I'm happily reading Sinder Vevlin's anolysis on http://www.imperial-library.info/fsg/sindervelvinarticle1.shtmlbut their is one question that keeps on popping up in my head: "Why was this poor House discredited for the wrong doings of one of its memeber - be it an important member or not"

The main reason is -according to Mr. Velvin- :
"...The treacherous diplomacy of the subtle House Dagoth, or both. House Dagoth, however, was reviled as oath-breakers for their treachery at Red Mountain."

But the only oath braker that seems to be recorded was Dagoth-Ur and even then that would be an over statement since he was concidered tainted and deluded due to his time left alone in the Red Mountain with the Tools. He was known to be a faithful friend of Lord Nerevar, he helped in the war against Dwemer (this is proven). So he got a bit over protective and took his mission a little bit to much on the litteral side but heck that is not a reason to exterminate a House!

Nevertheless as innocent as the House Dagoth would seem to me, they have clearly turned evil, you just need to play Morrowind to see that (naked maniacs are definitely rated as "baddies"); although as one finds out in reading the Poison Song series they are not evil Dunmers at all but controlled Dunmers, controlled I would believe from none other than Dagoth-Ur himself (blast him!); so we shun these people for a couple of millinaires, however Mr. Ur has bitten the Dust thanks to our favorite hero : The Nerevarine!

Do have have an outcome of these victimes? I grant you that their fate is much less epic than what happened to the Dwemer that just desepaired but the result and curse on the Dagoths is tragic nonetheless! Don't you agree? :shrug:

I think that House Dagoth willingly followed their master. They willingly took the blight upon themselves. They willingly tried to kill the Nerevarine. All I can see is that they are just as guilty as their master.

I agree with you, maybe Dagoth was the only one to break his oath from House Dagoth though. Considering the only people present during the time Nerevar was giving his oath were Alma, Sotha, Vivic, and Dagoth. IMHO.

The Ash Vampires were the Councilors of House Dagoth. As the "Leaders" of the House, you can be assured that they brought the Sixth to it's fall, to its partial rise and then to it's eventual complete destruction.

They broke the oath? Ur didnt break any oath, but would have leapt at the chance to.

He simply found another way to draw power from the Heart.

Well yes, I agree that on first view I thought so two. BUT according to http://www.imperial-library.info/mwbooks/poisonsong.shtml "willingly" is not actually th word. They are sort of Sung into doing whatever Dagoth Ur wants...




This sounds interesting, where did you find this info? I would like to know what was the original hierachy of this House.

Maybe http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Morrowind:House_Dagoth will help.

Lol - I read that piece on Dagoth Ur - and I have made some small corrections - no idea how long the corrections will stand. Mostly I removed unproven speculation and re-introduced some of the writings of Vivec and others in paraphrase ... hope I managed to correct enough that it wil not lead people too far astray now.

It seems fair to say that the Ash Vampires were the surviving senior members of House Dagoth and that House operated on a strongest is the leader policy.

The very best way to learn about all that is to play the game and read the books as you discover them Thing is that if you play the game you can experience Dagoth Ur's 'singing' for yourself = no fiction as that ammendment had suggested.

Whether Poison Song is fiction or documentary - it is clear that it accurately reflected what was happening generally - and given there were skirmishes and the like there would have been leaders of House Dagoth that went turned to guerilla warfare rather than submit to summary execution. The children were absorbed into the other Great Houses and I have no doubt that in his own good time Dagoth Ur reached out to them and brought them one-by-one to Red Mountain

Well, after the MQ is over, the sleepers can be awakened from their trance with a simple conversation. The dreamers just babble about the path being dark or something. So at least for the modern dunmer under his control, I'd say mind control, with dreamers having gone over to the crazy side of the force.

A.. yeha Isee now what you meant. The thing is that I was more curious hwo it was before Dagoth corrupted his whole house... guess we will never know.

All that I have to sau about the UESP is that the part where they speculate that could have cheated both the Dwemer and the Chimer is wrong, we know that Dagoth was with Nerevar (them being buddies an'all) when they sliped past the dwarven armies and appropriated themselves with the Kragenac's Tools therfore implying that the could not have been any act of treachery on behave of the Sixth House... So why they were aliterated we probably never know aswell...

I seem to remember the bit you refer to Oborrowind, but other accounts tell different tales - so what we do here is play games with ideas.

If someone comes to me tomorrow and says the dev who whote it all (was several devs seemingly) says just this one thing is true I will still wonder ... maybe the Dev is just playing games plus once you have sold something to the people then what counts is what they believe as a consequence of what you have written rather than what you think you wrote -except in your bio or memoires