70 Hours in and think I'm about done : V - Skyrim

» Fri Dec 16, 2011 12:46 am

Lol guy unique items don't scale. The damage is changing because your one hand ability is higher. 70 hours and you don't figure this out? Epic fail.

Many of the unique items do scale. Way to go out of your way to insult someone & be completely wrong. Herp derp

» Thu Dec 15, 2011 6:17 pm

Well, here's the thing. I can understand being able to change shouts and spells on the fly, because you aren't actually digging some piece of equipment out of a bag in the middle of a fight, but when it comes to changing weapons, they should only allow you to have so many weapons readily available on your belt, so to speak, and ready to grab. Having an axe and sword on your belt is feasible; having five different weapons on you and immediately at hand according to what you might need in the fight is just not realistic at all.

And it certainly stretches belief to the point of breaking to be able to chug six potions and change armor in the middle of a battle. The sad thing is that I do this myself. All that stuff I said in my previous post? I do that, and I do it constantly. I have some enchanted iron gauntlets I use for archery, and I have some improved steel plate gauntlets I use when fighting toe-to-toe. I start with enchanted leather sneak boots, enchanted archery iron gauntlets, and an enchanted sneak-amulet and a bow, then when I come across bad guys I shoot them from sneak until they start to close then I use my amazing ability to freeze time and change my equipment, and switch to epic plate gauntlets and boots, enchanted heavy armor amulet, and epic steel shield and war axe, then restart time. Boy those bandits/forsworn/cave bears/dragon must get pissed as hell when I go from Robin Hood to Iron Man in the blink of an eye just as they get within ten feet. I really shouldn't, but I do it because the game's kinda balanced to do things that way. Even if I forgo the switch between archer and tank, and just stick with the tank gear, there still would be battles where I just have to drink a quick potion or the fight can't really be won.

Also, @ the OP: Yeah, take a break. Grinding through the game will sour you on it real quick. If it's getting late and I'm a little tired but not quite ready to go to bed, I don't play the game. I'll just read for half an hour rather than force myself to zip through a couple quests in an hour's time. It just svcks all the fun out of it.

» Thu Dec 15, 2011 7:00 pm

*Limited voice acting- I think they did everything with five actors. It svcks to hear the same voice over and over in different characters. This really needs to be expanded.

*Inabillity to kill everyone- I played a good character through the game, but once that nasty snotty kid in Whiterun came up to me. And kept doing it over and over. This was the only time I wanted to kill an NPC, and the game wouldn't let me. If you have an NPC that taunts the PC, they need to be killable.

They used 70 voice actors. Go play Oblivion and you'll find a new happiness with the voice acting in Skyrim. In short, it HAS been expanded.

As for killing children - I believe children should not have been included. But you can't have killing children be included and not expect an epic media [censored] storm.

» Fri Dec 16, 2011 12:46 am

Fable III 40 hours
Mass Effect 2 20-30 hours
Dragon Age Origins 40-50 hours
The Witcher II 30-40 hours

Just saying.

» Fri Dec 16, 2011 1:45 am

When it comes to voice acting. I am pretty sure that I read (or maybe watched a video) that stated they had like 70 voice actors. Where they actually used them, I'd love to know. Because in Skyrim, it seems that the majority of spoken NPC's are using the same 5 or 10 voice actors and it really detracts from the environment when I hear the same person voice acting almost all of the male vendors, AS WELL AS some of the other NPC's. And then there are just some plain old bad voice acting like the first Jarl's magician (can't remember his name) but he sounds exactly as if he's reading his lines off of the script, and likely is. He's absolutely terrible and I have to wonder if he is a relative of somebody big at Bethesda so he got the job to voice act that magician fellow.

Anyway, unlike the OP, where we almost match up in hours, theres a huge ways for me to go to come to any conclusion in the game for me, but I'm one of those players that might stand at a vista admiring the view for 10 minutes so my amount of hours in the game is likely inflated with stuff like staring off on the bluffs somewhere in the game.

» Thu Dec 15, 2011 7:33 pm

70 hours is nothing, sorry. You haven't experienced enough of the game to make a valid judgement call.

That's like saying "I played World of Warcraft, got to level 4. I'm done. What a stupid game."

» Thu Dec 15, 2011 8:25 pm

They used 70 voice actors. Go play Oblivion and you'll find a new happiness with the voice acting in Skyrim. In short, it HAS been expanded.

Holy hell, yes. I found this out by accident, as it were. I showed Skyrim to my brother after playing for a week, then I started up Oblivion to show that to him...and what a difference. I had played Oblivion again with a new character, and the last time I played was like two days before I started Skyrim. I had always considered the graphics and the depiction of nature in Oblivion to be awesome, but after playing Skyrim for less than a week, Skyrim made Oblivion look like a Super Mario Brothers game. The colors were overly saturated, the grass was too obviously a separate object from the ground, textures seemed more primitive, etc...and the faces! Oh God, the faces in Oblivion never looked good, even when I first played the game, but after a few days of Skyrim, Oblivion looks like it's peopled with a bunch of extremely creepy children's dolls.

As for killing children - I believe children should not have been included. But you can't have killing children be included and not expect an epic media [censored] storm.

Pretty much. What they should have done is to make it so they can't witness crimes.

» Fri Dec 16, 2011 6:14 am

Fable III 40 hours
Mass Effect 2 20-30 hours
Dragon Age Origins 40-50 hours
The Witcher II 30-40 hours

Just saying.

I got about 70 hours from Witcher 2 doing all the side quests. You can finish it in 40 hours tho.

» Thu Dec 15, 2011 7:26 pm

*raises fist for punch but stops self* *sighs and shakes head* 70 hours is about 70 times longer then most games no need too make a post about it.

» Fri Dec 16, 2011 7:58 am

Anyway, unlike the OP, where we almost match up in hours, theres a huge ways for me to go to come to any conclusion in the game for me, but I'm one of those players that might stand at a vista admiring the view for 10 minutes so my amount of hours in the game is likely inflated with stuff like staring off on the bluffs somewhere in the game.

Thats how I play too. I cant judge the game in its entirely as I am level 29 and not finished the main quest, but I do know that repetitive things like the same voices used over and over are contributing to my boredom. And the combat system has worn on me, and I have crafted my way through smithing. (At level 90, I didnt power to 100 only to keep me thinking there will be something to do - crafting dragon armor -- which sadly is no better than ebony once the cap is met. I like the way ebony looks better anyway, and getting the ore was more challenging than the stack of dragon parts I have now.)

The best thing about the game is the scenery.

» Fri Dec 16, 2011 4:51 am

*raises fist for punch but stops self* *sighs and shakes head*

Imaginary, virtual e-bullying. Thats exciting and new!

» Thu Dec 15, 2011 7:50 pm

These are the things that should be improved to increase play value (for me):

*The fighting mechanic of hitting escape when things get tough and completely stopping action makes it as much of a strategy game as an action game. There is some diversity of action, and positioning is important, but its a pretty simple system. When compared to a game like Witcher 2, it comes up a bit short. Granted that is not the same kind of role playing game (you are Geralt of Rivia), but the whole mechanic of completely stopping time when you hit escape makes it less engaging. They should have done it like witcher, where going into your menu system slows but not stops time.

This SUPPOSED to be a role playing game not Gods of War, ME2 through out all of its RPG for cool action and it stank

* Production value. The graphics are pretty good, but there are no cinematics or multimedia to enhance the experience. I'm not expecting something as involved and detailed as the Witcher2, but even WOW managed to integrate cinematic scenes into the main questline. If these exist, and I have not seen them, my apologies, but I think there should be more. The game relies solely on its middling graphics and large scope of its world. The rest lives in the imagination of the player.

Middling? These are the best graphics i have ever seen and cinematics are cheap ways to distract people

*Graphics/Character Animations- These are sortof a let down for PC. They should have used DX11 for their flagship platform. It doesnt compare well to other PC titles in this regard. Its not just the graphics, but the simple character animations. My character has such a limited set of actions. Slash left, slash right, overhand power attack, shield bash, walk, run, sprint, magic ball in hand. Geralt of rivia has different kinds of attacks and movements which kept it visually interesting. Combat is quite abstract. I play solely in 3rd person because the first person graphics are so bad in combat.

*Interface- This is probably a result of being a console port, and probably contributes to the simplistic combat system.

*Scaling- This has been discussed ad-infinitum on the forums. I really like scaling for the most part, but there are problems with it. I got Ghost Blade which is a unique item with stats that scale based on the level you get it. Unique items should not scale. When I bust my butt to complete a hard dungeon, I should get an absolute reward. Because of scaling this feeling is absent from the game. There is not a feeling of accomplishment. I like not knowing how powerful enemies are until you start fighting them, but opponents are scaled to your level, not your abiliities, so when you find yourself demolishing opponents, it is more a reflection of your relative strength for your level and how well you did your professions and gear collection. Anyway, while scaling allows the game world to be more open which is good, progression has a very vague feel to it. I think there need to be more areas of absolute difficulty. Not the entirety of the game, just more fights that you attempt only to realize, "I'm not geared for this". And the world should let you know when you are treading in dangerous waters.

*Ability to Abuse Save without Repercussion- I have over 300 saves. I save because I don't want to re run content that I have already done should I die. The game just doesnt feel dangerous because of this. I wish there was a way to limit saves. I know this is not an MMO, just wish there was some negative repercussion for abusing save and reloading. Perhaps skills that were mid-level would regress if you start abusing save. Don't know how they would implement this, but it would be good.

I would not play a game that would not allow me to save or would punish me for saving and i dont have 300 saves.

*Limited voice acting- I think they did everything with five actors. It svcks to hear the same voice over and over in different characters. This really needs to be expanded.

Agreed

*Inabillity to kill everyone- I played a good character through the game, but once that nasty snotty kid in Whiterun came up to me. And kept doing it over and over. This was the only time I wanted to kill an NPC, and the game wouldn't let me. If you have an NPC that taunts the PC, they need to be killable.

*Crafting Limited- The economy and crafting is not as evolved as a game like WOW. I originally thought there was more diversity, but in Smithing you can keep crafting Iron Daggers, which should not give you skill ups. Alchemy system looks better, but I did not use it.

*Broken Economy- I got to a place where I have more gold than I can spend. I have 20K gold now, and generating gold is very easy. I want for nothing. Perhaps they should make some of the late game objectives contingent upon saving gold. Gold only has meaning at low levels.

Did you buy every house, did you buy alchemy ingredients, did you train every single level?

*No classes- There is no incentive to replay as another class type because i can just power level any of the skills until I am level 80 or so. Freedom and flexibility is great at first, but none of the game is off limits depending on my "class". For example in WOW, a priest wouldnt have access to Warlock trainers, and there were class specific items and lore. I took a potion and my warrior faked his way into the mage college. Just didn't feel right. Sure it didn't restrict me, but I would be more compelled to play a mage if I hadn't been able to see it with my warrior.

YOU Make the class, dont make a jack of all trades, have some discipline

I think Skyrim is a really good game (much better than wow), but there is enough repetition that after 3 weeks I feel like I've seen "everything". Because rewards are scaled, the game has a very vague sense of progression. And while the world is grand in scope and beautiful to behold, the combat system and PC graphics are sub-par for 2011-2012. The combat system has a very legacy, well-worn feel to it. Also, I think an open "sandbox" game needs to have more limits on character progression and be better tuned.

I am sure this will be flamed, but these are my opinions, and why I find myself becoming bored after about 70 hours of play. I think its obvious to most who play it that the game has the tools to be much more than it is with better tuning and more attention to detail.

Im not flaming you, im stating my opposite opinion

» Fri Dec 16, 2011 12:24 am

70 hours is nothing, sorry. You haven't experienced enough of the game to make a valid judgement call.

That's like saying "I played World of Warcraft, got to level 4. I'm done. What a stupid game."

Your over-exagerated anologies are overshadowed only by your reading incomprehension...

The entire point is that there isn't much pushing you to play passed that. Sure, some people will log 160+ hours and still trip balls, but I agree with the OP:

TO ME( as in only my opinion):
- Lack of storyline outside the MQ means you feel kinda lost and pointless. There is no "goal", no "end" and no "means. I have had my optimal item set by lvl 21 (archmage robes + Maokai), and by then I had finished both the College of Winterhold's and the Stormcloak's quest line, as well as the MQ. Result? I've been sorta just "exploring" for almost 20 levels with nothing to aim at.

- Lack of quest/dialogue options and actual world impact kills the RP immersion. I cant infuse my character with a personality since there is no place for subtle elements (like speech options to choose or quest-oriented decisions to make), and I seem to be an eternal stranger in the world, even after becomming its hero ("You the new guy bringing mead?" after I become the Harbinger... "If you are into magic you should check the college of winterhold out!" after I am already its arch-mage... etc). I feel more like a generic sellsword/errand boy then a world-saving hero.

- Overall imbalance. I had to reroll my first Character after breaking it on mistake (i chose smithing and chanting without reallizing how powerfull they were). Now on my second toon, a Conjurer/Archer, and already I have been playing god mode for 12 levels. The point at which there is no reason to become stronger is somewhere in the early 30s, i'd almost say "no matter what you play". The game is unable to provide a challenge even in Master difficulty.

Alltogether im happy at the 100ish hours I have gotten out of this game including both characters, I am fully aware that most games will not allow me to play for that long. But the problem is that instead of feeling like I have finished the game, I feel like its just got boring, repetitive and pointless. There is no end. There is no reason to build a stronger character. There is no story to follow or complete. I have no impact on the world, and that world is full of clones from the first three bandits/foresworn I've come across.

Great game, but its one that leaves a bitter taste: there is no feeling of achievement/accomplishement whatsoever, and that, for me, kills the replayability of the game BIG time.

» Fri Dec 16, 2011 7:47 am

P.S. overall, I find the comparison with WoW and the comments that this is not a MMORPG kind of ironic. Thats exactly the problem: this plays as a single player MMO. Which is pointless.

» Fri Dec 16, 2011 6:10 am

It is funny, people talk alot about being finished at 70 to 80 hours. No offense if it took that amount of time a person rushed through it and barely scratched the surface of the game. I am at 140+ hours and just in the middle of the Main Quest and still have loads of faction, side quest and misc quests to go. Every time I finish a couple, I bump into a few more quests. Plus gaining loot and money to craft better gear. Exploring areas to find new dungeons, words for shouts, Dragon Priests, etc...... There is loads to do, but some people do not have the patience for it. Oh well to each his or her own.....

» Thu Dec 15, 2011 6:53 pm

The thing is that now that my character has gained most of her primary fighting abilities, and I have visited about a third of the cities, I feel like I have experienced most of the game.

The problem isn't the game, you just don't know how to play a TES game. I'll give you a pass...you did say it was your first TES game.

Reading some of your other posts however, I hear:

"I dont really consider this a RPG. Its more like a fantasy world simulator."

"I hear what you are saying, you want to run through the game fast, ..."

"Its not really a game you win, but one you spend time with and enjoy."

No offense, but you may want to pay attention to some of your own words.

Also, comparing Skyrim to WoW is a big mistake, especially since you are claiming you're getting bored with repetition. Repetition is an MMO's primary feature. Skyrim is a randomly-generated game compared to a borefest like WoW (or any other MMO).

My advice is that you hit the other 60% of the map. You just might be surprised.

» Fri Dec 16, 2011 8:11 am

ehh this game is as short as you make it. For some reason I hear a lot of noise about people who are new to the series that "finish" the game in 60 hours. Either you need to calm down on playing it so often or you were lured in by false assumptions. A lot of the game has to do with role playing and a lot of the time role playing can be a huge list of things or a short list like simply not fast traveling. Believe it or not but the guy above was correct. A lot of people either dont know how to stretch out the hours in this game or are not the type to do so in the first place

TES doesnt really cater to either. Its all in the journey and if you were expecting constant action and constant twists in plot and geography in something that was advertised as 300+ hour game you were simply fooling yourself. Its a slow paced game best suited for people who dont mind taking things slow

Maybe its just not for you. But at least you got 60 hours

» Fri Dec 16, 2011 6:43 am

You guys keep saying "its about the journey", but the journey to where? The main quest takes about 4 hours to complete... then where are you journeying to? You keep talking about the RP, but this is one of the worst games I have tried so far for roleplay (linear questing, no dialogue option, no personality gauge, no impact on the world, no correlation between what you have done and how NPCs act, etc).

Skyrim is a single player MMO: very little storyline, very little RP, lots of repetitive questing.

» Thu Dec 15, 2011 8:32 pm

* Production value. The graphics are pretty good, but there are no cinematics or multimedia to enhance the experience. I'm not expecting something as involved and detailed as the Witcher2, but even WOW managed to integrate cinematic scenes into the main questline. If these exist, and I have not seen them, my apologies, but I think there should be more. The game relies solely on its middling graphics and large scope of its world. The rest lives in the imagination of the player.

Agreed. Since Bethesda removed the "focus dialog system", I feel NPCs are just murmuring to themselves in conversation.
Cinematic scenes are necessary indeed.

*Graphics/Character Animations- These are sortof a let down for PC. They should have used DX11 for their flagship platform. It doesnt compare well to other PC titles in this regard. Its not just the graphics, but the simple character animations. My character has such a limited set of actions. Slash left, slash right, overhand power attack, shield bash, walk, run, sprint, magic ball in hand. Geralt of rivia has different kinds of attacks and movements which kept it visually interesting. Combat is quite abstract. I play solely in 3rd person because the first person graphics are so bad in combat.

Unfortunately, their goal is to "make Skyrim look the same on all platforms" no matter what.

*Inabillity to kill everyone- I played a good character through the game, but once that nasty snotty kid in Whiterun came up to me. And kept doing it over and over. This was the only time I wanted to kill an NPC, and the game wouldn't let me. If you have an NPC that taunts the PC, they need to be killable.

Totally agreed. However, I believe Bethesda would be in big trouble if they had allowed player to "kill kids" in their game.

» Fri Dec 16, 2011 8:18 am

You're not about done 70 hours in. If so you've rushed like crazy. I'm at 80+ and I just went to see the greybeards. Been so busy with other stuff. The only thing I'm done with is the companions.

» Fri Dec 16, 2011 12:05 am

watever this game is awesome

» Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:09 pm

Mods are going to address most of this, so stay tuned.
It was mods that encouraged me to put 1200 hours into Oblivion where many things needed adjusting, IMO.

» Thu Dec 15, 2011 6:19 pm

You guys keep saying "its about the journey", but the journey to where? The main quest takes about 4 hours to complete... then where are you journeying to? You keep talking about the RP, but this is one of the worst games I have tried so far for roleplay (linear questing, no dialogue option, no personality gauge, no impact on the world, no correlation between what you have done and how NPCs act, etc).

Skyrim is a single player MMO: very little storyline, very little RP, lots of repetitive questing.

Well I guess that settles it. Dont buy another TES. Haven't played much of Skyrim but if its like the last 2 games then the series is not for you. Seems like Mass Effect would be a better option but having played the 2nd one Id choose Skyrim.

» Fri Dec 16, 2011 1:16 am

huh, I recognize your avatar/name, thought you used to complain about other complainer... :unsure2:

anyway, agree with your post to some extends, most of them can be solve by regulate your own play style though. e.g I don't save game when i'm in a dungeon, unless necessary.

» Thu Dec 15, 2011 6:24 pm

Gauging the game in term of hours isn't the best thing, considering every player uses their time in their own way. Besides, it narrows down on quantity over quality. A player that has played 200+ hours is not necessarily more experienced than one who has only played 70+. Their point of view, regardless of the hours played, is still valid.