I mean when it comes to food, drink, sleep, getting shot in the head etc...

I would at least like to have some kind of realistic hardcoe Difficulty.

Thoughts?

EDIT: I am sure it is possible to get some balance there, realistic headshots for example, we are not (at least i am not) talking about Arma 3 or Stalker Misery Mod level of realism.

Well, it's an RPG so at least combat should not be insanely realistic.

I'd like to see some kind of primary needs mode myself, but I'm not expecting it.

I do hope any thing like needing to drink, eat and sleep is in, but only if it is like FNV hardcoe mode. I dont want to be forced to play yet another survival game or such crap, but rather have the ability to switch such elements on and of at will.

Puzzling statement.

I know combat in RPGs has traditionally been far from realistic (and I think technological limitations and the devs not knowing any better have both played a role in that) but you specifically say that because it's an RPG combat should not be realistic. I wonder what makes you think that. Is your assumption that more realistic combat would preclude people from roleplaying? If so, why would that be the case?

Fallout really is the only open world shooter thats every done it right? In this style? So hasn't Beth really 'set the standard' for 1st-3rd person RPG's in an open world? Thats just getting down to the specific of it haha.

I just hope they have a hardcoe mode that requires food and drink and whatnot. Invariably it will not be hard enough but there are mods to fix that.

Might be looking at it from the standpoint "RPG combat - abstracted systems somewhat based on character skill rather than player skill" as opposed to a realistic sim style combat system running off player skill (with annoying comments from modern-military-shooter fans wondering why a shot to the head doesn't kill someone instantly, ignoring things like level/toughness perks/hitpoints)

...of course, I've seen tabletop RPG systems that tried to go the ultra-realistic route with combat & damage. It was horrible to play, because every combat action took piles of tables & rolls to get through, and recovering from damage after combat was an amazing pain that made one want to avoid combat entirely..... not good in a genre where you want to have Amazing Adventures, Beat Things Up, and Take Their Stuff.

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on the main topic - I don't see any reason why they wouldn't/couldn't have included Fallout:NV's "hardcoe" mode. I just wish it would be called something like "survival" or "simulation" mode, since the "insert food/water/sleep when the gauge says to" Tedium System never struck me as particularly "hardcoe". Not that I think much of the term to start with, seems like it's mainly just used as an emotional prop for some gamers to try to lord their supposed superiority over other gamers. Or maybe I've just seen too many "hardcoe vs casual" argument threads in places like the WoW forums.

edit: oh, right - personally, I hope the game is no more "realistic" than Fallout 3. I play games for fun, not tedious simulation and/or frustration.

Indeed. I never understood why people want realistic combat in RPGs. That often makes character skills pointless and player skills dominant, destroying lot of the point of an RPG.

So realistic, in fact, if you die in-game, a mysterious stranger will show up at your front doorstep and shoot you dead in real life.

How do you feel about playing now????

I disagree. RPGs can have elements of realism, and I'm talking from the perspective of a tabletop RPG gamer, which is where all this modern RPG gaming is derived from.

That being said, if Beth includes this stuff (which I doubt they will) it should be an option, not mandatory / forced. I believe Beth already knows all of this though, people have been asking for this stuff for ages.

Well this is what i would like too. I just think that Fallout 4 should try to make both types of players (those who like realism and those who don't) happy with the gameplay. So far players like me who likes "realism" always had to wait for mods to come out.

And I suspect you'll still have to wait for mods; the plans to bring mods to the console platforms will only exacerbate this.

I think that would be a very costly feature for Bethesda

rpgs (at least in video games) are traditionally very anchored in stats, every enemy has HP, every weapon you wield has a damage figure, etc and this creates situations where these stats causes unrealistic combat results.

I am sure it is possible to get some balance there, realistic headshots for example, we are not (at least i am not) talking about Arma 3 or Stalker Misery Mod level of realism.

I'd keep realistic headshots out of RPGs. Damage could however still be adjusted, like double from headshots.

There will likely be optional food and water needs. Why do I think this? Go look at the information at the top of the screen during the building info. It mirrors the info in Fallout Shelter food, water, etc. Also the reason they led with Fallout Shelter. It is very similar to the way you grow your community in Fallout 4.

I loved the hardcoe mode on NV but even that was easy. The game still provides so much resources.
I mean even random sprites in the game carry a considerable amount of loot.
If you go to any slum every morning the sprites there sip on a nuka and chew on an Iguana on a stick.

It definitely shouldn't be realistic when it comes to getting shot. If it were, the first time we got shot we'd be dead or seriously injured the rest of the game.

We can fly around with a jetpack when inside a heavy power armor and wielding a heavy minigun. Fallout 4 is hardly going to be realistic.

If anything realism would clash with cartoony stuff like this^ and create a strange juxtaposition.

One moment it tries to be realistic. Next? Rocket trusters on an old wooden naval ship.

Ok, this is interesting, thanks for the information.

Those are probably only for the settlement, though, not the player. That is, you have to place water spigots and plant farm goods for your settlers to have food and drink. But the player (again, presumably) does not have to personally monitor her own. That said, yes, I would be content with a hardcoe mode that required you to eat / drink periodically. I never really got into that kind of gameplay myself, but when I was thinking about it, and looking over the differences I'd face, I realized that, oh, I would actually have to consider getting radiation poisoning from drinking from random wilderness water pools, and the pristine pre-war bottled water started to look a LOT more valuable.

Thank you for those insights Kiralyn.

Personally, I think that those 'abstract systems somewhat based on character skill' work best in the somewhat abstract environment of table-top RPGs.

The moment you create a 3D environment and give the player the agency to freely move around and freely aim his attacks, there is going to be a clash between player skill and character skill. For example, take Morrowind: the chances of my character blocking an attack are determined by dice-rolls, yes, but I can nonetheless move backwards when I see an attack coming. This results in my character dodging pretty much any melee attack because of my skill as a player and not because of his skill as a character.

The moment you represent the way your character attacks his opponents by creating attack animations, there is going to be a clash between how skilled your character is supposed to be and how skilled he actually looks. Take the attack animations in Skyrim: it doesn't matter if my character is a novice at one-handed weapons or a master, he still attacks in the exact same (incompetent) way. In table-top RPG I can pretend that my master swordman character attacks like a master swordman would because I don't see him attacking; in modern RPG videogames I don't have that option anymore because I get to see how his attacks are performed.

To be frank, I don't dislike tabletop RPG mechanics; I think they have depth and invite planning and strategy. However, I do believe that bringing them to modern videogames where the player controls his character and combat occurs in real time is doing those RPG mechanics a disservice; simply put, they are brought into an environment where they can't shine. That may be the reason why action RPG are becoming increasingly popular: they use RPG mechanics but in a way that doesn't clash against player skill.

Realistic combat means, no stimpaks, radaway, or rad-x. Crippling injuries are hospital stays measured in weeks or months (assuming you get to a hospital before you bleed out). Amputations. Permanent disfigurement. No saves.