I read a thread a while back saying that the institute didn't seem bad, just wanted to advance technology for mankind. Can't find the thread.

But having played this game through on different factions and seeing what the institute was about. I'm sorry but:

1) First and foremost how does making synths help mankind? I mean they already made coursors at least 50 years prior to the start of this game, what exactly is their end goal?

Wouldn't helping reverse the effects of radiation in ghouls and supermutants or research into radiation free food production help a lot more than making synthetic humans?

2) They kidnap real people and replace them with Synths. How does that help mankind? You kill the actual human, download the memories but those can be altered and deleted? Sounds more like that movie invasion of the body snatchers....

3) Assuming you believe Synths are superior AI than humans and that humans deserve to be replaced. How so when synths can be turned off, reprogrammed, and forced to remain at the institute? That's slavery without free will.

4) They kill whomever gets in their way. Whilst protecting oneself is important in such a vicious world but how does killing and kidnapping entire families seem ok? The end most certainly doesn't not justify the means, not at least when it's about making synthetic humans.

Seems like the institute is like Nazi Germany. Brotherhood of Steel is like George Bush invading Iraq, gungho and self righteous but causing more problems than good. Railroad is hmm, like Green Peace, passionate and willing to die for a cause that's well not really that important? Minutemen seem like the only good guys here.......

They are actively researching rad free food, the warwick homestead is set up for that.

That is normally part of their research, and it is mostly because they are forced to do it in secret. Again, the warwick place, they replaced the head family member so they could do the research. Probably because if they rolled up and asked they would get shot, they are forced to do it in secret, which means unfortunately replacing people. Just so you know, their end goal isn't kidnapping people, that is just an unfortunate necessity.

Every synth, when killed, has a synth component. That is probably the reason they can be shutdown and reprogrammed. If you had a microchip planted into your brain that could control all electrical activity you would have as much free will as a synth.

Agree on this one, killing people should definitely be a last resort, but then again apart from the tiny amount of settlements in this game, almost everything else will kill you outright too, so the institute can be no less evil than raiders, the gunners, random scavengers, feral ghouls, supermutants, deathclaws etc..

The institutes plans to help humanity are long term. They don't necessarily want to protect the current humans alive on the surface, but make sure eventually humanity will be restored to some kind of prewar civilised society, instead of the 200+ years of anarchy and chaos that is the wasteland.

1.) Synths are meant to do the dirty work for the humans. They are workers and soldiers. Of course they view the average wastelander as little more than vermin crawling on the surface. If they wanted to then they could drasticly improve many lives without exposing themselves too much.

2.) The replace poeple for three reasons. The Mayor of Diamant City for example keeps an eye on stuff that happens in CW (reason one) and manipulates the people to the advantage of the Institute (reason two). The Institute also likes to experiment on the surface and likes to kidnap people for sience (reason three). To sum it all up: They want to do whatever they want.

3.) I don't think they want to replace humans but they don't think much of people outside the Institute.

4.) Yep they are evil but more in the way of not caring what happens to these people. They don't hate the people they replace or kill. The BOS is much closer to Nazi Germany with their hate for "abominations" and their invasion of the CW.

Also, rember that relatively early on in their quest chain, you're told that you're heir as the Institute's Director. Meaning you can shift policy however you want.

Granted, you probably can't do too much too soon, but the point is, the Institute has gone off the rails to a degree when you finally meet up with them. You can then (theoretically) work to get them back on the ethical track, or turn them into a dictatorship over the Commonwealth.

The question then becomes, is the Institute worth saluaging?

Actually this is an interesting points

Actually interesting you bring this up. That last speech we're asked to draw up with the institute before we win with that fraction. Anyone ever check if there's a difference after depending on if you sound nice in the speech or put in lines that sound like a total dictator?

Well Piper writes her paper on her looming optimism for The Institute's future with the Commonwealth, and how they might just be able to change and do good after all.

The institute has places zero value on the folks living on the surface. Shauns speech made that eminently clear after I let the four synths go, that he sent me after.

After all, if they are indistinguishable from humans, why should they NOT have all the same rights?

They are evil. Sometimes very intelligent people can go forth with logical but bad ideas. For example, in the early 1900's many/most leading scientists, doctors, and other thought leaders were on board with the eugenics movement. There is certainly some logic to wanting to remove birth defects and other congenital problems from the human population but their methods of involuntary sterilization are chilling to think about.

The Institute folks have deluded themselves that free willed creatures, albeit created by them, are just machines. Even worse than the eugenics movements, its a delusion simply born of convenience and greed (for an easy pampered life). I'd rate the BOS and RR as grey organizations and the Institute as the true evil organization in the game.

The problem is not "evil" per se, but that the three major factions (BoS, RR, and Instutute) all subscribe to an "end justifies the means" mentality. The Minutemen have their own problems, at least with regard to synths, but tend to be more in line with the traditional good guys/bad guys view, so are probably the least offensive. For them at least, the "bad guys" are the kinds of creatures/people that most of us would call "bad guys" in real life. But all four subscribe to the idea that if they can't convince you, then killing you is the appropriate solution. Of course the game pretty much assumes Hobbes' state of nature as interpreted by the developers, so

Might makes right as far as everyone is concerned.

The road to hell is paved with best intentions. I don't see them as very evil, but compared to the BoS (who are seemingly malleable and fully aware of the realities of the wasteland), the Institute is out of touch with reality.

The value of human life in the wasteland matters very little to the Institute. Much of the hate directed at them is well earned.


Although the Institute uses a cloak and dagger approach they seem very much like the Enclave.

The reason to opt for institute is because you get to take over, not because it's good or evil currently. They're just isolationist to a flaw, with a bit of a twist in that they still muck with the outside world via synth agents and a select few humans.

Once you have leadership, you'd presumably be able to steer it a more sensible direction - like not making the wasteland completely hate your organization to the point that it becomes a serious problem for your organization.

Many of their decisions are bad and stem from either ignorance or just... well some things aren't really explainable and feel more like contrived plot devices than clearly motivated actions. Father is a warped character - maybe life in a giant dentist office does that to you. But unlike the Railroad and Minutemen the faction actually has the competency to repair things - they're just not using it - so if you factor in your new leadership they become the obvious choice of who to side with. BoS is competent and powerful too, but messed up in their own way and you don't get to become leader to steer in a wiser direction. Plus, BoS is more military focused, the institute has scientists more capable of positive changes.

A man who gives up his humanity to save humanity dooms himself to fail - institute in a nutshell.

The problem I had with the Institute was more the writers' fault in that I couldnt really deduce what their supposed great plan for the future was with any clarity. Just a lot of Father pontificating but no specifics. Since at the time I didn't know I'd get to take over I just got sick of them.

They don't have a "great " plan for the future.

They think everything on the surface is a lost cause , so they think them surviving (an elite of scientist living underground) is saving mankind.

Their plan is to get better ressources , keep on digging underground , keep on doing SCIENCE! etc..

Basically they want to survive and nothing else ,like everyone else.

Father just wrap the whole thing in some weird elitist nonsense , so people think they have some great project or something but nope.

The biggest problem with all the factions is, rising through their ranks, you don't gain in influence. You can only board the train for a ride to an unknown, but pre made destination. As it stands, I have my difficulties with all the factions. Apart from the fact that I can't really figure out what the institute ultimately wants to achieve, since I only get little bits of the puzzle. Not enough to make an informed decision. The BOS is easier. They're bigots and want to get rid of everything not entirely human. Railroad? Only about Synths, or so it seems. Only the minutemen don't seem to stand for the big changes. But that's because they don't seem to have any goal, apart from expanding anyway.

But, and I realize, this has been said in different threads, you can't influence any decision making. Te outcome is written in stone when you choose a faction.

The Institute is evil. Shaun even said it himself when he visited the roof of the CIT building, that the world above ground is dead and The Institute is the future. It is clear they only look after their own and view all others as expendable. They kidnap others and replace them with synths to serve their goals. Whoever wrote that thread that The Institute isn't evil was not paying very well attention to their nature.