo being lorkhan separated from his divine center, stated as a 'sithis shaped hole'. Maybe such rules somehow effect aedra as well.

That's a pretty good motivation for being the antagonist.

Well do we really think the "bad guys" (Dragons) are the main plot point?

I tend to think that we'll be spending more hours fighting in Skyrims civil war than battling dragons. I look forward to both plot points. In the civil war... I hope there are all shades of gray to chose from, rather than simple good and evil (Very one dimensional)

Well to me it's obvious the dragon-Alduin-thing is the main plot point. The civil war is just an underlying conflict that is one of the reasons of why Alduin is coming. All articles and info we've gotten has also pretty much focused on... dragons.

Still, I'm really looking forward to the civil war plot as well

Yes,but my point also,especially to the OP, is that dagon has/had motive too.

it wasn't so much that Oblivion's story was so terrible, its that Morrowind's story was so excellent. One of the best video game stories around.

Yeah, this. If we compare Oblivion's story to another RPG, it's really good. From my gaming experiences, most game stories are either OK or kinda bad. The only game story (although non-RPG) that I've played that I've thought was really really good was Halo. Absolutely loved the story in Halo.

I've yet to play or even hear of another game that has a story as good as Morrowind's though.

As a reader, I loved Morrowind's story. I've only played the game through once, but I enjoyed reading through the Nerevarine story line. I remember getting emotional a time or two . . .

As a writer, I truly enjoyed Oblivion's story line. The flexibility of not being the center of attention - of everything not being about me - allowed me to create some truly unique characters who ended up creating stories that I loved. I remember getting emotional a time or two . . .

~ Dani ~

why?

Morrowind's story was decent. But it was the presentation of the story that made it sound appealing.

I suggest you try Planescape: Torment or Fallout 2 or perhaps, Anacronox. All those RPGs have amazing storylines and their narrative is commendable.

I'm fairly certain that the main plot line in Skyrim is something more like 'The two sides are in a harsh civil war. Dragons have appeared and are bad. You are Dragonborn and will be the one to defeat the dragons, and unit the two split sides of Skyrim together once again (for the first time in a while?) under one flag." Yay for you... It sounds alright.

Why what?

Fallout 3's villains weren't all that pure evil. The Capitol Wasteland was a wreck full of mutants. The thing that bothered me was that the story pretty much guided you down the 'good' path even if you were as evil as could be. You couldn't side with the Enclave, even though they consider vault dwellers to be pure, and you pretty much had to do good guy stuff just to get to the end.

I personally found Mankar a whole lot more interesting than Dagoth Ur. :shrug:

Mehrunes used to be the Leaper Devil King and worked with Lorkhan to piece extra additions to the world, making it harder for Alduin to consume Nirn each time a kapla ended. Alduin caught on to this and shunned The Devil King into a realm of Oblivion, where he became Mehrunes Dagon, prince of revolution and destruction. This was after begging Alduin to let him live for a very long time. Now he wants not revenge, but to act on his nature and cause as much damage as he can to escape his bounds.

The lore is there, you just gotta look for it.