Let's first assume the obvious, that the Septim line truly IS killed off and there are no successors left. How then shall the next Emperor be chosen?

While I know the Elder Council can lead the empire in an Emperor's absence, is the Empire not a monarchy? I don't really know the system of government very well but from what I've seen the Emperor is the highest authority and there is no going above him, so correct me on this point if I am wrong.


So the real question I have is, if the Emperor is indeed the highest authority, and there is no further heir of the current dynasty, then I can't really see how the Elder Council would have jurisdiction to choose a new Emperor. So what happens now is the big question? I personally feel many "contenders" for the Imperial Throne will arise, many probably within the Elder Council itself. The rivalry between potential successors will escalate to some level of conflict, possibly even including all out war.


I'm curious to see speculation or information pertaining to what most likely will occur with the death of the Septim line... has this sort of thing happened before?

I suppose it works like the ancient Nordic moot...well, we all know how successful that was...

I wouldn't be surprised if Ocato assumed the role to himself. There's a chance that they'll try a democratic election, but why would the elder council do that when they can name anyone they want as a Emperor?

Yes. Some guy [censored] a hill and a new Emperor was born. True story.

Ocato doesn't have forces personally loyal to him, the way the Blades are. We may see a situation similar to our own late Roman Empire: power in the streets for someone to pick up, as long as he has legions at his command.

Varus Vantinius for the win!!!

The Elder Council holds the authority to choose the Emperor (and a great deal of power even while the Emperor is alive), and has exercised it against the heir apparent before.

The direct Septim bloodline was extinct long ago, and with Martin's transfiguration, there is nobody left whom anybody could call a Septim and keep a straight face.
So I would expect a more or less prolonged contest of power within the Elder Council, and maybe an attempted or successful intervention by the Blades (much as the Pretorian Guard was often instrumental in seating a new Emperor in Rome), a popular noble such as Narina Carvain, or even a strong provincial such as Helseth.

The families with proper ancestry reside primarily in the Colovian West, and the Elder Council chooses from their number.

Now that the "official" branch of the Septim bloodline is spent, I have considered two potential heirs:

Hjalti Early-Beard & His Descendants
According to The Arcturian Heresy, Tiber Septim was a Nord by the name of Hjalti Early-Beard. It is possible that he may have descendants up in Skyrim who can trace their ties to Tiber Septim, if this claim is indeed true. If it isn't, well, it may still be worth looking into if the Empire has no other good leads.

King Lysandus & His Son King Gothryd
King Lysandus died before the events of Daggerfall. However, one of the Underking's agents during the Main Quest says, "not even death can hide a true descendant of Tiber Septim from the Underking". This refers to Lysandus. Now, it may just have some other metaphorical meaning, but I doubt it, seeing how the Underking was (at least partially) Zurin Arctus, Tiber Septim's Imperial Battlemage. I doubt he would have reason to lie about this sort of thing. Who knows? Maybe Tiber Septim had a bastard child, whose descendants fathered Lysandus - a child whom only Tiber Septim's closest allies, including Zurin, would know of.

King Lysandus' bloodline lives on through his son, King Gothryd of Daggerfall. At the time of the writing of the 3rd Edition Pocket Guide to the Empire, I believe it makes a remark somewhere that him and his spouse, Queen Aubk-i, are still alive and beloved in their kingdom.

Or they can choose totally different bloodline.

These are good points, but it hit me today: what if the Council chooses an emperor but most of the provinces don't accept him? Maybe even many of Cyrodiil's inhabitants will be divided. Are the people of Tamriel willing to go to war over the succession? Could it be that at the end of the Third Era, it will never be business as usual again? Too soon to tell, of course.

Well we know one thing for sure, the fact that Cyrodill currently doesn't have a true emperor is going to cause problems in the future. And we're likely going to see these problems in the next Elder Scrolls game.

No they can't. Tamriel accepts the legitimacy of the Emperor because each of the three dynasties had some fantastic, divine origin. When that influence is lost, all you have a weak capital with an Emperor whose authority is in constant decay because the provinces are too independent. Tamriel hasn't been Cyrodiilicized, not matter what PGE 3 makes it sound like.

My guess would be in a situation like that, most people in power wouldnt want to be an Indian when they can be a chief. Everyone would want to be emperor or put who they want in charge, a figure head.

This could cause the Empire to completely dissolve. Oblivion made it seem as if every province simply wanted to keep to themselves, and handle there own problems.



History has shown that rulers aren't above fabrications claiming to be of divine orgin. A crafty man like Helseth could come up with something.

It would have to be quite a something to compare with the real thing. Tiber Septim tricked his way to heaven, but he was no clever charlatan.

There are certain aspects to the world where myth becomes more then just fabrication. To Dagoth Ur and Vivec the dynamic invincibility of the Emperor and the Empire are very real. At a small scale it might go unnoticed but the world was created from the conflict between two beings. The et'Ada are reflections of this conflict and in a sense their existence maps out the shape of the conflict, they gain power from it.

This principle doesn't just apply to the et'Ada but to everything in the Aurbis. You can compare it behind the idea of symbolism, by representing something as an symbol that symbol gains some or all its properties. It's what you could call, proper magic.

http://www.imperial-library.info/dfbooks/b055_lightdark.shtml

isn't that usually when there is more than one person who has a semi-legitimate claim, like the who;le Wolf Queen thing?

I both think and hope we'll get a civil war as minor lordlings from every province, Cyrodiil to Morrowind to Valenwood, each tries to get the big job. Helseth definitely wouldn't mind getting that Title, I think the camorans miss having as much power as they used to, and let's face it, half the accidental children of hokers in the Imperial City are probably Uriels.

This is gonna be fun.

Well there is one that isn't, the first thing Sevrin did was try to wear the amulet, so he knows that his daddy isn't Uriel, event though he could be anyone elses bastard for all anyone can tell.

On a serious note it would fit with the rumor that V will be in Skyrim for the theory of Tiber Septim's nordic origins.

Like the Tsaesci Potentates? I know, they actually didn't have the title, but they ruled the Empire for a long time, why couldn't they just choose the "wrong" emperor?

And without the Amulet of Kings, the principal reinforcement of this divine legitimacy, the future is even more uncertain.

I still agree with MK. The only real emperor would be the result of a hill[censored].

Or perhaps Alessia will appear in the form of a Sheep or something, or even a Mudcrab, and add a new dimension to Oblivion rumors.

If Bethesda still follows Ted Peterson's interpretation of Helseth, he will not be interested in trying for the Ruby Throne; Helseth's focus is on consolidating and keeping power in Morrowind. We could well see something like Japan's Sengoku Jidai period, a free-for-all until a charismatic warlord or two manage to make everyone else knuckle under. If there is anarchy in the meantime, it could last generations.

It will be interesting to see how Bethesda handles this. Will TES V start decades after the fall of the Septims, or only several years later? Will the player character help the would-be emperor, or oppose him? I think it would be lame for the player to try for the throne himself, but that's my opinion.

It's lame and cliche' as Hell. That kind of self-importance may have worked in Knights of the Old Republic, and to a lesser degree, Morrowind, but the Elder Scrolls hero should be an anonymous and mysterious agent not publicly tied in any overt way to the big political movers and shakers.

I wouldn't mind there being a new Emperor or Emperor to Be in the next game, but if the player interacts with him at all it should be as an errand boy, and not even to the extent you were an errand boy to Martin in TES IV, but on a far less personal scale.

Agreed, I think after Oblivion people are tired of being forced be an Imperial Lapdog. In Morrowind you were largely left with the choice to either follow the Empire or just simply tolerate it. Oblivion tried too much to make the Empire the ultimate in good and righteousness, although this is somewhat justified as any empire will have the highest support for it in it's heartland. I'd like to see a more dynamic ability to affect the story, like in Daggerfall where you had multiple endings, or even in Morrowind where you could choose whether or not you wished to kill the Tribunal.

By that note, agents such as the Tribunal and Nerervarine could make a claim to imperial throne by proxy of having "divine origins" although this is unrealistic as I doubt any of them would have a desire to ascend such a throne (only Dagoth Ur really had such a vision), and after Lorkhan's Heart being destroyed their divinity is pretty much fading out.


The real question I have that I couldn't fully understand is that while Martin's sacrifice closed back the jaws of Oblivion, what now enforces the magical barrier between Nirn and the realms of Oblivion? Is it Martin's Soul that now stands as a monument in the Temple of the One? I really am unsure what protections are there.....

I would like to see a more tumultuous climate in the next TES, so placing it not long after the events in Oblivion is fine with me, like just a few years or so. I'd like to see a lot of conflict arise due to the lack of an heir to the Imperial Throne, but not from a front-seat view, I like the events of the Imperial Government to play out in the background and not be the primary focus for the game.

What if Calaxes had a son?