Immersion and you, hardcoe, survival, travel, fast travel, s

Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 6:40 am

Chance of ambush during fast travel?


yeah. It may sound like a rip from dragon age, but honestly this sounds like the simplest, funnest and easiest way to implement a deterrent for just FT everywhere. I say FT with a chance of encounter (which actually causes your character to stop somewhere along the route, forcing you to FT again to get where you were going, but with an interesting aspect of possibly stumbling upon something in the wilderness) or you can pay for a type of travel that is safer and faster.

Of course, in a perfect world the pay-only travel system would be the only system, and even then you might get attacked. It'd be cool to be traveling on a boat and have a quick ship-to-ship skirmish before moving on, or having to defend the caravan your traveling with in a random encounter.

course that could get annoying too. :/
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Bryanna Vacchiano
 
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Post » Tue Mar 29, 2011 9:52 pm

Dragon Age? It was in Fallout, too (the original).
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David John Hunter
 
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Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 12:53 am

In Morrowind, I have a level 43 dark elf with approximately 100 game days on it. I've done basically everything I can, and it is getting boring now. You're telling me you want an entire FOUR seasons with different maps for each one!?!?! I'd much rather have all of Hammerfell and Cyrodiil. Few play long enough to even see one season change.

Edit: I can't imagine that every single one of you is a console gamer. If you plan on playing Skyrim on the PC, then you have no right to complain. Mods will be out before December hits to add survival aspects. That has been the way since Morrowind.

did you read my post about seasons, there are alot of ways seasons can add to the game, not just MAPS but post processing effects on trees and even the new "dynamic snow" that may be changed to "dynamic leaves" or "dynamic rain" creating puddles of water and mud.
that is just the visual.
there are also quite a few ways that it effects the world in noticeable changes to things like npc behavior or availability of goods. i suggest you read more about seasons in the op. i wouldn't have put so much in the main post if i didn't think that it would be useful or even possible.
and also comparing it to morrowind is kinda a big leap dont you think, we already know a'lot has changed.
and I AM a pc player, i cant speak for anyone else.
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Allison Sizemore
 
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Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 1:07 pm

bump for relevance.
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Your Mum
 
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Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 6:57 am

I like to think that quests that were not available in the summer will be available in the winter and vice versa. :hubbahubba:
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Rachel Hall
 
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Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 1:08 pm

Dear Devs, If you don't implement this in the base game, at least PLEASE make an immersion DLC! So we, who choose to have it, can download it.
Thanks in advance!
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louise tagg
 
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Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 4:02 am

Dear Devs, If you don't implement this in the base game, at least PLEASE make an immersion DLC! So we, who choose to have it, can download it.
Thanks in advance!


Ha! I totally agree with this.
If they don't put this in the game (FOR WHATEVER REASON!?!?!?!?!),
then make a big immersion DLC with survival/hardcoe mode, transportation system, seasons, compass, or whatever you can come up with.
I would definitely buy it for like 10-15$.
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x a million...
 
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Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 10:24 am

Ha! I totally agree with this.
If they don't put this in the game (FOR WHATEVER REASON!?!?!?!?!),
then make a big immersion DLC with survival/hardcoe mode, transportation system, seasons, compass, or whatever you can come up with.
I would definitely buy it for like 10-15$.


They should at least be able to do that, even if none of these things are options in the first game. It would really surprise me if they didn't take a hint from New Vegas and include the kinds of immersion us hardcoe players want (and maybe even new players) just as a higher difficulty level.

On a side note, I suggest that instead of doing away with fast travel altogether, there should be a teleportation spell. It makes way more sense than having you instantaneously travel a large distance without losing health or stamina and never encountering any opposition on the way. Also, if it is a spell, or a dragon word, it could be left as a later-game spell on higher difficulties. Or it could be scaled, from teleporting to mage's guilds, to any human settlement, to any map marker, as the (alteration?) skill slowly levels up. I think that would deal with travel frustration in the late game when there are far too many scattered quests in everyone's journal, and too much valuable loot to drop.

Also, the way they described the map in the GI article, it's actually just a overhead version of the actual terrain that you can zoom in and out on and mark, like it is some kind of spell rather than a map itself. This leads me to think a compass would not be necessary, as instead you would be more likely to plot out your journey based on looking at the actual terrain and landmarks on the way. Which would be a huge improvement, matching the exploratory nature of Morrowind with the facility of Oblivion. Maybe a Prince of Persia-esque glowing trail that you plot would be better than a compass as well? I always thought that the Oblivion compass was generally obnoxious and useless to casual players anyway, since you try to look at it and go by it when there are far too many mountains and landmarks on your way, and it never considers setting paths by actual roads like in GTA IV. I'd imagine we will see some sort of improvement to the map that encourages players to actually be immersed in the world and plan their course by landmarks they can actually see, rather than squiggles on a piece of paper or an arrow with limited versatility, but we just don't know what it will be yet.

I'm going to point out that the main problem with Oblivion was not the ability to fast travel itself. It was that the immersion and sense of exploratory progression that we felt strongly in Morrowind was lost. While Morrowind certainly frustrated me at times when I had to sell off stolen loot to a crab, or find a daedra, or do a quest in the north, the main reason why the world felt so huge and it was such an adventure to explore even a short distance was due to the way you were forced to travel the entire way, using mainly the physical markers available to actually learn the lay of the land. You felt tied to the land, because you couldn't just instantly bypass it. In Oblivion, when you go on a quest you do your best to avoid foot travel. Instead of traveling from the city you are in, to the closest big city to your destination, to the closest settlement, and to each destination along the way, experiencing the environment and the distance firsthand, you simply teleport to the closest discovered location to your destination.

Where's the exploration in that? Where is the interconnectedness, in that you'd travel instantaneously to a hostile cave instead of going to the closest settlement first? There was no tie to the world and the terrain itself, because the geography was irrelevant to your actions. There was no point to having a house in more than one town since you could travel instantaneously. There was no point to learning the geography and experiencing the cohesive environment and physical beauty, when you can get to your destination instantly. Honestly, a lot of the time it felt like a hub-type design where each quest location was mostly separate, rather than an open-world game, unless you intentionally made up your mind to explore (which inevitably resulted in discovering a cave or fort, spending an hour there, and forgetting where you actually were or where you were going).

I think that Bethesda has spent far too much time on the unique geography of this game to squander the sense of exploration described in the GI article. I really, really hope they have a solution for the immersion-shattering nature of Oblivion that made it so, to this day, I have barely learned the roads or remembered the terrain types surrounding the various cities. Keeping the world cohesive and real means keeping the player's feet planted on the ground, at least for most of the time. Isn't that the point of an open-world game?
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josh evans
 
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Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 4:38 am

Maybe a Prince of Persia-esque glowing trail that you plot would be better than a compass as well?


I would really not want a glowing trail... =/
That's even worse that a quest marker I think. Since it exactly shows you the way.

I do hope though that they remove any kind of marker or thing like that from the compass. Or remove the compass completely. Or make it optional.
Just no markers or icons as in Oblivion...
Geez, I can think for myself and I do want to explore.
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Juan Cerda
 
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Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 12:47 am

Fast Travel is a big issue with me. I liked Morrowinds system then Oblivions. In MW you had to use either a silt rider, boats or the mage guild in order to get you near to your next location and the rest of the way you had to hoof it. Oblivion was really abusive and made the game shorter. Skyrim's FT should be more like MW's. :obliviongate:
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djimi
 
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Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 4:35 am

seasons could be implimented by events that happen at certain times of the year as well as simple elements like tree's changing colour and sky colour, for an average gamer point of view.
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Kelli Wolfe
 
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Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 1:26 pm

seasons could be implimented by events that happen at certain times of the year as well as simple elements like tree's changing colour and sky colour, for an average gamer point of view.


I can't imagine that working. It seems really difficult to implement. I'd rather there be variation in the terrain of each type and better graphical differences between terrain types than that. Also, I seriously doubt they will considering the http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/1717/skyrimmapls.png were labeled with "Snow," "Tundra," "Pine Forest," and "Fall Forest." I can't imagine a terrain type being Fall Forest but having the trees change color by the season. So, I am officially throwing out the possibility of seasons.

Now, weather types like rain, snow, blizzard, freezing rain, clouds, wind, and lightning: that I am up for speculating on. Imagine if you had a chance of getting hit by lightning? Or if freezing rain or wind could give you cold damage? Mudslides? I remember how awesome sandstorms were, and I can only hope for something nearly that awesome.
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Lawrence Armijo
 
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Post » Tue Mar 29, 2011 11:43 pm

Very nice thread Senju.
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X(S.a.R.a.H)X
 
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Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 10:50 am

As the updates over the course of the next few weeks will discuss in-game mechanics, I have a feeling we'll find out very soon whether there will be any "hardcoe/survival" type mode incorporating eating/drinking/sleeping in an immersive way.

I think this will be the case, perhaps a small mod will be needed to tweak the time cycle and merchant prices to make this a bit more challenging.

If this is not included in vanilla Skyrim, I'm not worried, I'm sure the modding community will craft some great survival mods pretty quickly. I do know that after playing New Vegas in this way and now Oblivion with Real Sleep Extended, Real Hunger and Real Thirst, I'm hooked on this sort of RPG game play and the RPGs without these sorts of mods available simply don't cut it for me anymore.

As far as fast travel goes, it's already confirmed to be in Skyrim and I'm confident I will be able to avoid using it simply by not clicking on the map markers.
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Clea Jamerson
 
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Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:31 am

I voted for all the hardcoe options. You forgot squatting in the woods though. :P
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Elina
 
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Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 5:31 am

The hardcoe mode should be there for those who want it as I do, the fast travel should be like Morrowinds with carriages replacing the silt striders, (unless there is a unique creature native to Skyrim capable of long distance travel) and the mages guild teleportation also everybody seems to forget the mark and recall spells and the scrolls of almsivi intervention and divine intervention that teleport you to the temples and churchs. I would like to see items of a similar nature and I really want mark and recall back. It would be nice to eat,drink and sleep too. Encumbrance was always in the game so why on earth remove it...
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Benji
 
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Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 8:51 am

The hardcoe mode should be there for those who want it as I do, the fast travel should be like Morrowinds with carriages replacing the silt striders, (unless there is a unique creature native to Skyrim capable of long distance travel) and the mages guild teleportation also everybody seems to forget the mark and recall spells and the scrolls of almsivi intervention and divine intervention that teleport you to the temples and churchs. I would like to see items of a similar nature and I really want mark and recall back. It would be nice to eat,drink and sleep too. Encumbrance was always in the game so why on earth remove it...

mammoths :shrug:
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meg knight
 
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Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 9:57 am

...and I really want mark and recall back.


I have a number of Oblivion mods installed and there are some mark and recall spells available for purchase from merchants, but I have no idea how to use them. Can you elaborate on how they worked in Morrowind? Do I just cast the spell in one location and then cast it again if I want to go back there?
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Louise Andrew
 
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Post » Tue Mar 29, 2011 9:52 pm

I have a number of Oblivion mods installed and there are some mark and recall spells available for purchase from merchants, but I have no idea how to use them. Can you elaborate?

Well in Morrowind you cast a mark spell at some location leave it and recall brings you back to your marked location: its really useful to transport you right out of a dungeon to your house to store your gear and loot it s also usefull to transport you to a shop to sell your loot. Also I play on the Xbox 360 so no mods for me...
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MISS KEEP UR
 
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Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 3:19 am

Well in Morrowind you cast a mark spell at some location leave it and recall brings you back to your marked location: its really useful to transport you right out of a dungeon to your house to store your gear and loot it s also usefull to transport you to a shop to sell your loot. Also I play on the Xbox 360 so no mods for me...

^this^
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Mariana
 
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Post » Tue Mar 29, 2011 10:43 pm

When it comes to the compass and map, I think we should buy or discover land parts ourselves.. like Terra Incognita .. It would tripple the replay value and give us a good reason for exploring
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Chloe Lou
 
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Post » Tue Mar 29, 2011 10:08 pm

mammoths :shrug:

:icecream: love the idea, reminds me of Sokal's Syberia and I love your avatar too :thumbsup:
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BethanyRhain
 
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Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 7:16 am

I'm really happy to see this in Skyrim.

I'm a newly found survivalist myself and I thought about how much id love to learn cooking and skinning mining and such gathering plants and shelter too! But, the problem is seasons would tie into all of this from the plants you would gather to the animals you would kill.

I'M so hoping that in this new TES we will have such a deep and immersive system.
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jasminε
 
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Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 6:52 am

I'm really happy to see this in Skyrim.

I'm a newly found survivalist myself and I thought about how much id love to learn cooking and skinning mining and such gathering plants and shelter too! But, the problem is seasons would tie into all of this from the plants you would gather to the animals you would kill.

I'M so hoping that in this new TES we will have such a deep and immersive system.

I am in total agreement with you, I think if we choose we should be able to enable a setting that would force us to survive and the like to draw us deeper in, its a fantasy help us live it a little more than we already do.
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SEXY QUEEN
 
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Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:39 am

:icecream: love the idea, reminds me of Sokal's Syberia and I love your avatar too :thumbsup:

thanks, its saint nerevars symbol, from morrowind. moon and star.
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Amber Hubbard
 
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