» Wed Mar 09, 2011 10:30 am CURRENCY
I think if a big part of this game is going to be a Civil War within Skyrim where half the population and towns are trying to stay with the Empire and the other half is trying to secede and become an independent Nation then it would make sense to have two currencies.
Septims could remain the currency for the cities and towns wishing to stay with the Empire and the other currency (Drakes for instance) could be for the other cities and towns wishing to secede.
I'm not sure if this is possible for modders to do but it would definitely make things interesting.
You the player could build up a fortune in Septims only to travel to the other side of Skyrim to another city that is trying to secede from the Empire and uses the other currency and you find out your Septims are worth less than nothing there.
There of course would have to be some sort of median in place so why not make it Gems and Gold/Silver Nuggets/Ingots?
You could trade in your fortune in Septims for rare gems like Diamonds, Rubies, etc.... and then travel to the other cities and your fortune stays intact for the most part. It would make finding rare gems in dungeons worth the find since they are valuable everywhere.
The better disposition you have with the NPC your trading your Septims to for gems the better deal you get and the same way when you get to the other city trading your gems in for the other currency they use in the non Empire cities and settlements.
I just think there needs to be something more now in Skyrim 'concerning economy' than there was in Oblivion and a lot of modders out there apparently felt the same since there are a ton of fixed economy mods for the game now.
There definitely needs to be a better balance for gems and gold/silver nuggets (if they even include them again that is). In Oblivion you'd collect flawless gems and they weren't even all that valuable. Again Mods fixed this but I hope its not broken to begin with in Skyrim.
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=4826
Whats the point of having this rare diamond as loot if its worth less than nothing like it was in Oblivion?
Thank God for all the Mods that balanced it out in the end like Living Economy (http://www.tesnexus....ile.php?id=4432) and Fixed Gems (http://www.tesnexus....ile.php?id=4826).
BANKS
Another idea is to include Banks like modders did for Oblivion in every major city which in turn allows the player to directly affect the economy in that city.
Banks with X amount of money in them in each city could be considered good and thus the economy in that city is considered good and banks with less than X amount are not and the economy in that city reflects that.
Different cities depending on size could have larger or smaller banks and X amount of money needed by the banks in each city to help the economy will be different one city to another and one bank to another.
The more you invest/store in that bank could help the entire city and affect what the Merchants in that city sell and the quality of their goods.
If the Bank in a city has a lot of money stored in it (X or above)then the merchants in that city could all sell better items/clothing/weapons/armor/potions/soulgems/furniture etc... and the Npc's could all reflect this by wearing better clothing and having better gear and furniture in their houses with better loot for all the Thieves out there.
If that cities Bank is broke then the opposite happens.
Banks could start off with a set amount as far as how much money/loot is stored in each bank in each city and then from that point on its up to you the player.
You should be able to rob the banks in each city but if you do you might kill the economy in that city and directly affect what the merchants sell there. It should be up to you the player to decide.
You could rob a bank in one city and then take the money to another city and invest it there and make the other city rich and make your home there.
If you rob a bank in one city that has a different currency than the city your trying to invest the stolen money in then you would need to find vendors that sell gems/gold and silver nuggets,etc... to convert the currency you have (Septims) to the other Currency.
For example if I decide to rob the local cities bank which is still with the Empire so I know the bank will have Septims then I know that by doing this when its all said and done the vendors in this city are going to be broke (if I take all the Septims that is) and sell less valuable items until I invest the stolen money back into the bank.
The NPCs in this city all have decent clothes/jewelry/weapons/Furniture etc... so I can expect to rob a decent amount if I choose to. I do so. Now I want to make the city where I own my house rich but that city deals in Drakes and not Septims because they are no longer with the Empire. I go to the local merchant hoping to trade my Septims for Gems but the merchant is broke (because I robbed the bank) and only has a few paltry flawed gems for sale. Not only that but I have a bad disposition with the merchant AND he is already trying to ask ridiculous amounts for his crappy gems to begin with since he needs the money. I have to find another city that has a decent Economy/Bank and that also deals in Septims so I can trade these Septims in for gems and then go back to my city to trade the gems in for Drakes and then invest those in my bank in my city to make the economy better and have merchants in that city sell better stuff for better prices.
Things to consider:
The more money a bank has in a city the more guards/traps it could have and the guards could have better gear so you better be prepared to rob it. If you get caught you disposition with EVERY merchant in that city could instantly drops to 0 and the fine should be heavier (time in jail).
If you rob a bank you could leave it completely broke or not. Its up to you.
If you rob a bank then the merchants would no longer sell quality stuff depending on how much you take so you need to decide just how much your going to take.
If you leave a bank broke prices should sky rocket in that city for meager goods. Having a good disposition with individual merchants can help out as far as prices go but there would be less stuff available from merchants and lower quality with higher prices.
You could break into a bank and leave money if you want to (for the challenge I suppose) or you could simply invest it with the NPC's at the bank.
If you break into a bank and leave Septims knowing that the currency in that city is Drakes then you messed up. Your Septims will just sit there unnoticed and should not have any effect on the economy in that city. You'd have to break back into the bank again to get them out again.
Items could also be stored in banks by NPCs (for security) as well as money so the better the economy in that city the better items/gear NPCs have and the better the chance they will store them in the bank there.
If a bank in a city is broke the NPCs could have what better items they carry on them and will not store them in the bank. If your trying to get that sword of awesomeness from that NPC and he has it on him then he will most certainly use it on you. If he has it in the bank for safekeeping since the economy is good in that city then its just there waiting for you to try and take it.
NPC's should only store items in banks if the economy is good in the city they live in.
You the player cannot store items in banks unless the economy is good as well.
If you bankrupt a city then only you could recover it.
PS- Modders again have already added Banks to Oblivion
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=3172
and
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=26352
and
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=3402
to name a few.
THIEVES GUILD
Certain Thieves Guild quests could require you to completely break a cities economy by robbing a certain bank blind in order to complete the quest. If you want to be considered a Master Thief and complete the Guilds storyline you could have to have robbed EVERY bank in every city blind.
In order to prove you robbed the bank you should have to turn over every penny to the Thieves Guild so no robbing the bank to complete the story then taking the money back. The money is gone once you hand it over. Congrats your a Master Thief and every city is broke and has only crap to sell but the Thieves Guild is booming and the gear you have access to there now for thieves is the best.
Now you have to go recover the economy .... or not, its up to you.
DUNGEONS
You could still find better items,weapons,armor etc... in dungeons even if you cant get it from merchants so you could avoid the economy part altogether and still complete the main storyline if that's the way you choose to do things.
If a Dungeon is within a certain zone or area that a city is that deals in Septims then money found in it will mostly be Septims (not always, just mostly) and vice verse.
SETTLEMENTS
Settlements unlike cities should NOT have banks.
Settlements could have ties to specific cities though.
If the City that the Settlement is tied to has a good bank/economy and that cities currency is Septims and they are for the Empire then the Settlement with ties to that city will also deal in Septims and be for the Empire. Each city/settlement could have flags showing whether they are for/against the Empire to keep it less confusing for the player.
If the cities economy/bank is bad because you destroyed it then the settlements with ties to it could automatically shift to using the opposite currency and be against the Empire.This way the player could decide each Settlements allegiances and currency by dictating the cities its ties are with economic fate or prosperity.
Each Settlement has a Cash Crop (Lumber/Wheat,etc...) that can be sabotaged just like Bethesda has already announced.
Just like banks do with cities each settlements economy could be dictated by how good or bad they are doing with their cash crop and whether or not you the player sabotaged their Mill, Lumber yard,etc...
Merchants in the settlements could also reflect this (good or bad) with what items they sell and the quality of the items as well as price.
If you the player get caught destroying a settlements source of income (Mill or what have you) then just like cities and banks your disposition with every merchant in that settlement could reset to 0 and you get time in jail and fined.
NPC's
NPC's should not be able to rob banks but they should be able to attempt to rob you the player or your house if you have a terrible disposition with them. This has been mentioned in a lot of other threads I know but I agree with it.
NPCs should also be able to rob each other. I'm sure this would create many hilarious and wtf moments during game play.
If NPC's get caught by the guards then rather having the guards just kill them they haul them off to jail where they can be visited and made fun of or where you can try to assist and break them out or rob their house while they are locked up.
NPC's shouldn't be able to give quests while they are locked up so you could try to break them out of jail.
It would be fun to piss off some NPC enough that he tries to rob me but I call the guards and he gets busted then I go rob him while he is locked up/put on his finest clothes and armor and then go visit him locked up only to realize he gives a quest I want so I break him out.
If a cities economy is good then there would be more guards patrolling the streets and crime would be a lot less and the opposite if it is bad...less guards and more crime.
You could hire guards to guard your house against thieves.
You could also better equip your guards for your home with better magic/weapons/armor and magically seal doors and chests and display cases against thieves that cant be opened except by you if this type of game play is something you'd rather avoid.
Having NPC's as companions and being able to outfit them and give them orders also exists in Oblivion thanks to some really awesome mods out there so I don't see a problem doing it in Skyrim with guards/Check out:
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=7819 and this mod has endless add on mods as well for different companions and commands for them.
DRAGONS
Dragons could have lairs/caves with loot in them and of course bones bones and more bones.
If a dragon randomly attacks a city or settlement it could lower the economy there since money was needed for all the repairs for the damage it did. This has also been mentioned in many threads. Has this been officially confirmed or something?
All the more reason to hunt down and kill as many dragons as possible.
TRAVELING MERCHANTS
Have merchants that all they do is travel from one Settlement and City to another and buy and sell the best quality items they can get a hold of. These merchants should also have stockpiles of rare and 1 of a kind items which makes finding and doing business with them fun.
Give them Wagons and bodyguards in case they are attacked by bandits and allow them to try to hire the player to protect them as well. If they are attacked the Merchant could auto make a run for the closest settlement or city while the guards he has hired buy time for him/her by attacking while they flee. If the Merchant makes it then guards could appear until the threat has been eliminated.
If the Merchant doesn't make it you could find the corpse to get the keys to the chests on the wagon and eliminate whatever eliminated the fleeing merchant to do so. Then you could head back to the wagon and kill off whatever remaining bandits there may be but if you try to open the chests on the wagon you should be instantly attacked by whatever remaining bodyguards the merchant had and some could try to flee to a city/settlement to report you.
If the merchant lives he takes all the bandits gear and money and items to sell.
If a merchant is attacked by a dragon he could just ride off into the sunset with his wagon leaving his bodyguards and you the player to die horribly.
TREASURE
Shouldn't a vast hoard of treasure actually look like it?
Display cases were nice but Oblivion lacked really being able to show off your wealth the way I wanted.
Some great Mods out there helped this like:
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=16430
and
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=7452
I hope Skyrim either includes or gives modders the tools to let the players show off their collected wealth.
Gold and silver statues, gold and silver chests, stackable gold, etc...
Ive heard people say before that stacking gold in Oblivion was possible with Mods but if you did it to much it would crash your system so I used the gold coin bagger mod to make sacks of gold that could be placed anywhere and it did a lot to help make my treasure room actually look like one.
I hope modders out there this time around also make some gold and silver gem encrusted treasure chests as well instead of just the plain ugly dull ones found in Oblivion.
HOUSES
Not to worried about this one since there are a million house mods for Oblivion and this will probably be the same for Skyrim but I think the BIGGER homes/castles/keeps/towers should play like the Frostcrag Reborn mod http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=9769 that had quests built into them.
You buy your new house only to discover there is a hidden vault/dungeon somewhere within and you have to find the hidden passages that lead to the dungeon that leads to the vault kinda thing.
Frostcrag Reborn was A LOT of fun.
DISPOSITION
In Oblivion you could go to whatever merchant you wanted to and bribe then so many times and the disposition would be maxed. How is that fun?
Why not instead only be able to bribe merchants up to HALF if the economy/bank in the city is bad and in settlements if the cash crop in that settlement is bad.
If its good then you could bribe to full BUT rather than have merchants being bribed with money have each merchant only be able to be bribed with specific items they want instead.
For example if a merchant that specializes in alchemy really wants Ninroot then he can be bribed with Ninroot. You get the idea.
Also why not have merchants only sell their better items to you only if they have a higher disposition towards you.
If you bribe the above merchant with X amount of Ninroot then he will then start to like you and offer you better alchemy apparatus.
I think this would be a lot more immerse than just going to whatever merchant and bribe 10 times then your done and be able to buy everything from the get go w/o ever having to raise the disposition at all if you don't want to.
So what do you guys think?
Is half this stuff even do able like the twin currency idea?
What do you guys want to add or see added?
Also (just curious) what were your favorite mods for Oblivion that had anything to do with economy, banks, merchants etc....?
